VL Pyörremyrsky !

This may be true, but fact is that Finland was completely broke, and could not afford even almost free airplanes. Also, the view of Soviets had to be taken into account, situation in Finland was really dangerous, there was still a possibility of Soviet occupation. Added to this, the Allied forces (read: Soviets) had grounded Finnish Air Force, all flights required a special permission. After the end of the war there was no more any intention of series production of Pyörremyrsky. The test flights were made more out of curiosity to see how the airplane that had been painstakingly designed and built would actually perform.

Yes finns collected marriage rings to get money for arms. Me-109s were never paid ( Germany also never paid for burned Lappland etc )…and also the bounty P-36s were paid to Germany. Brewsters were very expensive for the finns.

There is some data available, and indeed at low level the max speed was about the same as Bf 109G-2’s, at altitude Pyörremyrsky was 15-20 kph slower. Its rate of climb was considerably worse than that of the Messerschmitt. Obviously, full performance data did not become available due to limited test flying. And as topspeed mentioned, the glues available for aircraft production were less than perfect, to put it mildly.
As for leaving pieces behind, well yes, on the first flight some pieces of engine cowling detached, causing exhaust to flow into cockpit, which again caused a bit of an emergency, but after that there were no big problems.

Wiki has the climb rate wrong on PM-1 definitely. Me-109 excelled in climb rate.

It says in the first ling it was able to outclimb and maneuvre the 109, but real factual data is missing. Plane was leaving pieces behind as it was flying….like the other side of the engine cowl.

There is some data available, and indeed at low level the max speed was about the same as Bf 109G-2’s, at altitude Pyörremyrsky was 15-20 kph slower. Its rate of climb was considerably worse than that of the Messerschmitt. Obviously, full performance data did not become available due to limited test flying. And as topspeed mentioned, the glues available for aircraft production were less than perfect, to put it mildly.
As for leaving pieces behind, well yes, on the first flight some pieces of engine cowling detached, causing exhaust to flow into cockpit, which again caused a bit of an emergency, but after that there were no big problems.

More to the point, in late 1945 they could have called the English or American embassies and received all the Spitfires, Mustangs or Thundrbolts they wanted for less than the cost of setting up a production facility.

And with a bit of work they could have found a number of 109s free for the taking (and approval of the allies occupation force, of course).

This may be true, but fact is that Finland was completely broke, and could not afford even almost free airplanes. Also, the view of Soviets had to be taken into account, situation in Finland was really dangerous, there was still a possibility of Soviet occupation. Added to this, the Allied forces (read: Soviets) had grounded Finnish Air Force, all flights required a special permission. After the end of the war there was no more any intention of series production of Pyörremyrsky. The test flights were made more out of curiosity to see how the airplane that had been painstakingly designed and built would actually perform.

However, there seems little evidence that the Pyorremyrsky would actually have matched Bf109G performance overall. A smooth shape may have given it a good top speed but the heavier weight of a wooden structure would have meant inferior climb, ceiling, acceleration and agility. It could only have entered service in significant numbers after the Bf109 was approaching obsolescence: some would argue that it already had done so by late 1943. An interesting design study for the industry, yes, a realistic hope for the air force, no.

It says in the first ling it was able to outclimb and maneuvre the 109, but real factual data is missing. Plane was leaving pieces behind as it was flying….like the other side of the engine cowl.

It wasn’t an impossible task to build a wooden fighter with wartime glues – the British did the Mosquito, the Germans used wood on a number of types, the Russians made almost all their fighters out of wood, the Japanese were increasing their use of wood. It wasn’t desirable, but it worked.

However, there seems little evidence that the Pyorremyrsky would actually have matched Bf109G performance overall. A smooth shape may have given it a good top speed but the heavier weight of a wooden structure would have meant inferior climb, ceiling, acceleration and agility. It could only have entered service in significant numbers after the Bf109 was approaching obsolescence: some would argue that it already had done so by late 1943. An interesting design study for the industry, yes, a realistic hope for the air force, no.

Generally not a problem but Finland was pretty small country and remote. They had to use substitute glues which were really miserable.

Myrsky is being renovated nicely. Which was also a VL aeroplane.

https://asiakas.kotisivukone.com/files/vlmyrsky.kotisivukone.com/tiedostot/vl_myrsky_ii_entisonti_pitka_versio_2013-11-21.pdf

It wasn’t an impossible task to build a wooden fighter with wartime glues – the British did the Mosquito, the Germans used wood on a number of types, the Russians made almost all their fighters out of wood, the Japanese were increasing their use of wood. It wasn’t desirable, but it worked.

However, there seems little evidence that the Pyorremyrsky would actually have matched Bf109G performance overall. A smooth shape may have given it a good top speed but the heavier weight of a wooden structure would have meant inferior climb, ceiling, acceleration and agility. It could only have entered service in significant numbers after the Bf109 was approaching obsolescence: some would argue that it already had done so by late 1943. An interesting design study for the industry, yes, a realistic hope for the air force, no.

Here is the factual insert from wiki;

11 Messerschmitt Bf 109 -konetta Ribbentrop-apuna Saksasta 1944[muokkaa | muokkaa wikitekstiä]

Saksan ulkoministeri Joachim von Ribbentrop tuli 22. kesäkuuta 1944 Suomeen taivuttamaan Suomen johtoa jatkamaan sotaa Saksan rinnalla. Neuvostoliitto vaati Suomea samaan aikaan antautumaan. Lopulta presidentti Risto Ryti lähetti Saksan valtakunnankansleri Adolf Hitlerille kirjeen, jossa hän lupasi, ettei hän eikä hänen hallituksensa tule tekemään rauhaa Neuvostoliiton kanssa ilman Saksan lupaa. Tätä Rytin henkilökohtaista vakuutusta vastaan piti Saksan toimittaa Suomelle apua.

Saksan mahdollisuuksia toimittaa Suomelle apua heikensi rintaman murtuminen Valko-Venäjällä, joka alkoi Neuvostoliiton suurhyökkäykselle 22. kesäkuuta 1944. ”Ribbentrop-apuna” ehti Suomeen tulla 24–29. elokuuta 1944 kymmenen Messerschmitt Bf 109 G-6-konetta, sillä yhdestoista jäi vaurioituneena matkalle. Konetäydennys olisi ilmeisesti jatkunut tästä eteenpäinkin hyvää vauhtia, sillä jo kesäkuussa oli saatu tieto, että Saksa oli vapauttanut Suomelle 242 Bf 109 -konetta sekä 180 varamoottoria niihin[49] (viisi 30 koneen laivuetta ja 92 täydennyskonetta).

https://fi.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suomen_ilmavoimien_h%C3%A4vitt%C3%A4j%C3%A4hankinnat_1940%E2%80%931944

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I think the VL was confronted with an impossible task trying to make indigenous fighter made of wood with wartime glues.

More to the point, in late 1945 they could have called the English or American embassies and received all the Spitfires, Mustangs or Thundrbolts they wanted for less than the cost of setting up a production facility.

And with a bit of work they could have found a number of 109s free for the taking (and approval of the allies occupation force, of course).

I think the need for fast speed inteceptor was cancelled because the president Risto Ryti made a deal with the nazis that Finland will not withdraw from the side of the Wehrmacht if they are provided adequate fighters. Hitler gave 200 G-6s to replace worn out G-2 and the VL Puuska / Pyörremyrsky project was cancelled.

…but due to lack of funds, and the fact that time of piston engined fighters was coming to an end, it was never developed further.

More to the point, in late 1945 they could have called the English or American embassies and received all the Spitfires, Mustangs or Thundrbolts they wanted for less than the cost of setting up a production facility.

And with a bit of work they could have found a number of 109s free for the taking (and approval of the allies occupation force, of course).

I think I saw figures way beyond 700 km/h for the small Puuska with only one 20 mm cannon armament.

PM-1 was thus almost 100 km/h slower.

This airplane actually only shared the engine and propeller with the 109, it was a totally different design otherwise. Only the prototype was built, made its first flight in November 1945, and made only 34 flights and logged some 27 hours total. It was a promising prototype, but due to lack of funds, and the fact that time of piston engined fighters was coming to an end, it was never developed further.

I think it was in 1943 when FAF ordered the VL to present a model to keep up with the new Soviet designs and an ephasis was given on speed. There was also a really fast aeroplane version under the designation PM-3 called Puuska ( a gust of wind ). I think it was the military that did not want to reduce the MGs on the hood.

This airplane actually only shared the engine and propeller with the 109, it was a totally different design otherwise. Only the prototype was built, made its first flight in November 1945, and made only 34 flights and logged some 27 hours total. It was a promising prototype, but due to lack of funds, and the fact that time of piston engined fighters was coming to an end, it was never developed further.

Nice wide U/C ! Perhaps have seen the 109 landing accidents they grafted a Hurricane chassis onto a 109?
Makes sense especially with their Winter.
mmitch.

It almost looks like a Hurricane/Messerschmidt hybrid. Never seen or heard of this type before, so thanks for posting the image!