Wartime use of primer in British factories

Sometimes you find matches where you’re not expecting them. Had some aluminium honeycomb that came out of the Kawasaki aircraft plant in Japan a few years back. The green coating on it was a dead nuts match for what was used on Jap planes in WWII..

Paint colours.

I seem to recollect that the earlier zinc chromates were a much yellower colour.

NA 337 rear fuselage and rear bay areas were not painted, they were bare metal, but we elected to paint them aluminum. The interiors of the wings were finished a greenish colour, might have been a zinc chromate.

Original paint in the Cockpit area? I cannot say, I did not work on that end! They are greenish right now.

During the recovery of Stirling N3654 we found that the interior was painted (not sprayed) with a yellow primer. But recoveries of Halifax and Lancaster wrecks over the years showed that the interior colour was painted directly onto the bare aluminium.

Hi Cees,

Just to pick up on the question about yellow primer on the Short Stirling – it is possible this was a technique only used by Short Brothers, since they were more accustomed to corrosion proofing seaplanes. Or possibly, since N3654 was an early Stirling, the Air Ministry might have relaxed their specifications later in the war.

I have an article on Flying Boat construction (Aircraft Engineering August 1939) which states that:

“The Military machines [Sunderlands] are protected by an elaborate Air Ministry scheme. All the parts are anodised, assembled with barium-chromate paint between joints and further sprayed inside and outside with Ryland’s 1142 zinc-chromate paint. In the final stages of erection, the external surfaces are sprayed with a green priming coat before the final painting.”

Curiously the Empire boats were corrosion proofed by anodising and then coating with lanoline.

If this level of martime-style corrosion protection was extended to the Stirling production lines it would have made any survivors easier to conserve – oh cruel irony.

Allan

.. & it just so happens that my step brother has a paint factory at Eastleigh (tenuous aviation link…) that I think makes the stuff.. have a look for Akron Paints. If he has it, he’l mix up any amount to any colour (that’s his paint on Ford Transits).

It,s easy being green

Yep the Army Aviation workshops here have an epoxy primer that is a rough match for British cockpit green.Tough as nails to boot.

Simple solution:
Use an epoxy primer the same colour (RAF Moss Green?) as the paint. At least then it won’t matter if the top coat wears thru… & epoxy sticks like sh*t to a blanket…

I don’t know much about any of this, but aren’t there any kinds of clear protective coats that can be used on bare metal? Apply that for the protection, paint your interior green over it, then the metal is protected, and the eventual worn edges will still look authentic?! :confused:

I have run across a number of military equipment pieces that were primed, but not top-coated.

Most commonly, they were one of the following:
zinc chromate primer, yellow
zinc chromate primer, red oxide
zinc oxide primer, olive green

Stuart is right – the paint was formulated such that it could be directly applied to the metal. Modern paints arent, and you will just end up with the paint flaking off.

Use a good aerospace primer, and then paint your chosen colour. No-one will be any the wiser if you do it right!

Bruce

Thanks chaps,

Ok, so primer first and then the interior colour it is.

Cheers

Cees

Just thought I’d mention that in some cases there was no primer or interior painting at all, an example being TFC’s Spit Mk.IX project (RK858) that was recovered from Russia in the early nineties.

http://www.fighter-collection.com/pages/aircraft/spit_ix_2/index.php

Obviously it’s necessary for you to paint your components Cees, so it’s not exactly helpful, but I thought it was an interesting nugget all the same. 😀

Stuart is right – the paint was formulated such that it could be directly applied to the metal. Modern paints arent, and you will just end up with the paint flaking off.

Use a good aerospace primer, and then paint your chosen colour. No-one will be any the wiser if you do it right!

Bruce

Its possible that the “cockpit green” was a primer in itself.

Hi Dave,

Yes that’s the problem. First is to make the cockpit as authentic as possible but over the years the paint can be worn away and then reveal the primer underneath which would look rather odd compared to an unrestored museum example. But on the other hand preservation would be important as well.

But as most restorations these days also use primer first, I think tha’t’s the way to go. Mental note: taking ones shoes off before entering cockpit.:p

Cheers

Cees

Hi Cees

My experience of working with these wartime parts, has also shown the absence of primer in many cases. The top coat was painted directly onto the aluminium. Just look at a lot of photos of cockpits of the time, and you will see a lot of flaky paint on vunerable edges!

For the sake of your project though, I would use an etch primer, and give it the best chance of longevity you can. Remember these old aircraft were never expected to be used for 60+ years. A few months life for some aircraft would have been a lot at the time, so priming components first would have seemed un-necessary in some cases.

Most of the guys who worked on R-Robert at Brooklands were ex-Vickers wartime employees. It could be that some of them are still helping at the museum. That might be a good place to start.

Moggy