New Newark Name

RE: New Newark Name

Dulce est Decorum pro Patria Mori (sp?)

It is Sweet and Honourable to Die for Your Country

But whilst I would die for my country (well, I think so – I’m not foolish enough to make blind statements like that before having experienced the sort of circumstances in which such a sacrifice might be needed) I am fully aware of it’s many defects, as Keltic points out. Maybe that’s why I’m not much of a flag waver, just a person who loves his country in a quiet sort of way. I think its just one of the differenes in culture and attitude on different sides of the Atlantic to be honest.

Anyway, how the hell did this issue start up on a thread about renaming EWR?

RE: New Newark Name

Loving one´s country is an obvious reaction, because we have grown up and got educated in a certain place, absorved things from it and thats a good and positive feeling. This love must be humble and generous, and not setting one´s country in the top of the pyramid as the best thing. There´s not good or bad countries, simply different.
Being a patriotic doesn´t necessary mean that you love your country. Only someone who is able to accept the limitations of his own country, is able to improve them. Excesive love, patriotism, flag waving and no dirty spots means that things are fine in our country and nothing need to be changed. For me, and that how we feel, and for it a personal perception, is a bit xenophobe, parrochial and quite radical because this “proudness” to be….means in a way, or at least in our subconscious….”we are the best…..so I am proud to be like that because others are inferior”. One could be happy to be from a certain place, but never proud. We haven´t been responsible for being born in this or that country. And only things in which we are responsible are reason to be proud, a career, a picture, and so on.

RE: New Newark Name

gd, I’m more than aware that EWR is closer to the upper west side than JFK. It’s just tongue in cheek.

Hell, in Europe, Newark is generally refered to as New York Newark, anyway.

RE: New Newark Name

I already covered the NJ aspect in my earlier post on the thread. Please scroll up. Lastly, anybody confused by Newark not being considered a NY airport regardless of what the name is and also of its proximity to Manhattan, already is confused by it. No new morons will be discovered as a result.

GD1

P.S. Since when is Patriotism bad? Anybody that doesn’t like or support the country they live in, should get the hell out.

RE: New Newark Name

But it’s in Jersey… surely ‘The Garden Airport’ would be more appropriate than confusing people by naming it after NY State… 😉

RE: New Newark Name

I suppose it depends on if the term patriotism is a virtue or a defect. Over here, and despite being also happy for being Spanish, patriotism sounds a bit to close to nationalism, and something totally negative.

RE: New Newark Name

I understand what you’re saying, but I totally disagree on the cheapening of things, aspect. It’s not like they’re renaming it “Twin Towers International” or “WTC International.” The term Liberty covers a much broader area, and the term has been used to represent this county for years. For example, we have the Statue of Libery, the Liberty Bell, and in out pledge of allegiance, the very last phrase states, “….with liberty and justice for all.” So yes, it is being renamed to commemorate an event. However, the name represents a hell of a lot more than just that particular event.

GD1

P.S. “Honolulu Pearl Harbour INTL,” actually has a nice ring to it!

RE: New Newark Name

I don’t know about the patriotism bit. A few of my friends joined the Royal Marines and I reckon they’d die for their country if they really, absolutely had to. But you wouldn’t catch them signing the anthem! With the exception of occassions like the Proms or an England match, there is virtually no flag waving here.

The US is certainly perceived as being a nation of die hard patriots, but as before, maybe this is only partly true, as you say GD.

In terms of the airport, don’t get me wrong, I’m not trying to be critical. It makes bugger all difference to whether I use it or not!

It’s just that from my own perspective, it appears to cheapen things. To me, it’s comparable to naming any other airport after a local tragedy. Say, “Honolulu Pearl Harbour Int’l” or “Dresden Fire Brigade Int’l” or “London Blitzkreig Memorial Airport” or more relevantly, “Munich Manchester United Airport”.

Sorry to keep making my point by way of examples, it’s a funny idea to explain! Some of the above referenced disasters are comparable to 11/9, some are not in the same league. But the principle is the same: Anything with a commerical edge will be viewed in a cynical light. A better memorial would be a park, or a folly, or even a national holiday.

RE: New Newark Name

Slighty more logical points, I can deal with that. First I’m going to address the issue of patriotism. Mongu, believe me, most Americans are not as patriotic as you think. Yes, ones from the old school, war veterans, rednecks, New Englanders, etc., tend to be more patriotic. However, for the most part, Americans are probably as you described the Brits. Before I worry about any aspect of this country being too patriotic, I worry about it not being patriotic enough. Just to give an example. I was at a university graduation ceremony in Sydney, Australia back in April. Upon announcement that the national anthem was to be sung, everybody stood up in unison and I’d say at least 90% of the people that were in the auditorium stood up and were singing. I just looked around, and was in complete awe. Afterwards, I praised my Aussie brethren on how patriotic it was for everybody to be singing like that. In the same situation in the U.S., you’d get maybe 20-25% of the people singing, and that’s on a good day! As soon as I witness the Star Spangled Banner being sung like it was that day in Sydney, only then should anybody outside the U.S. worry about us being too patriotic. Let’s get back to the name here. Airports are nenamed constantly. This is not a new phenomenon, nor should the airport lose it’s identity as a result. About 5 or 6 years ago, they renamed Washington National Airport to Reagan National Airport. Did the airport lose its “Washington” identity as a result? Of course not. The code remained DCA and even though it was renamed after a president (a horrible one in fact), he wasn’t even from anywhere in the area! Reagan was from California, all the way on the other side of the country. Same downtown DC airport, different name. I don’t think USAirways was worried about marketing, nor did they lose any business because of it. Continental has nothing to worry about. I’m glad that you mentioned renaming an airport in England something similar. I was thinking about a comparison, but couldn’t find one. If the name of Heathrow was changed to Hope and Glory International Airport, not a single person in this country would give 2 $hits, believe me. And if you asked any Joe Schmoe if they thought it was tacky, they would probably say, “I could care less either way.” Therefore, if the U.S. at large wouldn’t care about the U.K. showing its patriotism in re-naming an airport, why the hell should any of you? Lastly, I’d like to discuss the whole reminder of 9/11. That day was indeed the worst day in aviation history. However, it goes way beyond that. The aviation aspect of it is only the tip of the iceberg. The name won’t be a reminder of the worst day in aviation history, it will commemorate all those who perished as a result.

GD1

RE: New Newark Name

GD, I think you’ve just stumbled accross one of the big differences between Americans and Brits. The British are equally as patriotic as Americans, but we don’t usually show it – it’s under the surface, and we tend to dislike overt patriotism.

I can’t bring myself to be critical just because of that fact, because it is after all your airport and not ours! But I do feel it is a little bit tacky. It would be like renaming LHR “Hope and Glory International” or “Fair Play Airport”. Saab’s suggestion of using an individual seems better to me personally. Guiliani looks a good bet.

RE: New Newark Name

[updated:LAST EDITED ON 26-08-02 AT 10:42 AM (GMT)]Ok,saying ‘Let it lie’is not the right way to put it.I’m not American so I don’t have the right to say that,I knew no one who died in the attacks,so saying that is arrogant and ignorant.I apologise.
However,why name an airport after the worst days in aviation? 9/11 saw passenger planes being used as weapons to kill. Why name an airport which is a constant reminder of this?
I’m not against the patriotism which we have seen from the US in the last year,but surely there are much better ways to commemorate the events?In 10/15 years time,people travelling to ‘Liberty International’ will probably think its named after the Statue of Liberty,not the events off 9/11.
Newark also looses its identity if the name is changed.When the name ‘Newark’ comes up,what do you think of?I think of an big international airport.Taking this name away surely looses Newark any sort of recognition,it would just be any other NJ city.If you also change the name it might damper airlines such as COs attempts to market Newark as a NY airport and people will travel to JFK,not realizing that Newark is as convinient as JFK from Manhattan.

How about Newark Liberty International Airport,or seeing that JFK and La Guardia are named after famous political people,Newark Giuliani International?Airports named after people are much more comman.

RE: New Newark Name

[updated:LAST EDITED ON 26-08-02 AT 09:59 AM (GMT)]With all due respect Saab, we’ll never let it ‘lie,’ ever. Just like the British will never let that little war that ended back in 1776 ‘lie,’ to use your terminology. We’ll always be “Bloody Yanks,” and that’s perfectly fine with me. So basically, they shouldn’t change the name because everybody is used to “Newark International?” Are you kidding me? We basically shouldn’t change anything now, because it will be tough for everybody to get used to. Let’s just leave everything the same, in every aspect of life. And Newark isn’t NY it’s actually NJ? Uh yeah, even though, it is part of the NY Port Authority, and is actually the busiest of the 3 airports in the Port Authority. And why is that? Because it is closer to Manhattan than the other 2, which are in Queens. And yeah, so the name “Liberty International” is patriotic. I have a better idea. Why not “Statue of Libery International?” That sounds EVEN MORE patriotic. You know what, scrap that idea, lets just call it “Stars and Stripes International.” That way, everybody outside the U.S. would be offended? Why, because, the U.S. is being too damn patriotic. G.W. Bush should hold a press conference. “Ladies and Gentlemen, we are being too patriotic and everybody outside the U.S. is offended by it. Let’s change everything involved that is too patriotic, to something less patriotic. That way maybe, we won’t be offending as many people as we currently are.” Too Partriotic, LOL, WOW! I thought I had heard it all. This is the best solution. Whoever is offended by the name of the airport, don’t fly into it. Fly into JFK. Wait, that’s named after a U.S. president. That’s also too patriotic. Speaking of JFK, as Mongu mentioned, that was changed from IDL to JFK after Jack was murdered. I’m sure everybody back then complained that the name and 3 letter code was being changed. I’m sure it was a very tramatic experience for all pilots and ATC people involved. I’m sure they were further traumatized by the fact that were were naming it after a slain leader, and were sounding very patriotic as a result.

GD1, perhaps re-acting too patriotically, which apparantly is unacceptable

RE: New Newark Name

I bet the US government wanted to look better by renaming an airport to somthing patriotic so that the Americans would be proud to travel in the air!

They probably wanted the closest one to NY when they were thinking but the Americans probably forgot about JFK already being named after someone so that couldnt change its name!

RE: New Newark Name

[updated:LAST EDITED ON 26-08-02 AT 08:57 AM (GMT)]I don’t think the NJ/NY distinction matters. Newark is not much further than JFK, commute wise, from Manhattan. LGA is a little closer.

Don’t you remember that JFK used to be called something else until the man in question got shot?

Also, you can get a very good view (esp. at night) of the Statue of Liberty from EWR. Empire State Building is also distinctive. Needless to say, the WTC used to dominate the skyline from there. I remember sitting in a window seat on a Virgin 747-400 on the apron at EWR, just staring at the night time skyline. I found it mesmeric and the WTC was the icing on the cake.

Although I do agree that using the word “Liberty” in an airport name is quite tacky and a bt inappropriate.

RE: New Newark Name

i agree with Keltic and Saab totally.

RE: New Newark Name

Thanx for the nes Saab.

RE: New Newark Name

100% per cent agree. Newark International. Liberty airport sounds terrible patriotic and unpropiate. Why should we be mixing everything up?.