Question about Pietenpols

Nope, less useful load on the Minor?

Originally posted by turbo_NZ
Okay, hope this helps:

Pietenpol Air Camper

Wing Span 29 ft.
Wing Chord 5 ft
Length 17 ft. 8 in.
Height Overall 6 ft. 6 in.
Tread 53 in.
Empty Weight 610 lb.
Engine Ford A, 65-85 Continental, Subaru, Jabaru, other
Useful Load 385lb.
Climb Light Load over 500ft. first min.
Climb Full Load over 200ft. first min.
High Speed 90 mph
Landing Speed 40 mph
Fuel Capacity 10-18 gal.
Take-off Run 150 ft.
Landing Run 250 ft.

Luton Minor

Span 25 ft 0 in (7.62 m)
Length 20 ft 9 ins (6.32 m)
Weights
Weight empty 390 lbs. (177 kg)
Weight loaded 627 lbs. (285 kg)
Wing Loading 5 lbs. / sq. ft. (24.4 kg / sq. m.)
Power loading: 17 lbs./hp (7.7 kg/h.p.)
Performance
Max speed 85 mph (137 km/hr)
Cruising speed 75 mph (121 km/hr)
Stalling speed: 28 mph (45 km/hr)
Rate of climb at S/L 450 ft/min (137 m/min)
Take-off run 240 ft (73 m)
Landing run: 120 ft (36.5 m)
Range 180 miles (200 km)
Range with auxiliary wing tanks 400 miles (645 km)

Fairly comparable.

Cheers
Chrs

Thanks Turbo

Originally posted by Melvyn Hiscock
Often buyer beware. Some people start and can’t finish because of time etc. Just as many just can’t do the work properly. You don’t want to buy their cast offs!

I know with my aeroplane the easiest task would have been to start from scratch.

Melvyn Hiscock

Thanks Melvyn.

Reinforces what I should do. Far more sensible.

Well, I’m going to order the plans now from Pietenpol.

Think I’ve done enough research, and everyone’s help and opinions have been well received and I’m grateful.

Thanks
Chris

Yes, wysiwyg, weight is always an issue with Lutons, and when our syndicate operated BBEA, on hot days ( poorer performance)the chunkier members were so weight-limited they could wear nothing heavier than the group thong.

One fellow (after months of preparation) set forth to The Isle of Mull, for the annual fly-in. Sitting on, and around his tent, clothing etc, he got airborne, but the Luton simply refused to climb above 100 ft, and his low-level circuit was almost entirely out-of-sight, though glimpses could be seen of the fin, where the trees were a bit lower. He got back round OK, but his share was up for sale the next day!

For nutty Luton Minor stories, one must refer, of course, to Arthur Ord-Hume, and his various books, which include the tale of flying a Minor from Elstree to the Isle of Wight, with a bicycle hanging underneath. Perhaps people were lighter in the 50’s.

Often buyer beware. Some people start and can’t finish because of time etc. Just as many just can’t do the work properly. You don’t want to buy their cast offs!

I know with my aeroplane the easiest task would have been to start from scratch.

Melvyn Hiscock

I think I prefer the original Cub-type design.
Looks more inline with the design of the aircraft.

I see on some of the Pietenpol websites there are a lot of half-finished fuselages/kits where builders have either lost interest or money and are selling off (in some cases very cheaply !!) what they’ve already built.

I considered going down this road also.

Any opinions out there on this ?

Is it viable or more of buyer beware ?

Apart from G-BUCO there is another local Aircamper that was first flown last year. This belongs to Keith Matcham and he based the cowlings on a Jenny.

He also got stiffed on the engine. He was told it was airworthy when he bought it.

Lots of nasties inside.

Melvyn Hiscock

Getting back to cowl thing, guess the slim cowl is for an Auster type look perhaps ?

Propstrike – I used to have the original Phoenix Aviation drawings for the wing tank for the Luton Minor! The problem was I couldn’t see how on earth you could legitimately carry a typical adult with any fuel in the wing tank and be under max weight!

Yes, Popham

MH

I’d guess Popham…

Interesting how the cowling is different between CO and VB. CO has a C90 whilst VB has an O-200. Presumably CO’s is a faux cowl to make it look like a straight?

These from the CAA register website:

Interesting slope there. Where was the last one taken? Anyone know?

Yup – reminds me that sice then the same camera has been going downhill sice I took those.

This is the classico sort of thing is what they fly at Omaka isn’t it?

Apologies for the photo of me grimacing. It’s ugly I know but was into sun. 🙂

Wow !!!

What can I say ?

Thanks for the beautiful pictures BlueRobin 😀 😀 😀 😀 😀

When I see these ones already built (in particular G-BUCO), gives me inspiration to do it !!

Cheers
Chris

I got camper photos !

🙂

Taken 11 May 2002 at Northampton Sywell.

Here’s me in an Auster 5J1 I just went up in

Ok, do you peoples think I should still stick with a Pietenpol Air Camper or maybe look at a Luton Major ?
BTW Is a Major a 2-seater Minor ?

I want to build a 2-seater so my partner can fly also as she wants to go for her PPL.

Personally I think the Pietenpol is still a better looking design.

What you reckon ?
🙂

I used to fly one of Luton’s finest- it was a Minor indulgence, and I never heard of one having wing tanks, as mentioned in the above spec.

Only a Luton pilot would appreciate the full horrific implications of 400 miles range, ie the potential to be stuck in it for an appalling 4 hours or more.

Stick your head next to an unsilenced VW Beetle engine for an hour or two, whilst bobbing around in a fume-filled wooden box, sitting on a very hard seat, and wait until cold and vibration have robbed you of all feeling in your extremities;- virtual Luton flying !

Actually great fun, and aviation thrills do not come any cheaper. 20 mins would last you a whole week.

Mike, are you thinking of the Luton Major?

Okay, hope this helps:

Pietenpol Air Camper

Wing Span 29 ft.
Wing Chord 5 ft
Length 17 ft. 8 in.
Height Overall 6 ft. 6 in.
Tread 53 in.
Empty Weight 610 lb.
Engine Ford A, 65-85 Continental, Subaru, Jabaru, other
Useful Load 385lb.
Climb Light Load over 500ft. first min.
Climb Full Load over 200ft. first min.
High Speed 90 mph
Landing Speed 40 mph
Fuel Capacity 10-18 gal.
Take-off Run 150 ft.
Landing Run 250 ft.

Luton Minor

Span 25 ft 0 in (7.62 m)
Length 20 ft 9 ins (6.32 m)
Weights
Weight empty 390 lbs. (177 kg)
Weight loaded 627 lbs. (285 kg)
Wing Loading 5 lbs. / sq. ft. (24.4 kg / sq. m.)
Power loading: 17 lbs./hp (7.7 kg/h.p.)
Performance
Max speed 85 mph (137 km/hr)
Cruising speed 75 mph (121 km/hr)
Stalling speed: 28 mph (45 km/hr)
Rate of climb at S/L 450 ft/min (137 m/min)
Take-off run 240 ft (73 m)
Landing run: 120 ft (36.5 m)
Range 180 miles (200 km)
Range with auxiliary wing tanks 400 miles (645 km)

Fairly comparable.

Cheers
Chrs

Originally posted by wysiwyg
I have owned 2 Luton Minors which are very similar and have also flown a Pietenpol (albeit 17 years ago!). From what I remember the Piet was like a larger Luton Minor with similar views from the cockpit. The only thing I didn’t like about it was the poor control harmony.

A bit slow off the mark I know but I have only just noticed this post. Are you sure? I thought the Luton Minor was larger than an Aircamper. What are the differences in dimensions?