RE8 and Albatros reproductions for RAF Museum

I note that the R.E.8 is still on the NZ Register as ZK-TVC
http://www.regosearch.com/aircraft/nz/TVC

Which Albatros is it?
Albatros DVa-1 ZK-TVD has a Star
Albatros DVa-1 ZK-DVA has a Crescent
Kermit Weeks’ has a lightning bolt (it would have been on the ZK register during testing)

http://rnzaf.proboards.com/index.cgi?action=gotopost&board=airshow&thread=15057&post=144516

The (UK) CAA will allow foreign-registered aircraft (which meet home country requirements e.g. the NZ CAA’s) fly in the UK for a limited time (at least up to a season, it would seem).

Paul – I don’t believe anyone has made an approach about building and operating a ‘new’ Mosquito in the U.K . Bearing in mind the long history of the type on the civil register in various forms there is no reason to believe that a project with the right credentials and backing wouldn’t be accepted by the CAA.

David I thought the stumbling block apart from money was it would not be allowed to fly here,please correct me if I have the wrong impression.

Paul -nobody has said that a Mosquito couldn’t be built in the U.K . It only comes down to money!

Can someone explain to me why we can manufacture aircraft with 90 odd year old technology made of wood canvas and wire and let them fly. Where is the difference in a second world war aircraft can not! Yes I mean a Mozzie?

Nice to see that the Snipe (presumably a non-flyer?) has been put into post-WWI markings. As with most collections worldwide, the RAF Museum has comparatively few aircraft to represent the 1919-1939 period.

TVAL have just put up a batch of website updates. Besides Masterton TVAL show date confirmations (Nov 10 2012, April 27 2013, in addition to Wings Over Wairarapa 18-20th Jan and Omaka at Easter), photos of their new Pup in flight (we were expecting this, as it was registered as ZK-PPY in April) and the RAF4A Engine Build Story, there is much detail on the RE.8 Static build for the Omaka Aviation Heritage Center.

http://thevintageaviator.co.nz/projects/re8-reproduction/vintage-aviator-re8

There is an excellent 2009 thread on the aerodrome forum in the replica aircraft section by John McKenzie on the construction of his reproduction FE2b

http://www.theaerodrome.com/forum/replica-aircraft/42004-my-fe2b-reproduction.html

My FE2b reproduction..

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Several years ago,having already completed a Be2b reproduction….. (see my thread about 15 items ago on the replica aircraft listing)…it was decided by way of a follow on contract that I should construct a completely authentic Fe2b reproduction utilising “as is” the very basic nacelle frame held at RAF museum Cardington… for eventual display at Hendon……Over the next 18 years, working entirely alone in my very small workshop, components took shape as may be seen in the photo’s within this thread, culminating with a complete set of components. Lacking any facilities here to assemble and rig this 48ft x 32ft machine, as had been decided at the outset, the complete set of components, this constituting 95% of the airframe, duly arrived early in 2007 at RAF museum Cosford for fabricing and assembly etc. However it is understood that this last 5% or so has been contracted out….The complete machine as I understand it, is to be unveiled at a ceremony at RAFM on this July 1st……….Regards John

Regards

Mark Pilkington

It’s reported in a certain monthly mag that these 2 flyable aircraft built by ‘The Vintage Aviator’ team have been acquired for the museum and that there is a chance that they will be flown at a Shuttleworth display before being grounded. What a waste!

So are they really going to come,or is it supposition?.Any more news?

Unfortunately that’s not easy to do. I popped into Hendon yesterday, and found that it is still hidden in the darkest possible corner, with high barriers in front of it. It deserves to be presented in a better way. 🙁

It was good to see that the B.E.2 and Tabloid have been moved into the Grahame-White Factory though, which gives then greater accessibility. 🙂

I went there a month or so ago, & wished I’d taken my torch with me LOL. I hope that they move her to the Grahame White hangar, which is much better illuminated “or better still, move her to Shuttleworth :diablo:”.

Bob T.

John posted an excellent account of building the FE.2b on the aerodrome http://www.theaerodrome.com/forum/replica-aircraft/42004-my-fe2b-reproduction.html

The quality of the work on the FE2b is fantastic, & has to be seen to be believed

Unfortunately that’s not easy to do. I popped into Hendon yesterday, and found that it is still hidden in the darkest possible corner, with high barriers in front of it. It deserves to be presented in a better way. 🙁

It was good to see that the B.E.2 and Tabloid have been moved into the Grahame-White Factory though, which gives then greater accessibility. 🙂

Yes, I think you’ve got your wires crossed, Ian. The RAFM timeline for its F2b mentions the Irish acquisition in addition to a starboard lower wing acquired from the Shuttleworth Collection.

“The other three main wing panels came from a batch of five (79/A/511 – 515) acquired by the RAFM in July 1971 from the factory of Thomas Thompson & So Ltd, Carlow, Eire – built under sub contract c.1918 and never delivered. Five wing halves and six wing spars were acquired and initially stored at Henlow. AID stamps of 18 Sep 18 and 15 Nov 18 were found on two of the panels. At Cardington the original wing spars were retained and all ribs replaced.”

As far as I know, besides the nacelle and engine, the remainder of the FE.2b was fabricated by John McKenzie in Southampton.

There were a few other original parts “not many though”, besides the basic nacelle frame & engine, the majority of the new parts were made & assembled by John Mckenzie. Retrotech made a number of parts & also covered the airframe, & some work was also done by the RAF museum staff.
The quality of the work on the FE2b is fantastic, & has to be seen to be believed.

A lot of original structure on the F2b was needlesly replaced with newly made parts, some of the timber etc that was replaced, was in such a good condition that it ended up being used in at least one of the 2 flying aircraft that were built.

Bob T.

The RAFM’s Sopwith Triplane was ‘restored’ in the late 60s with ‘all wooden parts renewed – only metal parts retained’. Does this make it a replica? new build? composite? It’s getting on for 50 years ago so does it count as ‘vintage’?

Or the Shuttleowrth aircraft, which Sir Tom Sopwith declared to be a ‘late production’ aircraft.

Yes, I think you’ve got your wires crossed, Ian. The RAFM timeline for its F2b mentions the Irish acquisition in addition to a starboard lower wing acquired from the Shuttleworth Collection.

“The other three main wing panels came from a batch of five (79/A/511 – 515) acquired by the RAFM in July 1971 from the factory of Thomas Thompson & So Ltd, Carlow, Eire – built under sub contract c.1918 and never delivered. Five wing halves and six wing spars were acquired and initially stored at Henlow. AID stamps of 18 Sep 18 and 15 Nov 18 were found on two of the panels. At Cardington the original wing spars were retained and all ribs replaced.”

As far as I know, besides the nacelle and engine, the remainder of the FE.2b was fabricated by John McKenzie in Southampton.

An F2b is a Bristol Fighter – the biplane under discussion is a FE.2b .

To get back to the F2b for a moment, it is perhaps worth noting that the wings were rebuilt from five original ones, four of which came from Ireland. I seem to remember the date stamp October 1918 on one of the ribs

Quality Acquisitions.

There is a lot of warm air on the web about what should or should not happen to aircraft. This may be their colour schemes, details or even where or how they are operated or even if they should be flown at all etc. Of course, it’s open house. However, the subject exercising us here is much simpler.
It’s always sad to see any interesting airworthy a/c grounded for any reason, but it’s entirely understandable that the RAFM should wish to fill-in gaps and we should be unreservedly pleased that we have them there to do this on our behalf and using such an outstandingly high benchmark. In the absence of original examples, a 100% accurate flying example is as close as they are going to get. They are effectively ‘Late production’ examples.
These machines, even if fully 100% accurate, are not in and of themselves historic, so there is no need to get overly precious about them. I’m sure TVAL will knock you up your own if you have the lucre. Sure, it’d be nice to see them fly before they go into the museum, but it’s a small point when we should really be simply celebrating their acquisition.
If it’s important enough that a particular type is seen flying regularly in the UK, why not start a fund to commission TVAL to build one, perhaps to be operated by the likes of Old Warden? TVAL now have the knowledge and the skills on hand. They are hugely impressive.

The RAFM’s Sopwith Triplane was ‘restored’ in the late 60s with ‘all wooden parts renewed – only metal parts retained’. Does this make it a replica? new build? composite? It’s getting on for 50 years ago so does it count as ‘vintage’?

The FE used an original build, but unused, fuselage frame from the firm of Richard Garrett in Leiston, Suffolk (now the Long Shop Steam Museum) who built them during the First World War – so you could argue that it’s not necessarily a reproduction.

It was rumoured that a Snipe would be joining them – is this the case?

IF ONLY IT HAD A DATAPLATE :diablo:.

A number of other original parts were also included in the build of the FE2b, but the majority of it is new build. I think that everyone will have their own oppinions as to what they think it is- repro-original-composite etc etc, all I know is that she looks absolutely fantastic, & it’s a pity she never flew. Hats off to the RAF museum, Mr Mckenzie, & Retrotech etc for all their efforts.

Bob T.