Dive on Short Stirling?

The SAA were talking about getting a local dive club to investigate the wrecks in the SAA magazine,whether they did or not I don`t know.Still waiting to here from the chap I know regarding these sites and a few others.

Spoke to him the other night and he`s going to chat with the rest of the party.Since writing this I`ve found the site was investigated by divers connected to the Stirling Aircraft Association.

I assume the SAA divers found nothing otherwise other activities would have followed?

It is possible that the wreckage could have been reduced from 6 or 8 feet proud of the seabed when found in 1970 to virtually nothing during Bulldog’s seach some ten or so years later, but perhaps unlikely without some form of human intervention. If some form of clearance had been attempted, then the Shoreham authorities would most certainly have been aware of it. Worth asking locally.

That Bulldog conducted a wide search beyond the designated position reflects the uncertainty of the original position. Decca was relatively good for repeatablity of a position but not so hot for absolute positioning without the application of corrections for the local area. If the corrections were not applied then the position could be in error by many hundreds of metres.

A dive on the charted position would be useful to confirm ‘nothing there’ and also to establish the type of seabed – sand, shingle, exposed bed-rock etc. Then a sonar search of the surrounding area would be more productive before contemplating further dives.

Concur with Whitley_Project’s comments

Martin – your Stirling BF455 is still well worth a look, even if it is now broken up. You could still find all manner of bits and pieces. My Whitley control column came from a similar wreck.

Spoke to him the other night and he`s going to chat with the rest of the party.Since writing this I`ve found the site was investigated by divers connected to the Stirling Aircraft Association.

Hindenburg

Is your tame diver still likely to visit the BF455 site? Dispersal is unlikely, but the quoted position could well be in error being based on Decca co-ordinates which are not defined as raw or corrected readings.

That’s why I suggested it.:D

Err …if you mean the rectangular object on Google Earth at 50°49’31.76″N 0°23’51.90″E thats the sluice outfall. The dispersed wreck is slightly further out.

Apart from EF311 and it’s outings on the Forums, BF516 is the Stirling off the Sussex coast that still shows signs of still being there with what turns up on the beach in the vicinity of Sluice Lane after big storms.

(I see from Google search on Striling EF311 that it’s almost 2 years to the day that BF455 came up previously here)

Ross

Interesting Andy,would like to see them if you get time.Funny enough there`s a very large shape in the water just off the beach in the position you`ve suggested… on Google Earth………….ever hopeful!!

This was pretty much on the beach at Normans Bay.

I have Police report(s) and knew a local fisherman who pulled one of the engines out of the rocks just below LWM in 1970s. I have some press cuttings about the recovered engine, somewhere.

After a storm you can still pick up bits of airframe on the foreshore, pretty much directly in front of The Star pub. Really quite close inshore.

any idea who applied for the recovery Licence in 1975???

Thanks Ross..PM sent

There you go!

Claim salvage rights/salvor in possession based on previously landed material with the receiver of wreck and go for the rest.

Regards
Ross

In fact… I have the prop off this …..and its in lovely condition…………………….

Thanks Ross,I`ll show them this when they come over..got plans for a few dives,you never know !!!

Now if he fancies a bit of research before getting wet how about:

Hydrographer Wreck No.
013703390

Position Approximate
50 49 30.0 N
000 24 30.0 E

My notes:
10/8/43
BF516

Plotted on 536, 19/08/98
No chart symbol in this position
Details requested from H.O.

Wreck Files.
12/09/75
Permission has been given for the recovery of a Stirling from approx NG TQ 689054 (S4C(AIR)ROOM 0/3 Metropole Bldg).

RAF PMA Letter to R McNeill 24/02/98
No record of licence issued and no confirmation of recovery. (RAFPMA Letter PMA/133159/4(CS)1b(2)a(RAF) dated 24/02/98).

“August 11th – Eastbourne, Sussex.
At 05:24 in the morning the coastguard telephoned that an aeroplane had come down in Pevensey Bay and asked that the lifeboat crew should standby. A light westerly wind was blowing, with a moderate sea. Twenty minutes after the first message the lifeboat was asked to go to the aeroplane, which was a quarter of a mile off Pevensey Sluice. The motor lifeboat ‘Jane Holland’ was launched at 6:05 am. She picked up a rubber dinghy and some of the crew of the aeroplane were rescued by an RAF launch. The lifeboat returned to her station at 08:10 am.
Rewards £8 14s.”
(Source: Supplement to Annual Reports of the Royal National Lifeboat Institution 1939-46)

Regards
Ross

Thanks for that Ross..that saved him a wasted journey !!!

Sorry Martin but by the time it was written up in the Dive Series it had been recorded as dispersed.

The bread crumb trail from the Hydroggies office is:

My notes from 1998
Plotted on 1652, 12/08/98.
Charted as 8.8m wreck.
Details requested from H.O.

Reply
Wreck Files.
H1247/70 18/05/70
A four engined bomber upside down with two very large wheels and one wing. All engines are there.
Least depth over wreck 5 fathoms 1 foot in 504624N, 001436W, height above sea bed is 8 feet.
Located by Brighton and Worthing BSAC when they had to recover a trawl off her. (DW Peckham letter dated 17/05/70).

H3221/70 14/08/70
Confirmed as multi-engined aircraft after examination by ARL Scanner.
Decca position RED A 0.56, PURPLE B 75.72 (SW Brit on L(D1) 2450 only).
Position 504621N, 001400W, height above sea bed approx 6 feet (RV Clione May 1970).

H3221/70 20/01/71
Highest part stands 9 feet above seabed from sector scanner. (Mr Hardon-Jones RV Clione 14/01/71).
03/04/78 Theoretical Decca RED 2A 0.58, GREEN A 30.32, PURPLE H 75.72 (SW Brit). RED A 19.93, GREEN J 45.64, PURPLE C 60.53 (Eng).

H1965/76 03/12/80
Nothing found during intensive search within 400 metres of position. (Bulldog HI 37A/77-Wk 160)
No chart action.

D Sussex 152 (Rev 1989)
Found by by Brighton and Worthing BS-AC in 1970, this aircraft was upside down with her wheels down at 50 46 21; 00 14 00. The divers found her when recovering a trawl for a local fisherman which had caught on the wreckage. Though all the engines were there, one wing appeared to be missing. She stood 2m off the seabed, but is now widely scattered.

To complete this is from the ORB

“Stirling III BF455 captained by F/Sgt Rothschild was hit over the target by AA fire and also chased by enemy fighters.
This caused him to run short of petrol over the English Channel on the way home, and he eventually crash landed in the sea, 3 miles off Shoreham.
The wireless procedure had been perfect, and Spitfires escorted it from the French coast and a Walrus flying boat was waiting for it to crash land.
Dinghy drill was perfect and all the crew got in safely after an immaculate landing – the Stirling floating for 25 minutes.
The final scene was enacted in the Channel as the Walrus collided with the dinghy and dropped all the crew in the sea. No ill-effects except for Sgt Grainger, the flight engineer, who suffered from shock.”
AIR27/646

Regards
Ross