Originally posted by frankvw
I agree, but when such signs create segregation in those same schools, some action has to be taken. You can’t change the way people act towards diffenences, but you can change the way they dress to “uniformise” it a little. I don’h hear people complaining about school uniforms in Britain. This is the same, apart the fact it touches a religious symbol. Pupils go to school to learn, not to show their faith.

The simple fact the it does touch a religious symbol is what makes the Hijab entirely different from school uniform, this is no trivial matter. Preventing Muslim girls from wearing the Hijab is a form of religious coercion no different from forcing them to go covered as was once the practice in Afghanistan. A liberal democracy cannot tell its citizens how and when to practice their faith. The Hijab is an integral part of Muslim belief, it’s not about showing your faith, it’s about practicing it.
Granted, France does have its integration problems, but it is dealing with them in the worst possible way. On the one hand it’s dictating behaviour inconsistant with their beliefs (not a good idea for integration), and on the other forcing observant parents to withdraw their daughters from the public education system, sending them to schools over which the state has no influence (not a good idea for integration).

Besides, you have the answer to this law in the french motto itself: “Liberty, Equality, Fraternity”. Equality is applicable here, too.

Such a ban makes a mockery of both liberty and equality. Equality cannot be dictated, it must be practiced, and in this case this means letting people practice the faith they believe in.

Of course, but have you ever seen what was on the german WW2 army’s belt buckles ? it was, translated, “God, with us”…

Interesting, I did not know that, but nothing more than an anecdote. National Socialism wasn’t about religion. Neither are the millions who are dying in the Congo.

I’m speaking of such easy relations. And this is one reason why Religion and State should be separated from the start. School is the State. Administration is the State.

I agree, I do think separation of state and church are a good idea. I’d certainly like to see more of it here in Israel. But the lines are not always so distinct, and I don’t think France should be telling people where and when to practice their faith. Individual rights should be curbed only when they infringe on other rights. I do not think this is the case.
To make matters worse, the events around the ban in fact make a mockery of the whole concept of separating church from state. If the French interior miniter Sarkozy needs the approval of an Egyptian cleric for a piece of domestic legislation, well, not only is there no separation, but where is the “state”?

Now, in France, you’ll never hear a politician calling for God in a speec relating with war. On the other hands, many other nations do. How many times, in recent conflict, did I hear arab head of states or religious leaders calling for holy wars, how many times did i hear US politicians saying “God Bless America”, or “With the help of God, we’ll do the right”, or stuff like that.

There is to be a trend blame every human sickness on one religion or another. Religion is a good card to carry around, but it’s rarely a motive, more like an excuse. You’ll take it away, there will always be another. Was Stalin an observant man? I don’t think so.

Another problem in France is that many kids from foreign origin, often northern Africa, live in appatment buildings, and those are concentrated, making it a real dangerous zone, a kind of ghetto. And they usually don’t integrate to the population. The result being social differences and tensions. This is one more way to remove a social difference.

France’s problems are very real, which is why I don’t understand why they are not taking them head on, but rather picking on little girls. This will do nothing but further estrange the Muslim population. What France should be doing is investing heavily in its educational system, making sure the very noble principles on which French democracy is founded reach every household. This cannot be achieved though draconian legislation, it only serves to erode these principles.