First supersonic aircraft to takeoff and land

Alot of these speed records set by America are a bit of a cheat don’t you think! I mean Rocket power V Jet… :rolleyes:

‘Thank you, do I leave through here…’ 😮

FD2 set official FIA record with 2 way run in opposite directions over a measured distance within a limited time. X1 and other X planes the speed recorded was peak velocity and the aircraft could not met the FIA regs.

Alot of these speed records set by America are a bit of a cheat don’t you think! I mean Rocket power V Jet… :rolleyes:

‘Thank you, do I leave through here…’ 😮

Absolutely. And machine guns are not a gentlemanly way to wage war, and these submarine-boats are only fit for pirates!

I do think that a distinction should be made between aircraft like the FD2 and the X1A though – the former was a proper aircraft which could take off and land under its own power and could manouevre adequately, even well, throughout the performance envelope. The X-planes were only built for going huge speeds in a straight line, had to be carried to their operational altitude and had run out of fuel by the time they landed. Not much use for anything other than breaking records.

I think that is the point of this thread isn’t it? The first ‘proper’ aircraft to go supersonic, research and production – I think we have to mean ‘officially’ as well which rules out dubious Me262 claims and plausible, if uncorroborated, XP-86 claims. Which I believe still leads to the XP-86 on both production and research counts, though I would have to check to be sure that the DH108 didn’t sneak ahead of it. The DH108 is still credited in some quarters as the first jet to break the sound barrier.

Of the production aircraft, not experimentals, it is probaly a toss up between the prototype F100 and the Mig17. Both had similar performance with the edge of manoeverability going to the Mig17.

MiG-17 wasn’t supersonic, that was the MiG-19.

Incidentally, though the FD2 was the first aircraft to take the record through 1000mph, the first aircraft to exceed that speed in a straight line was either the Bell X1A or the Douglas Skyrocket, I forget which. I wonder if either of them could have displayed the necessary manouevrability at that speed to have flown the FAI record course though?

Alot of these speed records set by America are a bit of a cheat don’t you think! I mean Rocket power V Jet… :rolleyes:

‘Thank you, do I leave through here…’ 😮

🙂

Fairey Delta 2 (FD2)

The FD2 was the first aircraft to exceed 1,000 mph in level flight.

In the late 1940s Britain was trailing far behind in supersonic aircraft design. To try to rectify matters the Ministry of Supply issued a specification for a supersonic research aircraft to investigate flight and control at transonic and supersonic speeds.
The FD2 was a single-seat, delta-winged aircraft powered by a Rolls-Royce Avon engine with an afterburner. To improve the pilot’s forward view during landing, taxiing and take-off, the cockpit and nose section could be hinged downwards by ten degrees, a feature later used on the Concorde.

There were two FD2 aircraft built. The first FD2 #WG774 was flown on it’s on its maiden flight by Lt Cdr Peter Twiss on 6 Oct 1954. On the 10 Mar 1956 Twiss set a new World Absolute Speed Record of 1820kph (1132mph) between Ford and Chichester in Sussex, UK.

This beat the old record by more than 300mph which was quite an achievement considering the old record had only been set the previous year by an American F100 Super Sabre.

Interesting Fact: The Fairey Marine Motor Cruisers company manufactured boats called the Huntress and the Huntsman 28. These were used in the James Bond movie From Russia with Love. The ‘bad guys’ boat was driven by Peter Twiss, driving one of the other boats was former Fairey Marine sales director Charles Currey.

Huraah… 😉

I met Mr. Twiss at an event at the FAA museum earlier this year, what a fantastic gent. Sounds like flying the FD2 through the course was like trying to thread a needle at near-Mach 2, but Twiss did it and made it sound easy! It’s still the biggest margin the record has been increased by – astonishing given how recently the previous record was set.

Incidentally, though the FD2 was the first aircraft to take the record through 1000mph, the first aircraft to exceed that speed in a straight line was either the Bell X1A or the Douglas Skyrocket, I forget which. I wonder if either of them could have displayed the necessary manouevrability at that speed to have flown the FAI record course though?

A straight ‘Copy & Paste’

🙂

Fairey Delta 2 (FD2)

The FD2 was the first aircraft to exceed 1,000 mph in level flight.

In the late 1940s Britain was trailing far behind in supersonic aircraft design. To try to rectify matters the Ministry of Supply issued a specification for a supersonic research aircraft to investigate flight and control at transonic and supersonic speeds.
The FD2 was a single-seat, delta-winged aircraft powered by a Rolls-Royce Avon engine with an afterburner. To improve the pilot’s forward view during landing, taxiing and take-off, the cockpit and nose section could be hinged downwards by ten degrees, a feature later used on the Concorde.

There were two FD2 aircraft built. The first FD2 #WG774 was flown on it’s on its maiden flight by Lt Cdr Peter Twiss on 6 Oct 1954. On the 10 Mar 1956 Twiss set a new World Absolute Speed Record of 1820kph (1132mph) between Ford and Chichester in Sussex, UK.

This beat the old record by more than 300mph which was quite an achievement considering the old record had only been set the previous year by an American F100 Super Sabre.

Interesting Fact: The Fairey Marine Motor Cruisers company manufactured boats called the Huntress and the Huntsman 28. These were used in the James Bond movie From Russia with Love. The ‘bad guys’ boat was driven by Peter Twiss, driving one of the other boats was former Fairey Marine sales director Charles Currey.

Huraah… 😉

BigVerne.
Wasn’t the radar unit and Oerlikon system based at Waddington for a while, I seem to remember driving by in the 80’s and seeing it being used in an exercise, we got out of my old MG and watched the fun, probably about 1988, when I try to think of why I was passing, had just surveyed a store in Hull and, on the way home, went on a grand tour of Lincolnshire air bases, via the Humber bridge. Unfortunately it was so foggy that the Binbrook Lightnings were’nt flying that day, the Cottesmore Tornadoes were, superior systems I guess.
Judging by some of the attention we recieved that day, word had got around the system about the mysterious MGB that was stalking all the Lincolnshire airbases.

by 1948 the XP-86 hadn’t topped Mach 0.937 if it helps

I read somewhere recently that the XP-86 officially went supersonic a little after Yeager did (i.e. days). Can’t remember the source, sorry, so would need checking out. BTW ‘Sound Barrier’ by Neville Duke suggests that R. Beamont was the first Briton to break the sound barrier and did so in the XP-86, but confusingly, the date given for this is after John Derry went supersonic in the DH108.

RIP Scott Crossfield.

Reminds me of how the British SAS are using those 2 ex-Argentinian Agusta A109 choppers for their missions. 😉

Not any more they’re not – they have bought 6 replacement A109s from Sloane Helicopters – amusingly they have a full ECM fit, so when they go back for servicing these mysterious black boxes are removed – so the Sloane chaps have an incomplete aircraft to fault-find crazy! :rolleyes:

Roger – yes Harvard prop tips do go supersonic – hence the racket (so does the Stearman)

TT

by 1948 the XP-86 hadn’t topped Mach 0.937 if it helps

Battle of the X-Planes

Hey all

Just thought I’d throw this in because it’s somewhat related to the subject. During the competion for the new Joint Strike Fighter one of the criteria was a short take off followed by a supersonic run and the return to a verticle landing. The XF-35 now on display at the Udvar-Hazy museum was the first and only aircraft so far to achieve this.

Reminds me of how the British SAS are using those 2 ex-Argentinian Agusta A109 choppers for their missions. 😉

It was a ‘Shrike’ anti targetting radar missile that hung up despite numerous, and vigourous, attempts to get rid. There’s an account on www.thunder-and-lightnings.co.uk – several of the Shrike missions didn’t result in any target being destroyed but forced the Argentinians to swtich the radar off, therefore giving more freedom to the SHARs on bombing missions.

Not sure about the supersonic bit, but that would have been one hell of a sonic boom.

Vulcan never went supersoinc on that mission.

The Vulcan was XM597 on a Black Buck Op on 3rd June 1982 – Weapon load. 4 Shrike missiles. 2 with radar heads optimized against the TPS 43 radar (the primary target), and 2 with heads programmed for opportunity attacks against mobile Sky Guard/Super Oerlikon AAA installations protecting the environs of Port Stanley. The Vulcan was unable to engage the TPS 43 which the Argentines had left switched off, however launched the other two at a Skyguard, one of which successfully destroyed the radar and killed 4 radar operators. After breaking the probe on the return leg refuelling, the crew elected to climb to 43,000 ft for best endurance performance and headed towards Brazil. Before entering Brazilian airspace the Shrikes had to be fired (there being no ejection system), one missile misfired. After de- pressurising at 43,000 ft and jettisoning secret documents through the crew entrance door, the aircraft cruise descended to around 20,000 ft whilst evading a pair of Brazilian fighter aircraft which had been scrambled to intercept it. Very low fuel resulted in the Vulcan to the flying into overhead of Rio’s Galeao International Airport, where it commenced a spiral descent and visual approach. The aircraft was landed with only a few hundred pounds remaining in the tanks. Brazilian released the aircraft after a few days. But kept the missile. TPS 43 had been attacked a few days before by the same Vulcan and one of the Shrikes had exploded 10 meters away from the radar, slightly damaging it. The radar was taken as war booty and put into service with the RAF by 144 Signals Unit, TCW and 1 ACC as the Radar Type 99. I think it was scrapped in the late 1990’s on Cyprus. (I’ve seen the Vulcan and been inside the radar when TCW were operating it).

Just another point when the RAF went to Westinghouse for spares and the tech manuals for the TPS 43, Westinghouse turned round and asked, ‘Sure we will supply them, as long as you pay us for the radar , because the Argentines haven’t’.

XM597 now at East Fortune with two shrike mission markings and a Brazil flag on the side.

I’m pretty sure I read somewhere, that it is impossible for a prop driven aircraft to go supersonic.
Something about the propeller arc creating drag after a certain speed.

Not so!!, On the 27 June 1953 Capt. John M. ‘Fitz’ Fitzpatrick took the XF-88B through the sound barrier.

The XF-88B was an experimental plane based on the F101 Voodoo and was fitted with two J34 jet engnes with afterburner for conventional flight and in the nose was fitted an Allison XT38 turboprop engine.

Due to the ‘tri motor’ configuration fuel load dictated sortie times of around twenty minutes and the propellor was only used to sustain flight once the jets had got the plane up to high subsonc speed.

That said as far as I know it is the only propellor driven aircraft that has documented evidence of breaking the sound barrier, eventually reality kicked in and everyone saw the pointlessness of the excersize and the project was abandoned and the airframe scrapped.

John.

The Right Stuff

Legendary Test Pilot Scott Crossfield was found dead in his crashed airplane
today.
He was 84.
He will be missed.

Planeguy51

That is a great story.
The Vulcan definitely looks like it could go supersonic.

Interestingly enough, I read a USAF bigwig said of the Vulcan

“Only the British could build an aircraft with so much power yet couldn’t go supersonic”

Its in the Ian Allan Vulcan book – I will have to dig it out sometime.

First Supersonic Bomber

OK, so what about the first supersonic, multi-engined true bomber, The Hustler perhaps, bit of a leap forward if so.

You may be right.
The TSR2 came a few years later.

PLANEGUY51

XF-86 did it before the X-1, take-off and landing under its own power:
http://home.att.net/~historyzone/Welch2.html

Well they tell it convincingly, but I remain to be convinced that an aircraft with controls based on the same system as a Mustang (i.e. wires) and no all-flying tail surfaces could be controlled through a Mach 1+ dive, let alone pull up at Mach 1 while pulling 4g.

OK, so what about the first supersonic, multi-engined true bomber, The Hustler perhaps, bit of a leap forward if so.

XF-86 did it before the X-1, take-off and landing under its own power:
http://home.att.net/~historyzone/Welch2.html