Colour Code For Anti Glare Green On Bristol Bulldog

I have been talking to Gary (?) over at Poly Fiber, and will be talking to him tomorrow (monday) about the “Federal Green” as a possible substitute. One strange phenomenon is to go to the chip sample above and start expanding it. It surprised me. It is way more green than I thought. Unless this is a known fact (that I did not know about) that paint becomes darker as the sample becomes smaller, or Apple and google etc are editing on their own. I will check into ‘Drooling…”.
Oxcart, as soon as I figure out how to transfer some pictures to this site. Thanks for the interest.

Cheers,
Ed

funny about St*tts!

Well that is too funny! Apparently the forum algorithms think that Ray S****’ name is too similar to a scatological reference.

Regards
John

Ed, the oddly named ‘Drooling Bulldog’, a model paint company, sells the following: http://www.droolingbulldog.com/mix/eshopproductscbm_517598/10/
It may work as a sample to match for larger volumes. Have you contacted Jon Goldenbaum at Consolidated Coatings? Easy to talk to and, as the manufacturer of both S**** and Randolph dope, can mix what you want.

Regards
John

Sorry i cant help, Bulldogbuilder, I’m just wondering how far youve got! Any chance of some pictures?

The next best

This was the next best Federal match – you are going to have to find US Federal specs for the 1960’s to navigate from here…all the best, Ed2

Some US Federal colours

I could not make an accurate match with the closest Federal colours – there seems to be a little more yellow in NIVO in comparison. This colour chip had a variation which was marked Chinook, presumably with more white in it.

Not olive drab green

Within the Archive is a box of colour chips from the RAAF in the early 60’s, which I assume are US Federal. The same colours are repeated in Matt, Semi Matt and Gloss. The chips in the photos are Matt. In the first instance I compared a 1960’s Australian Olive Drab Green, which was used on everything from tanks to toilets, and it was quite different.

Finally NIVO

A fascinating topic, and never knew what NIVO stood for, until now. NIVO has perplexed me for a long time as it was used on RAAF Bulldogs, so getting an accurate colour match is desired. Thankfully an original RAAF Bulldog prop, coated in NIVO, has been found and is shown here on display in the Archives of ANAM Moorabbin Air Museum. Also on display is a Wapiti prop covered in NIVO. Above the Wapiti prop is an Australian Demon prop with black coated fabric coming away. The light here is fluorescent, but a sense of why some recollections of NIVO describe it as ‘almost black’ can be appreciated while looking at the props from a distance. NIVO has a capacity to absorb a lot of the spectrum and it makes sense that it was used for anti glare panels, while still being effective at close range as camo for land or sea.

Thank you Graham and windhover. Wikipideia has a very good explanation of NIVO. It was phased out due to it’s reflective nature. But….why the three different versions of the green? (NIVO, Hendon medium green, and Graingers Data ‘dark green’.)
I am floating between dark green, and a lighter version (Hendon). A lot of this will depend on what Poly Fiber has to offer (4 version of green including a vibrant Cub green!!!) IPM Stockholm has the Humbrol and Taniya formulas, but getting Poly-guys to mix a special quart may be unobtainable. Will see.
Cheers
Ed

NIVO (Night Invisible Varnish Orfordness), was a dark green introduced on night bomber aircraft in 1923. It was produced in a matt finish after trials at Orford Ness. It was a mix of yellow ochre, lithopone… (a white pigment made from zinc sulphide and barium sulphate)… and ultramarine blue. It remained in use into the mid-30’s
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NIVO was not a very very dark green, but a greyish green closer to Dark Slate Grey. It has been said that Dark Slate Grey was chosen for maritime operations after an observer noted a flight of Heyfords flying over the sea and noted just how good the colour was as a camouflage – but I don’t know the origin or reliability of that remark.

I presume that you have some reason for ruling out Dark Green itself?

Thank you jeep man. I did some checking and found the NIVO on the Stockholm page. Very very dark green. Begs to find out why the Hendon Bulldog is so much lighter green. I have emailed “SilverWings” to ask if they can supply a reference for the

NIVO. I am not sure if Tim Moore can supply the same answer, (over 17 years since rebuild). The DATA files call for a ‘dark green’, so maybe the NIVO is closer than that portrayed on the Hendon model. Thanks again!!

Ed

I seem to recall that the green decking on the Bulldog was NIVO, (Night Invisible Varnish, Orfordness) which although a late WW1 colour, was also used on planes like Hendons and Heyfords right through to the mid 1930s.

Can’t offer a code I am afraid, as it was not a BS colour but the IPMS Stockholm colour charts can sometimes offer guidance.