Australia and UK DDL proposal

Wow guys, you’re a great resource to have.

Uni: I take it you are part of Task Force 72, let me know when you guys are on show again in the Sydney- I’d like to come and have a look, maybe even finally meet you

But much less capable then the DDL’s were projected to be.

For Starters.
5″ –> 3″
2 x Phalanx –> 1 x Phalanx
~5,000t –> ~4,000t
2 shafts –> 1 shaft

Gun capability 5″ v 3″ > one is better for shore bombardment, the other better for AAA

I posted that in this very thread, #17 above.

It is mentioned in CONWAY’S ALL THE WORLD’S FIGHTING SHIPS 1947-1982 PART I (THE WESTERN POWERS), in the entry for the Type 21 (Amazon class), in the UK section. Here is the exact text:

The full entry is shown here:
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b336/Bager1968/misc%20ships/Frigates/Amazonclass.jpg

Thank you. its interesting how all these programs seem to resurrect every few decades in new forms.

I read somewhere that the RN’s (and now Pakistans) type 21 frigates were intially developed jointly with Australian. any truth to this?

I posted that in this very thread, #17 above.

It is mentioned in CONWAY’S ALL THE WORLD’S FIGHTING SHIPS 1947-1982 PART I (THE WESTERN POWERS), in the entry for the Type 21 (Amazon class), in the UK section. Here is the exact text:

The full entry is shown here:
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b336/Bager1968/misc%20ships/Frigates/Amazonclass.jpg

I read somewhere that the RN’s (and now Pakistans) type 21 frigates were intially developed jointly with Australian. any truth to this?

As I recall the OHP’s were eventually bought from the US for less by the Fraser government. Four were built in the US and two were built in Australia.

But much less capable then the DDL’s were projected to be.

For Starters.
5″ –> 3″
2 x Phalanx –> 1 x Phalanx
~5,000t –> ~4,000t
2 shafts –> 1 shaft

DDL drawing from Conway’s (the one that’s missing from Ja Worsley starting post for the thread):

MConrads did this, based on the official drawing in Unicorn’s PDF:

I do have both in much larger format, much better than the photobucket-reduced versions above, if anyone is interested.

As I recall the OHP’s were eventually bought from the US for less by the Fraser government. Four were built in the US and two were built in Australia.

Sorry for some thread necromancy, but as my DDL is now almost finished (needs detailing for things like guardrails, flight deck netting and such) I thought I would post some images as requested by Mr Worsley.

A couple of addendums. Based on the plans that the RAN had, there was no way that a Wessex was ever going to fit on these ships. The drawings had a stylised Lynx on the back and the hangars were sized for Lynx.

There is no way they could have operated the Sea Sprite, and the Seahawk is a tight fit.

Unicorn

Way to go mate, can’t wait to see it!

Don’t forget that the DDL was also fitted with space behind the bridge for SSM launchers, probably the quad Harpoons launchers.

As I am building it in 1/72 scale it will look as if it is service now,

so Phalanx in place of the 30mm, Nulka added, Quad Harpoons, RIBs instead of boats and so on.

Should end up looking good on the water.

Unicorn

I was just about to ask the same…

Unicorn, thanks for the great find.

Does anyone know anything about the earlier CODOG 1,800 ton “General Purpose Escort” that was proposed for the RAN in the early 1960s?

Conways is the only source that I’ve ever seen.

An aside on the DDL… as part of the overall RAN programme, there was also an effort to develop a replacement for the first 4 DEs (Yarra, Parramatta, Stuart, Derwent).

To further this, and RAN-RN cooperation, Australia historically contributed ~35% of the development costs of the “Amazon” class Type 21 ASW Frigates in the late 1960s, planning to order 5… but none were ordered.

If this money had been applied to the DDL, could it have actually been built (at least the first 3)?

Note that the Swan & Torrens were ordered in 1964 and laid down in 1965, so they were NOT part of the escort replacement program that I am talking about.

If they had used the Mk26 mount instead, it would have made for a very good ship indeed, with a lot of export potential. In particular, instead of the Types 22 and 42 frigates and destroyers respectively, they might have been able to simply produce slightly differently equipped AAW and ASW versions. If that had happened, they might have been able to get a good number of export sales – perhaps the Netherlands and Canada could have bought into the program.

The other factor is that if the UK had adopted the Mk13 or Mk26, the SeaDart missile would have been made compatible, thus broadening its export possibilities. Perhaps even do an improved Ikara, compatible with the arm launchers – providing an alternative to Asroc.

A scan of the plan for the DDL

Unicorn 🙂

Great! Thanks Unicorn. Funny, it’s like a cross between main characteristics of Type 42 and O H Perry. In addition to Mk13/SM1 and Mk 45 single 5″, 2×3 ASW tubes and 2 helicopters it is fitted for but not with 2 twin 30mm Emerlec mounts. Don’t see those much (ROK navy, mainly). Cool. 😎

A scan of the plan for the DDL

Unicorn 🙂

Pioneer,

I’d love to see the pic. To post it you only need to select Go Advanced as the option to Post Reply and there you have an option called “manage attachments”

Could you please send me the pic via email? The address is [email]pometablava@yahoo.es[/email]

Thank you very much

The model is of the initial concept, and was somewhat modified ion the way to the final design.

The air search radar was moved from the top of the forward superstructure to the forward part of the centre superstructure block, and the enclosed mast structure was moved further forward.

Unicorn

Yes this project would have been good for Australia shipbuilding and the RAN
But in Australia we have many good ideas, but no Government support for home grown.
I have a picture of a RAN official model of the DDL, but how do I put the Pic to this Thread ???????
Can anyone advice ?