Another "missing" WAAF who shouldn't be…

Ah interesting. So he was at 101 GOTU (Glider Operation Training Unit) at Kidlington which meant he would of already passed the wings course and been at the exercise unit. Cross countries in Magisters/Moths wasn’t unusual for the GPR as a refresher.

I haven’t yet looked in AIR 29/688 at Kew, but there should be something there.

Meanwhile, these details from the Inquest:

Linzee

That really is most helpful. Thank you! Not sure why a Google search had drawn a blank, but I think I had been having brain fade and entered her name incorrectly. Either way, she is commemorated at Runnymede and, strictly speaking, she should not be.

She was being carried as an unauthorised passenger and the 1180 states:

“In flight at 300ft the engine was heard to cut. A/c span, flattened out near ground, but struck ground and bust into flames. Pilot was carrying unauthorised passenger (WAAF Officer) at time. Pilot either (1) closed throttle, or, (2) engine failed. Pilot then executed a turn without putting the nose down and stalled.”

Aircraft crashed onto the sports ground at Innsworth having taken off from Staverton. I have a large file on this which I had forgotten about and it has just emerged whilst re-visiting WAAF casualties.

Now that definitely piqued my interest as Staverton is/was my home field. What caught my eye was that he was a glider pilot and that it was near Stoke Orchard which was a Glider Training School. Was wondering if Roscoe had been at Stoke Orchard for training or just a coincidence. I shall have to do some digging.

That is he!

The local undertaker’s records confirmed his body was sent by rail to Waverley Station and a quick check with local newspapers found the detail of his funeral. Thereafter, the cemetery confirmed his grave location and I notified CWGC accordingly. Thus, he was removed from CWGC registers as being recorded at Runnymede with no known grave.

Ahh.. Andy

F/O G B Penman by any chance? Now recorded as buried a few miles from my birthplace but killed in the crash of AG983 15th August 1942.

Regards
Ross

A similar case occurred with a chap called Penman (details not to hand!) who was killed in a Mustang crash in West Sussex c.1942.

I knew that his body had been found and sent back to the family for burial in Scotland, but the Runnymede error emerged when somebody applied for a licence to investigate the crash site and the licence was declined on the basis that he was ‘missing’. Sure enough, he was recorded as such at Runnymede but I tracked down his grave and notified CWGC who amended their registers. I suspect there were a good few that slipped through the net like this, mostly where the CWGC just didn’t know where they were buried and there was no record. If a private grave and headstone, and contact with NOK not possible, then CWGC obviously had a problem.

The lack of a grave marker would be reason for initial inclusion in the Runnymede register, hence why I asked if the grave had a marker in my posts on WW2 Talk.

An alternative is for the person to be CWGC registered with a grave in the churchyard but marked with a Special Class Stone denoting “buried near this spot” but location not marked.

In this case the photo proves a known and marked grave. As I was the respondee rather than the initiator I did not contact CWGC in this case to advise correction but in other items that I have reported they have checked and responded fairly quickly to say that registers will be amended immediately, new stones ordered and Runnymede panel to be corrected when next re-engraved.

Regards
Ross

Runnymede:

“….the names of airmen who fell in the 1939 – 1945 war and have no known grave.”

What are the requirements for inclusion on Runnymede? Is it the same as some other memorials around the world where if CWGC either didn’t have a grave to maintain or the location of one was too difficult then the person was commemorate on the most suitable memorial. I’ve come across this with the likes of the Singapore Memorial including people with known graves but in out of the way bits of SEA which CWGC decided were too far out (mostly Burma).

Quite interesting also that in the WW2 Talk link that Linzee gave there is an attachment which has a photo of your WAAF too.

I havent viewed it not being a member of that board.

Linzee

That really is most helpful. Thank you! Not sure why a Google search had drawn a blank, but I think I had been having brain fade and entered her name incorrectly. Either way, she is commemorated at Runnymede and, strictly speaking, she should not be.

She was being carried as an unauthorised passenger and the 1180 states:

“In flight at 300ft the engine was heard to cut. A/c span, flattened out near ground, but struck ground and bust into flames. Pilot was carrying unauthorised passenger (WAAF Officer) at time. Pilot either (1) closed throttle, or, (2) engine failed. Pilot then executed a turn without putting the nose down and stalled.”

Aircraft crashed onto the sports ground at Innsworth having taken off from Staverton. I have a large file on this which I had forgotten about and it has just emerged whilst re-visiting WAAF casualties.

Andy,

It would appear that she does have a grave http://trails.carlowtourism.com/quaker-graveyard-and-lecky-family-graveyard.html

I found that information on a thread posted on the WW2 Talk forum.
http://ww2talk.com/forums/topic/29703-molly-rosamond-evelyn-grace-nee-lecky/

Regards
Linzee

Andy,

Care to share some more information about the crash itself? You’ve piqued my interest.

Andy
At a guess she is buried in Ballykealey. her family home.

http://ballonvillage.com/index.php/ballykealey-house/

Or wherever her husband came from, Raymond E Grace. Married oct – Dec 1940.