Spain orders 4 BAM "Frigates" and 5th F100 Aegis Frigate!

What are they getting for the $1.4bl.? The 4 BAM ships plus the F100? Surely not. We are paying $8bn for 3 F100 (if they are selected) for the RAN. 😮

well $US1.4 billion is about $A1.9billion. THe AWD program is $A6billion I think not $A8billion and it includes the full program costs including the costs of production over here not just the drive away cost of the ships.

Daniel

It does seem a little odd doesn’t it!

What are they getting for the $1.4bl.? The 4 BAM ships plus the F100? Surely not. We are paying $8bn for 3 F100 (if they are selected) for the RAN. 😮

Well it seems to be the way these days, Corvette sized vessels undertaking patrol duties.

I like the looks of this ship but is it practicle? I know they will base a couple in the Canaries and a couple will run around the base of the country around Gibralta protecting the enterance to the Med from their side.

I actually see a market for these vessels, who knows, Chile might buy them and so might Argentina.

No, they are completely out of scale then. I think they mentioned 20 or 30mm.

Interesting. Not very pretty though. But must be a sizeable ship, if those gun mounts are what I think they are (127mm Oto Melara, as used on LCF)

Thanks E, that’s the one I mean. Looks slightly bigger though.

That is indeed true, the Dutch have shown their concept of a patrol vessel in a Defence Paper and it looked BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAD (and certainly when you consider that everyone expected the Sigma), it even had coast guard type of stripes on its hull. It’s weaponry was some 30mm cannon and a helicopter, pretty silly… But on the other hand indeed like the BAM. Have to look for that drawing again, maybe it IS BAM! Don’t remember correctly anymore except for those stripes (which I just noticed to be also on the drawing above) and the silly weapons.
Now, retiring another 2M classes will give them something like 200+million, not enough for 3 or 4 BAM… Of course if they have saved some from the other M-class sales, they might get enough money.
On the other hand, what is the Cost of the Sigma class? Any idea on the price of the Sigma sale to Indonesia?
Of course crew and maintenance would be much smaller than the M-classes, which they could use as an argument too.

If you find that drawing, please scan and post!

Did you not realise, those are not Coast Guard type stripes, they are go-faster stripes! :diablo:

That is indeed true, the Dutch have shown their concept of a patrol vessel in a Defence Paper and it looked BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAD (and certainly when you consider that everyone expected the Sigma), it even had coast guard type of stripes on its hull. It’s weaponry was some 30mm cannon and a helicopter, pretty silly… But on the other hand indeed like the BAM. Have to look for that drawing again, maybe it IS BAM! Don’t remember correctly anymore except for those stripes (which I just noticed to be also on the drawing above) and the silly weapons.
Now, retiring another 2M classes will give them something like 200+million, not enough for 3 or 4 BAM… Of course if they have saved some from the other M-class sales, they might get enough money.
On the other hand, what is the Cost of the Sigma class? Any idea on the price of the Sigma sale to Indonesia?
Of course crew and maintenance would be much smaller than the M-classes, which they could use as an argument too.

The trouble is that now ‘patrol’ can mean anything from an OPV of about 500-1000tons, all the way up to a 6000ton ship for patrol duties like the Absalon, and even into the lower end of the LPDs like New Zealands new multi-role vessel under Project Protector. Mind you, if you look at the new European ‘frigates’ which are larger than the older destroyers, it sort of explains this ambiguity!

Ed, that was what I actually said about being in the exercise. That practice was with a different Spec Forces, but they always seem to underestimate the 14-20m freeboard of some merchant vessels. They just ask (and probably pay) to keep a vessel sailing around for two days in one specific area, during that time they do their practices.
100mlln a piece for the BAM is quite expensive though, you can get a second hand M-class frigate for that price… On the other hand it is really aimed at his task as Pred said, will be more economic and cost-efficient in the end.

Recently there was talk by the defense minister of the Netherlands about the option to retire a further 2 M-frigates but obtain 3-4 (large?) ‘patrol vessels’. Considering the fact that Spain and The Netherlands have been working together in the area of ship design (F100/LCF/F124 Trilateral Frigate Agreement, Rotterdam/Galicia, Amsterdam/Patino), might these BAM ships be an option. Is there any information on this?

Most modern ship designs use modular architecture, even in those designs not part of a shared platform approach a lot of the machinery and outfit is based on standardised modules.

Yes, Floreal are ships very close to the BAM concept, at least in the patrol version.
The idea with BAM is to use the same platform for a different roles with minor modifications, something similar to the Stanflex concept. The difference is that Stanflex can swing from one role to the other changing the “Stanflex modules”, but BAM will born like a patrol ship, or like an AGI, or like a diver support ship, etc. and probably this will be his main role along his life.
If the concept is succesful in 10-15 years a lot of Spanish navy ships will be BAMs, not included frigates, subs and the big ones (AOR, anphibs), of course.

Regards

The French Floreal-class would appear to be a very close counterpart to the BAM in concept, IMHO.

A bit lively for sure, but the Castle boats seem to have coped OK, and really it’s no worse than the North Sea or Biscay, I spent a lot of time offshore in the North Sea and some of our supply boats, anchor handlers etc. looked to be doing eskimo rolls in winter they were rolling and pitching that heavily 🙂

Does anyone know how well the OPV(H)s cope with the weather around the Falklands? It can certainly get rough down there!

These vessels seem pretty similar in concept and intended utilisation to the new Falklands patrol vessel, a growth derivative of the River class OPV with a heli deck intended for Coastguard type duties, fisheries protection, assisting SAR ops, Policing/security duties etc., not a front line warship. As such it seems a well found design, speed is less important than good sea keeping qualities in the area’s these vessels will operate in and armament really isn’t that important, for the roles they will perform a light cannon is more than adequate, even the 30mm callibre preferred by the RN with small arms is quite adequate. To me it really does seem that these types of vessel are ideal, well enough equipped for the job but pretty economical to buy and operate with new fancy extra’s that are basically a waste of money to look good on paper, to me they’re far more sensible designs than most of the high cost corvette type vessels becoming popular which cost an awful lot more and will be used for similar duties.

I apologise, I had seen the pictures (of the Baynunah), but not the displacement, though they are still fully equipped with a helicopter deck and hangar facilities, and look like quite well balanced ships, though quite small. I agree, the Meko 100 types probably do make a better comparison, any information on the price of those?

The Baynunah corvettes are about 600 tons, have substantial armaments and are more a grown up fast attack craft for use in Gulf area. Seakeeping, endurance etc would differ substantially compared to BAM. Cost is probably more as well, $130m+ per unit and up. Although still quite a big gap in displacement (and usable volume…) the MEKO 100 RMN patrol vessels/corvettes are probably more interesting comparison and can be retrofitted with RAM, Exocet and the like later. I do not see provision for such in the BAM sketches.