Discipline in the Army

This was one of our hangouts, we’d work an afternoon and a morning, then down to the beach…

This was one of our haunts

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=villasimius+sardinia&newwindow=1&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=KRnPUq_wJ6Hy7AathoHwCA&ved=0CE8Q7Ak&biw=1024&bih=668

It seriously is a sleeper of a destination.

Tony,

I can tell it was tough in your lot. All work and no play!

John,

On VC Tens it was a requirement under CAA regulations that crews had to get a full undisturbed nights sleep as we carried SLF. Hence we would stay in Hotels, even sometimes when at Military bases, because with their flying programme that might not be possible….. Remember some of the big Exercises in Germany, I spent several of those when not working in the Hannover Hilton 🙂 we were shipping the Army in and home post exercises… Ahh the Mighty Ten, 3 days in Cyprus to do a compass swing because the compass bay at Brize was out of service and the nearest military one we could use was Cyprus 😀

When we went to Sardinia during the summer on Jags for a few weeks each year we stayed in RAF barrack blocks at Decimmannu, similar when in Gibraltar we stayed in RAF accommodation. Red Flag at Nellis was in Hotels / Casinos in Las Vegas…

On Helicopters would once in a blue moon end up in a tent, though the OCU didn’t tend to play much, I remember sitting on a couple of those bistro style steel chairs and table complete with red checkered table cloth drinking wine and eating pâté on toast while watching them playing silly ******s out on Salisbury plain , we took all the comforts of home with us 😀 there was a fridge etc in one of the 4 tonners… We always tended to end up with a Squadron Leader in our Hotel if were were split between a couple, that way we would also get enhanced rate ones too..

The job did have its perks, learning one of our Pumas was going from Salisbury Plain up to Edinburgh to do a school PR visit I asked if I could scrounge a couple of days off and go on it, getting dropped off in Carlisle, the boss was a good sport so dropped me off in a field near my mums house… Much to the surprise to the population of our village, I called him and arranged to be picked up on the way back from the MU who picked me up by car :p as we departing we beat up low level some buildings on the side of a disused Army camp where my Mum worked, they all poured out to watch it… As we climbed away the boss asked what the place was….. Local police headquarters for the motorway division I replied…. He went white lol…. They were impressed :p

snafu, lets not go over that old chestnut again please, it’s been flogged to death.

At least it wasn’t shot down unawares…;o)

Look for the Armed Forces Act 2006, in particular the sections on Offences against Military Law. You have discipline and criminal conduct offences to consider, and whether it can be dealt with at unit level by summary hearing; or if its something that has to go to Court Martial. Minor discipline issues can incur sanctions, for that kind of thing you need to be looking at AGAI 67. I would also suggest looking at the Values and Standards or the British Army.

Chuck any of these into Google, and with a little light reading you should have any answers you need.

Regards,

Rich

Tony T

Tony, you hack me off ! Sleeping in hotels? Huh!

Trust the Glamour Girls.

When on war games in the Sahara, we had scorpions under our ground sheets attracted by body warmth – which made them very active. Above ground we had the odd snake to sleep with. We could see the slither marks left as tracks in the sand in the morning !

Sand storms were an attractive feature that occured most days. At around 6.0am at the dawn ‘stand-to’ we would all be in trenches, laboriously dug to about 5 feet deep. A howling sandstorm would arise with great ferocity and at ten past six we’d all be standing on level sand looking at a newly filled hole in the ground.

Flies were a special attraction. I’d regularly have to fight between five and ten thousand flies for their right to squat and my lips to perch on the edge of my tea cup. On a good day I would get one or two sips and the flies would get the rest although not before a good measure of them met a liquid death by drowning. Not very pleasant considering that the tea was so strong we had to dig it out with a trenching shovel.

My God ! Do I wish I’d joined the RAF. Tony, I’ll remember that jibe about the hotels. What particularly hurts is the knowledge that it is true !

Axel. Hope this also helps.

Forgot to add, you will also find there is a different ethos in that how the guys are accommodated,

RAF single accommodation tends to be on the whole single man rooms, in some of the old blocks there would be two man rooms.. This is because they would often be shift workers etc, though the wing of a block or dependant on size, a block itself would be all Squadron personnel etc…. no point putting a shift working guy in a room next to one that works days as a clerk, hence the way the accommodation is arranged to avoid disturbance for those sleeping off nights etc,

Army accommodation is arranged as 3 or 4 man rooms, even the new stuff, this will be your squad members grouped together, the thinking behind this is if you live together, you play together, you fight together, you form a close knit, almost “family” bond between them… this is handy in a combat situation because crunch time, war isn’t about Queen and Country, it’s about your mates life next to you, you will be fighting to keep another member of your “family” alive and you will look out for one another.

I have had alot of help with my work from this post

Yup, And they used to sleep in holes in the ground, it seemed to rankle as we used to sleep in hotels.

Yup, ditches do suck. But better than having to wear Brill Cream. :stupid:

Axel, the RAF Army and Navy are all about the same, they use the same rule book and while their will be variances between them rank structure wise, IE RAF SWO ( Station Warrant Officer) and Army RSM (Regimental pain in the **** Sergeant Major) they all do the same job.

It is just the Army are more strict discipline wise.. They tend to need to be as if you are going to order a soldier over the top, you need to know he will go over the top no questions asked and not turn round and say after you..
The RAF does not tend to have that same requirement, hence a different approach, as your standard RAF guy will tend to be a more intelligent individual academically wise, simply due to the training they are required to undertake, so you tend to recruit those types….. not that some roles in the Army are any different, just the average Soldier as in basic footslogger will not have done as well at school.. as such you tend to treat them differently, I just hope no one takes offence at that, as I am not trying to cause any, just say it as I saw it.

Each service do have some funny rules, walking across the grass in the RAF, you would get shouted at “Airman get off the grass” the Royal Navy training units would shout “Man Overboard and throw a life ring at you”, go to the main gate at an RAF station you could walk in and out, the same at a RN one you would all stand around waiting like a bunch of prats for the Liberty boat to come in to take you ashore ( someone would unlock the gate for a short period) Go to the likes of RAF Lossiemouth and all the room doors were about 4 inches short at the bottom, this was because as an old Navy station they had a lump of wood nailed across the bottom that you had to step over, this simulated ship bulkhead doors so they got use to the idea in case they went to sea..

🙂

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i will

Axel, As a matter of interest, let us know how you get/got on.
Jim.
Lincoln .7

I reckon you’ve still had a lot of good advice here Axel – certainly a few leads to follow up. Good luck!

would of chose the RAF but someone got there before i did so i had to go with the army

Axel, I can see where Alan is coming from on this,Any one of your subjects would cause more disagreements than you could imagine.
There is also the question, as to what era you are researching. The rules and regs in WW1 would no doubt be different to those of WW2, which may again be different to todays rules and regs. Or does your Tutor wan’t you to delve deep into all 3, and give feedback on a bit of each?.
Jim.
Lincoln .7

it is just modurn day because we are doing modurn day public services

Which puts bad employers in the same category as the military…….if we extend that logic!

That “Gotcha”, also applied to the Police Force.
Jim.
Lincoln .7

It also applies to alot of companies outside the forces.Drive behind a van which has a sticker on it saying “how am i driving?,phone this number etc”. People are now told to have ID and name badges in open view so they are held accountable.This is fine with a fair open minded company but can also be abused and used as a tool by the bad employers.

But to be fair to the RAF hierarchy…(both commissioned and non commissioned) – they were normally (at least in the 70’s) fairly tolerant of our behaviour and if they saw potential in an airman then they would try their best to encourage him/her to advance themselves !
I was never seriously penalised for some fairly erratic behaviour – but it paid off because – in time – I became a mature and helpful/cooperative individual.
I have worked on military jets for over 40 years – today I worked on 2 different a/c – one a prototype and the other who’s cockpit was approx 35 a/c later on the production line ; )

I forgot to add, if they couldn’t find a charge to suit the crime, they used to do you for bringing the RAF.. Army… Navy into disrepute. It was a be all and end all gotcha.

That “Gotcha”, also applied to the Police Force.
Jim.
Lincoln .7

Tony,

As a former ‘bootneck’ that was an excellent summary and should help Axel. You did miss from your account the very excellent Army Education Corps. I don’t know whether you had an equivalent in the ranks of the glamourr boys.

Some chaps joined the Army/Marines with little formal education (not much has changed) and the purpose of the Education wallahs was to teach them basic literacy and numeracy. From that they became much more effective as soldiers.

Axel. Hope this little bit helps.