July 17, 2006 at 11:16 pm
I have a reference in notes from a WW2 manuscript that refers to one of two Czech or Polish pilots who died in a beat up of an RAF airfield “somewhere in England” in 1941(?). According to my info, the two sergeant pilots dropped in on a neighbouring squadron but were refused entry to the Officers’ Mess for lunch. Furious at the snub, they took off in thier Hurricanes and made a low-level pass but one pilot clipped a hangar and was killed.
Any details anyone?
By: Malcolm McKay - 19th July 2006 at 13:37
The handbook for the Supermarine Stranraer notes a curtain which (rough wording) is to be “hung between the officer’s and the airmen’s quarters in the aircraft when operating away from base.”
Probably to hide the fact that the sergeants were notably better at scrounging the best tucker. 😀
By: VoyTech - 19th July 2006 at 13:21
There are two cases there that could possibly link with this story, as Czech NCO pilots were killed in accidents caused by ‘unauthorised low level aerobatics’. Oddly, both were in 32 Sqn RAF:
Sgt Vaclav Skrivanek in V6988 at Bournemouth on 21.2.41
Sgt Vladimir Kyselo in V7057 at Ibsley on 9.3.41
Over to Hurricane of Czechoslovak AF experts.
By: VoyTech - 19th July 2006 at 13:20
There is also a Czech book published recently, which lists all the incidents and accidents involving personnel of the Czechoslovak Air Force in Britain where aircraft were damaged/destroyed and/or personnel injured/wounded/killed.
By: VoyTech - 19th July 2006 at 13:18
I happened to be a member of the team that did the book, and was mostly responsible for Polish fighter losses.
When I said, in short, that there was no such fatality in the Polish Air Force in 1941-1942, I meant that of all the Polish non-commissioned officers killed in Hurricanes in Britain during 1941-42 nine were lost in sea, one flew into high ground, one was a victim of a mid-air explosion on a ferry flight, and one dived into ground from high altitude (probably oxygen failure).
By: VoyTech - 19th July 2006 at 13:18
I hope you will excuse me, gentlemen, if I go back to the topic.
Because something’s not documented doesn’t mean it didn’t happen.
Of course, nothing is impossible, but some things are less probable than other.
Incidentally, a book has just been published that lists all fatalities (over 2,000) of the Polish Air Force in WWII. The book is pretty comprehensive (ca. 600 pages A4 size) and provides info on circumstances of all the losses.
By: JDK - 19th July 2006 at 11:19
The handbook for the Supermarine Stranraer notes a curtain which (rough wording) is to be “hung between the officer’s and the airmen’s quarters in the aircraft when operating away from base.”
The Canadians though this risible when they built them.
In the Battle of France on at least a couple of occasions RAF Sgt fighter pilots weren’t told where they were going, just to ‘follow the officers’.
By: QldSpitty - 19th July 2006 at 10:41
In regard to feelings between Aussie pilots and what not,in the Pacific theatre the pilots frequently became friends with groundcrew as they knew they were the ones breaking their backs keeping the planes in the air.Sorry to go OT,but showing off was common in regard to 18 year olds in high performance planes.The CO,s put a dim view on it as many planes were bingled by hairbrained louts.One reason Pilot Prune became so popular(the issue,not the person).
By: JDK - 18th July 2006 at 13:42
Can you give a bit more information? If VoyTech says ‘no’ he’s right, as far as human effort can tell 😉 so we need look further afield.
By: Beetle2 - 18th July 2006 at 12:49
There was certainly some feeling among pilots about the divide between officer pilots and nco,s (especially among the Canadians, Australians and New Zealanders) and the Czech’s were part of this too. My info was from a groundcrew source and the word “(Polish?)” was pencilled in the margin with Czech as the original pilot. The date could have been out as it was not from a diary.
By: DazDaMan - 18th July 2006 at 12:39
Anyway, why would sergeants be furious that they were not allowed entry into the Officer’s Mess.
If I recall correctly, there was a lot of “snobbery” when it came to officers and sergeants. There was a Channel 4 doco on that very subject a few years ago, but the part I recall was one former pilot recounting how all the pilots in his unit slept in one long hut, but there was a curtain dividing the room in two. And another pilot told of an inexperienced Pilot Officer being very indignant about being led by a sergeant pilot – even though the sergeant was vastly more experienced.
By: JDK - 18th July 2006 at 10:18
There was no such fatality in the Polish Air Force in 1941-1942.
..recorded as such, or mentioned. Because something’s not documented doesn’t mean it didn’t happen.
But I agree with VoyTech – highly unlikely.
By: VoyTech - 18th July 2006 at 09:50
There was no such fatality in the Polish Air Force in 1941-1942. Anyway, why would sergeants be furious that they were not allowed entry into the Officer’s Mess.