F-4 Phantom

The version in your picture is a Turkish air force F4E not a naval version, but there are plenty of cutaways and essentially the fuselage is the same except for noses and few other little things but nothing major.

curlyboy

Why I never saw Cutaway of navy vertion phantom? I think I have had most of military aircraft anatomy drawing.

The actual upgrade was not stupid but how it was handled was, as i said the upgrade was supposed to be completed in the mid 1970’s but was not completed until the early 80’s and by then the aircraft involved had all had 5 or 6 more years of service put on them than they should have had.

This was also partly due to the carrier borne F111 (that led to the F14) and its waste of time and money that could have gone on faster upgrading of the F4J’s or even a quicker in service date for the F14, Also the air force had tried to push the F111 as a phantom replacement (in as much as it could do most roles like the F4) and could only try to justify the massive costs of the F111 if it could get another service to use it or call it a jack of all trades (which it was not).

The actual upgrade to the S model just took too long to complete and was of only limited use when it did get to the fleet, granted the USN and USMC used the S models for about 10 years as has been said but they were never in a first line capacity as the last USN F4 trap on a carrier was in 1986 and after that they were used in training, testing and other definately second line duties.

curlyboy

Yes the slats on the wings and the front of the intakes on both sides sport long blisters for electronics and that is about all.

It was essentially a way to get more bang for your buck from an already ageing airframe, stupid really as the F/A 18 was about to come on stream and would replace the phantoms & corsairs etc anyway.

curlyboy

Bit hard to call the Phantom upgrade “stupid” isnt it? Need I say more?

Auxiliary Air Intakes for the Engines, is what those doors are.

I think (i might be wrong) they are either maintenace hatches or some later versions of the phantom had doors under the front of the engine for checking for foreign objects.

But i have never seen photos of them like especially not in flight ?

curlyboy

Hello:
I need you guys to teach me what’s this hood use for?
:confused:

Apparently you didn’t bother to read what I posted… because it DID mention that.
“Because of delays, these slats were not initially fitted to the first 43 F-4Ss, but they were later retrofitted.” “First to get the F-4S was VMFA-451, which began to receive unslatted planes in June of 1978.”

Here is the source list for what I posted [note what #2 is]:

Sources:

1. McDonnell Douglas Aircraft Since 1920: Volume II, Rene J. Francillon, Naval Institute Press, 1990.

2. McDonnell F-4 Phantom: Spirit in the Skies. Airtime Publishing, 1992.

3. Modern Air Combat, Bill Gunston and Mike Spick, Crescent, 1983.

4. The American Fighter, Enzo Angelucci and Peter Bowers, Orion, 1987.

5. United States Military Aircraft Since 1909, Gordon Swanborough and Peter M. Bowers, Smithsonian, 1989.

6. The Illustrated Encyclopedia of Aircraft Armament, Bill Gunston, Orion, 1988.

Joe Baugher used the same book to write the article I quoted as you are quoting!

Additionally, your time-frame on the F/A-18 is off, “by the time it had come on stream the front line units were already recieveing the F4s replacements.” is out by a few years:

First to get the F-4S was VMFA-451, which began to receive unslatted planes in June of 1978.

The first Navy squadron to receive the F-4S was VF-21, based at NAS Miramar in California, which began to receive its planes in December 1979.

The first production Hornet took off on its maiden flight in April of 1980.

The first production F/A-18 was delivered to the Navy in May 1980.

The Hornet was initially to be issued to training and fleet replacement squadrons (FRS), starting with VFA-125 “Rough Riders” which was commissioned as a FRS at NAS Lemoore, California on November 13, 1980. The first Hornets were issued to this squadron three months later.

In this role, they were later joined by an Atlantic Fleet FRS, VFA-106 “Gladiators” based at NAS Cecil Field in Florida and by a Marine Training Squadron, VMFAT-101 “Sharpshooters” at MCAS El Toro in California.

The Marine Corps was actually ahead of the Navy in getting the Hornet into actual operational service. The first operational units to convert to the Hornet were VMFA-314 “Black Knights” and VMFA-323, both based at El Toro, California. They received their first Hornets in January and March 1983 respectively.

The Navy received its first operational Hornets later in 1983. Navy squadrons VA-113 and VA-25 at NAS Lemoore converted from A-7Es to Hornets in the fall of 1983, being redesignated VFA-113 and VFA-25 respectively.

So, the first production Hornet (which was the replacement for both the F-4 and A-7) first flight was 5 months after the USN started getting their F-4Ss (Jan. ’79) and 22 months after the USMC started receiving deliveries (June ’78)… and again, it was 4 1/2 years after the USMC got their first F-4Ss that the first 2 Hornet combat squadrons anywhere got their aircraft.

Also, if a full-scale war had erupted in late 1984, the Hornet would have not participated, as the entire fleet had been grounded for structural defects!

With increased service experience, an unexpected problem appeared. It turned out that the Hornet was flown more than initially anticipated in the high angle of attack regime, where aerodynamic loads on the tail from turbulent air generated by the LERX were particularly severe, resulting in fatigue-related cracks in the tail area. The F/A-18 fleet was grounded for a brief time in late 1984 while a fix was developed.

Now it really looks like that “stupid modernization program” was a good idea!

Unfortunately the upgrade for the F4J was supposed to happen in the mid1970s as it was intended to be a stop gap between the Marines getting the F/A 18 and the Navy getting the F14 but by the time it had come on stream the front line units were already recieveing the F4s replacements.

The thing with the S was that the selected aircraft were completely stripped and inspected then re-engined and upgraded but one little correction from above not ALL the S models had slats the first 47 aircraft did not have them to save time and the rest were modified later to get aircraft in service quicker.

Or just buy Jon Lakes book ‘Spirit in the skies’ as it has everything you ever wanted to know about the F4 and more.

curlyboy

So having an improved version of your primary fighter for 14 years, as the USMC had, is stupid, eh? With what is claimed as a 50% increase in dogfighting maneuverability?

The USMC received its first F/A-18s 4 1/2 years after the upgraded F-4s entered service… and still used those “stupid upgraded Phantoms” for 10 more years after that. Stupid, huh?

Of course, the fact that the USN/USMC planners had to allow for the possibility that those “stupid upgraded Phantoms” might be called into combat before they could be replaced was also due to their “stupidity”, right?

After all, any halfway intelligent person should have KNOWN that 1980-1990 would be safe from major conflict, with only a couple of minor skirmishes, right?

Yes the slats on the wings and the front of the intakes on both sides sport long blisters for electronics and that is about all.

It was essentially a way to get more bang for your buck from an already ageing airframe, stupid really as the F/A 18 was about to come on stream and would replace the phantoms & corsairs etc anyway.

curlyboy

Thanks for the replies, So it is essentially the slats at the front of the wing that are the main difference visually the rest was all internal upgrades.

Richard

I you want to see them in the flesh there is:

An F4J (uk) in the American Air Museum at duxford.

Link: http://aam.iwm.org.uk/server/show/ConWebDoc.1139

And an F4S at the Museum of Flight, east fortune.

Link: www.rampantscotland.com/visit/blvisit_museum16.htm

curlyboy

Joe Baugher has pretty in-depth write-ups on the different models of a lot of US combat aircraft on his site:
http://home.att.net/~jbaugher/uscombataircraft.html

here is the link to the F-4 Phantom… just click on the model you want to read about:
http://home.att.net/~jbaugher1/f4.html

here is the entry on the F-4S:

F-4S was the designation applied to 265 (some sources say 248) F-4Js which were upgraded in the mid-1970s. This program was analogous to the Bee Line project in which Navy F-4Bs were upgraded to F-4N standards. The major goal of the upgrade was to prolong the life of the F-4J so that it could remain in service until replaced by the F/A-18 Hornet in Marine Corps service and by the F-14 Tomcat in Navy service.

Major changes included airframe and undercarriage strengthening. The aircraft were stripped and carefully inspected, and where necessary they received landing gear and wing/fuselage structural improvements. Visible external straps were added to the wing spar to improve the structural integrity. The electrical system was completely rewired, and the hydraulic system was replumbed using stainless steel tubing.

In order to improve the maneuverability, two-position wing leading-edge maneuvering slats were fitted to the F-4S, which gave a 50 percent improvement in combat turning capability in comparison with an unslatted F-4J. These slats operated automatically as a function of angle of attack, but they could be overridden from the cockpit. The slats came in two sections, one on the outboard part of the fixed inner wing and the other on the folding outer wing panel. Because of delays, these slats were not initially fitted to the first 43 F-4Ss, but they were later retrofitted.

The F-4S was fitted with the digital AWG-10B weapons control system with new AN/ARC-159 dual UHF radios and an ARN-118 TACAN (but not to all F-4Ss). The ALQ-126 or 126A deceptive electronic countermeasures set of the F-4J was retained, with the same short intake antennae fairings. One way that the F-4S could be externally distinguished from the earlier F-4N was by the shorter upper intake fairings of the S.

One of the persistent problems with the Phantom was that it tended to leave a rather prominent trail of sooty black smoke behind it, making it more readily visible to an enemy. In order to correct this problem, the F-4S was fitted with smokeless J79-GE-10B engines with low smoke combustors and low-energy ignition. This same engine was also fitted to some F-4Js.

Low-voltage formation lights were fitted to the sides of the nose, mid-fuselage, and tailfin, and staggered cooling ports were fitted near the nosewheel well.

The first F-4S modification (F-4J BuNo 158360) took off on its maiden flight on July 22, 1977. The first F-4S delivered with leading edge slats from the start was 155899, which first appeared in November of 1979.

First to get the F-4S was VMFA-451, which began to receive unslatted planes in June of 1978. The following Marine Corps units operated the F-4S:

VFMA-112, VFMA-115, VFMA-111, VFMA-134, VFMA-212, VFMA-232, VFMA-235, VFMA-251, VFMA-312, VFMA-321, VFMA-333, VFMA-451, and VFMAT-101.

The first Navy squadron to receive the F-4S was VF-21, based at NAS Miramar in California, which began to receive its planes in December 1979. The following Navy units eventually received F-4Ss:

Atlantic Fleet:

VF-74, VF-171

Pacific Fleet:

VF-21, VF-121, VF-151, VF-154, VF-161

Naval Reserve:

VF-201, VF-202, VF-301, VF-302.

Air Development:

VX-4

The last {USN} F-4S was retired by VF-202 from NAS Dallas on May 14, 1987 (BuNo 155560), becoming the Navy’s last tactical Phantom II.

In January of 1992, VMFA-112 retired the last F-4S from the US Sea Service inventory {USMC}.

So, the USN operated the F-4S for just over 7 years, while the USMC used them for just over 14.

An earlier similar, but lesser upgrade of the F-4B produced the F-4N:

By 1970, the Navy was beginning to be concerned about the condition of its fleet of F-4Bs, many of which were over ten years old and showing signs of old age and fatigue. In that year, a program named Bee Line was initiated in which F-4Bs were refurbished and modernized. Ultimately, 228 Navy F-4Bs went through the Bee Line program. These refurbished planes were redesignated F-4N.

The first mods from J to S included ;

fitting of leading edge slats, structural strngthening to extend life of airframe, and low smoke engines no doubt some electronic tweaking involved but if they told anyone they would have probably had to kill them !

I thank you !:)

The F-4S was essentially an updated refurbished and slatted F-4J, and had a very short career with active-duty fighter squadrons, soon being replace by F-14s.

This was taken from a book titled – McDonnell F-4 Phantom – Spirit in the Skies. Edited by Jon Lake and David Donald. It really is an awesome book – well worth adding to the collection:)