Leconfield based Vampire crash landing

Many thanks Dave, great result and nice to confirm my assumptions about the pilot to be correct.

Jim

DW

Thanks for sorting out this I think the assumption was the Canadian Pilot was with 421 on Vampires as training at time but now you have provide whole picture

yes same as RAFCommands

Paul

I have been following this thread and I am intrigued as to why, because he was a member of the RCAF, it must be assumed that he belonged to 421 Squadron?

At the time of the accident, the squadron was in the process of running down, prior to disbandment, so what was one of their Vampires doing in Yorkshire when the squadron was based Odiham, Hampshire? The ORB and Aircraft Record Cards makes no mention of the accident or the pilot, and he is not depicted in a photograph of squadron officers in late October 1951.

There were a number of Canadian exchange officers with the RAF at that time and the clue to the identity of the Vampire is mentioned in the qoute “the plane was based at Leconfield”. In October 1951, the Central Gunnery School was based at Leconfield and ran a variety of courses, including Pilot Attack courses. They also had a number of Vampire FB 5s on strength at the time.

The identity of aircraft is:

Vampire FB 5 WA404
Built by English Electric and awaiting collection on 21 May 1951
Delivered Central Gunnery School, Leconfield, 23 May 1951 as / becoming ‘FJW-P’
FA Cat 4R 2 October 1951: Pilot became lost after reading reciprocal compass bearing and bellylanded, out of fuel. Fg Off J Ursulak RCAF.
To Marshalls for repairs 20 November 1951 and awaiting collection on 24 September 1952.
Delivered No.608 (North Riding) Squadron, RAuxAF, Thornaby, 29 September 1952, as /becoming ‘K’
FA Cat 5s 21 February 1954: Engine failed during recovery from stall and crashed in field, 8m ENE Thornaby, killing Pt Off R Webster.
SOC 22 February 1954.

Vampire VZ338 did not serve with 421 Squadron. It served exclusively with No.32 Squadron and crashed near Shallufa during a squadron aerobatic team practice, killing the pilot, Fg Off ‘Red’ Heap.

I see this thread is also featured on the RAF Commands forum?

DW

Hi Paul,

I replied to this on RAF Commands too but thought I would also post here for the benefit of others. Did VZ338 serve with 421 SQN? I have a record that this was struck off on 22/10/51, a few weeks after the crash of our Vampire. I was wondering if it our Vampire may have been struck off a few weeks later after inspection?

Jim

From Chris on RAFCommands

The following gen is from No. 421 Squadron’s ORB’s

They were equipped with R.A.F. Vampire F.B. Mk. 5’s. The serial numbers were:

VZ240, VZ261, VZ262, VZ264, VZ268, VZ277, VZ278, VZ280, VZ284, VZ306, VZ329, VZ336, VZ339, VZ343, WA176,

WA207 made a Wheels up landing on the 26th of April, 1952 near Sutton Bridge, West Raynham, England after becoming lost in bad weather. The aircraft was written off.

WA215, WA220, WA225,

WA228 made a heavy landing in bad weather at Odiham, England on the 8th of February, 1951 and damaged the landing gear. The aircraft was repaired.

WA411

It appears Ursulak’s aircraft is currently unknown but was repairable

Would need to go through individual aircraft movement cards to see if any accident matches

Thanks all for your input and for Paul for confirming the date, which always helps. The movement of John Ursulak seems to fit with the date of the accident and it appears that he didn’t hang around after arriving in the UK, crashing a Vampire a few days later!

Hopefully someone can come up with a confirmed serial number, anyone got access to the Air Britain RAF Serials books covering the VZ2nn to VZ3nn range?

So it happened 2 October 1951

Wednesday 03 October 1951
The Yorkshire Post and Leeds Intelligencer ,

Missing jet found:
pilot unhurt After police had searched the wild moorland country,
near Haltwhistle, Northumberland, yesterday, for a
missing Vampire Jet fighter, it was reported late last night that the aircraft had made a
successful belly landing In the Gilsland Pell area about 20 miles from Carlisle.
The pilot, a Canadian, was unhurt. The ‘plane was based on Leconfleld, near Beverley.

There is a record of a Flying Officer RCAF John Ursulak travelling from Montreal to Liverpool on 21st September 1951 address c/o Air Member Canadian Joint Staff Moncorvo House, 66 Ennismore Gardens London aged 24 ie born around 1927.

434 (F) Sqn OCs
W/C J.D. Mitchener, DFC and Bar Jul 52 – Feb 53
S/L J.W. “Jim” Fiander, CD May 53 – Nov 54
S/L A.L. Sinclair, DFC, CD Nov 54 – Apr 56
S/L E.R.B. Gray, CD Apr 56 – Apr 57
W/C H.C. Stewart, AFC, CD Apr 57 – May 57
S/L J.F. Dunlop, DFC, CD Jun 57 – May 59
W/C H.F. “Harry” Wenz, CD May 59 – Jul 62
S/L John Ursulak, CD Jul 62 – Sep 62
S/L K.E. “Ken” Lewis, CD Sep 62 – Jan 63

Maybe linked to the training of 421 Sqn RCAF with RAF Vampires (Before the Sqn went to France with Sabres) in 1951 – Maybe a serial in the VZ2nn and VZ3nn range

Perhaps you can tweak the topic heading slightly otherwise people might think this is a recent incident.
Just a thought.
Thanks
Cees