RAF St Eval question

Hmmm …..Awkward
Erm changing the subject slightly [assuming this ‘is’ now a general thread on St Eval]
I am trying to investigate a plane crash on Mawgan Porth beach that happened while the St Eval Base was active. I have spent a few days now trying to find some sort of information on the plane type and its crew and as yet i cant even find it listed :confused: i know the exact location of the crash. I remember looking for and finding pieces of it as a kid in the 80’s after my uncle had told me that he had done the same in the 50’s. On his next trip to visit he presented me with the fuel mixture control that he had found there some 25-30 years before which as far as i know is still in my possession today. 😎
does anyone have any ideas as to where i might be able to get hold of the relevant info ?

Also does anyone know if there is an archive of St Eval photographs anywhere ? I used to play in the buildings up there in the 80’s too, sadly they have all been leveled now back then i had no idea of the important role the airbase played in the war……. You live, you learn

Pagen,

What is all this nonsense about?

All I did was question one thing, because the information I have, did not show what was being described as an extra over blister hanger, but which according to my now listed sources of information, told me it was a cannon butts which looked to be covered over with the structure in question…….nothing more!

There is reallly no need for you to throw all your toys out of your pram for that and deny the forum your discussion points which is exactly what it should be.
You, like me, are not the be all and end all, it’s not your forum, it’s everybodies forum and if somebody questions something which you don’t like, then discuss it, not go about it as I feel you have done to me almost from the word go and either put them down or not acknowledge their contribution or both.

I have thus far accused you of nothing other than this, but you seem to want to keep putting words into mine and possibly others mouths, to make out I have accused you of a number of things, which I have not!!!
Then you accuse me of Trolling! Well that was just plain silly!

I have gathered a considerable amount of stuff on St Eval, (possibly more than most), as I have a vested interest because of my father, but even with this you even then seem to play all of that as though it was not really worth anything, other than to use it in order that I call you a liar. That’s low! 🙁

Yes we are strangers, but how would I know who you do or don’t know?
I did not mention either Nick B or Dr Strangelove directly in our discussion and so I see no point for adding their names and your ‘relationship’ with them in our deliberations now, when I don’t know them!

Anyway, other than I ask you for the benefit of others on here to reconsider your statement and continue posting information on this forum, i’m not going to add anything further.
I am always happy to learn from others, even though it may give rise to ‘challenging questions’ in the process which I hope you should welcome.

Once again, thank you for your time

Bomberboy

I won’t be posting anymore info Nick, and will withdraw my previous scans, I have better things to do with my time to try and present information here and then for it to knocked.

Please don’t do that – I for one am really interested in what you have to say & post!

Thanks in advance… 😉

I won’t be posting anymore info Nick, and will withdraw my previous scans, I have better things to do with my time to try and present information here and then for it to knocked.

Hi guys,

Really appreciate all the effort everyone has gone to after my initial request for information and I think we can safely say we have agreed where the picture was taken… the North end of the most Westerly T-type hangar.

Can we now re-focus on all things St Eval please?

I for one would love to see some more pictures – any aircraft at the end of the most Westerly runway (the one with the turning circle) would be lovely!

Thanks,
Nick

I realy shouldn’t even try to answer that post BB, but I am incensed to be honest.
You want to get all quotey do you,

I did not deny that there was a hanger per-se, as for a start there is clearly something resembling one in the picture so where did I deny that, but it was just that according to my sources, it was a covered cannon butts and not a extra over blister hanger separated from the cannon butts as you labelled it.

Say something enough and we all believe it eh, you did actually deny it,

For those that have a good knowledge of the former RAF St Eval… was there ever a blister hangar on the North side of the airfield (outside of the peri-track), just to the West of the Church?

In a word no, but there were at least two blisters shown during the war with one located due east of the church and one located east north east of the church.

Nick, you’re bang on mate, there was an Extra Over Blister Hangar (greater span) on that spot, building no 120,

It is imediately to the east of the Cannon Test Butt but doesn’t appear to be linked to it, just the short road way running south to one of the spectacle dispersals which is visible in the current images.

Pagen, that is not what my information details.

I can absolutely assure you Bomberboy that the St Eval RSP indicates a Double Extra Over Blister Hangar (longer span and double length), blg no.120, on the precise location of Nicks and my link.
It is not on the Cannon Butts track or hardstanding, but immediately east of it, it is to the north of the peri track and just west of the church, as Nick has deduced in his first post.

So you did deny, and try to argue the point.

The point of all this, is that not one of them show what you have described, so with all this info, why would I, or anyone else for that matter, just accept a strangers word, i’m sure you would do exactly the same given the same scenario.
That being said, you then went onto state that it was shown as building 120 blah blah on the AM plans that you have and edited the airfield layout to show this accordingly.
I believe this is what you must describe as “You even refused to believe, in the face of evidence,”
What evidence?
A scan of the actual AM plan showing this area might have helped right then?

Firstly I can’t scan the AM plans as they are too big, and secondly I have produced a load of computor drawings from it to allow easier dissemination on the net, I will now, in the light of you last post, refrain from posting these up here.

Do you really think I would take time to make up information and building numbers, simply to agree with what the OP has said?
Why would I do that when in my first post I actually doubted him, until I looked at the evidence that I have here.

I have provided some the thread with sketches from the original AM plans, which did take time and effort to produce, and so truthaly I am quite peeved that you can completely disregard any information that I have provided here.
As for a strangers word, I hope Nick doesn’t consider me too much of a stranger, and I’m certainly not to Dr Stragelove, so just you.
Whenever you read a book, mag article, or forum post, you are putting your trust in strangers for much of the time, how you treat that information is up to you.

Now let me assure you, if I know little or nothing about something in particular or don’t have the relevant reference material to hand, I post nothing.

Again, please don’t assure me, I really don’t need it, you quite clearly have posted without evidence.
I have got the evidence of this building right here in front of me, and I have presented the info on the thread in a clear manner to back up both the particular points that Nick asks about.
Just because various publications don’t mention this particular point it doesn’t mean it didn’t exist, it may not be worthy of inclusion the first place.
I too have various publications on St Eval, but it doesn’t mean that I treat them as gospal on every single point about the airfield in general, which is a large subject.

Oh and one last thing, my dad was stationed there as flying crew in 1944 and I don’t ever recall him mentioning what you described.

In what respect would he have recalled anything that I have said here, and are are trying to suggest that with all that I have presented in this thread that I am lying?

I have spent a good deal of my time and effort providing evidence and drawings from primary sources to support two different viewpoints expressed while keeping an open mind on the subject.
And this is the result, I really wonder why I bother when someone such as yourself comes trolling along and in a series of words completely disregards other evidence and points of view.
And to top it all off you are making accusations about me when you haven’t actually provided any evidence yourself, where are your scans etc?! That is what I meant by ‘guff’.

The other day I answered a thread about the benefits of this forum, your posts are what I consider the negatives.

Erm pardon me, you spent several posts and clipped quotes talking absolute guff and trying to prove what others said wrong.
You even refused to believe, in the face of evidence, that there was even a blister hangar in the location being asked about!

Pagen, I’m sorry you feel aggreived, but I would appreciate your pointing out exactly what and where I said was, as you put it so elequently “talking absolute guff”. (sorry for the clipped quote by the way). 😉
Putting words into peoples mouths or just cutting them down, is not the way to discuss things, which is all that I initially saw this as in order to try and help the initial poster with the best information I had to hand.

I did not deny that there was a hanger per-se, as for a start there is clearly something resembling one in the picture so where did I deny that, but it was just that according to my sources, it was a covered cannon butts and not a extra over blister hanger separated from the cannon butts as you labelled it.

Why does the fact that someone challenges your comments mean that they don’t know anything and that you are absolutely correct as you indicated in a post where you “absolutely assured me”?

The sources I have are;

Airfield Focus 7 for St Eval
My Life with St Eval by Roy Dunstan
The Memories Linger on (A collection of reminiscences of wartime St Eval by Jean Shapland
A four part article The saga of St Eval from Westwings.
A couple of airfield maps one dated I believe post war and one marked confidential and dated 20th October 1940.
A scan of the airfield p140 of Britains Military Airfields.
Finally a scanned newspaper article from Thurs 11th Jan 2000 showing a 1940 aerial photo, but this does look similar to one in Jean Shaplands book which is dated as 1943.

The point of all this, is that not one of them show what you have described, so with all this info, why would I, or anyone else for that matter, just accept a strangers word, i’m sure you would do exactly the same given the same scenario.
That being said, you then went onto state that it was shown as building 120 blah blah on the AM plans that you have and edited the airfield layout to show this accordingly.
I believe this is what you must describe as “You even refused to believe, in the face of evidence,”
What evidence?
A scan of the actual AM plan showing this area might have helped right then?
Just saying it and editing the very layout drawing that I had eluded to, is not what I call ‘the face of evidence’ and lord knows why anyone else should.
The flash link i considered dubious for the reasons I gave, to which you replied “Please don’t advise me” was your initial posted statement which you then removed (edited).
At this point however I had decided to say no more on the type of building, which if you read the thread carefully, you will see that this is the case.

There is a very good chance however that I will meet St Eval station personnel again and it will be something that I will try and ask for myself in detail.

I had already by then however, reassessed and then commented on the particular location where I believed that the photo had been taken from, before anyone else had and this was the westerly T2 (post #13).
So what is the problem with that?
Other than perhaps to grudingly acknowledge that this was the fact!

I’m not fussed what your considerations towards me are, but I do not accept belittling or disparaging comments from the likes of you or anyone else like you, where you have done your best to make out that I add nothing.
You don’t know me and you know jack about me!

Now let me assure you, if I know little or nothing about something in particular or don’t have the relevant reference material to hand, I post nothing.

Oh and one last thing, my dad was stationed there as flying crew in 1944 and I don’t ever recall him mentioning what you described.

Thank you for your time.

Bomberboy

Erm pardon me, you spent several posts and clipped quotes talking absolute guff and trying to prove what others said wrong.
You even refused to believe, in the face of evidence, that there was even a blister hangar in the location being asked about!

Just been able to catch up on this thread and notice that the general concensus of where the picture was taken from, nicely seems to subsequently agree with my revised location assesment detailed in my last paragraph of my post (post #13).

Happy days:D

Bomberboy

From Google Earth, without the benefit of the original camera lens to shorten the pic. Pretty much the right spot ? just outside of the north doors of the western big hanger.
The markers on the horizon are the location of the blister and big north hanger and Church tower as mentioned in my previous post

Brilliant – thank you so much!

Definitely feel a ‘then and now’ moment (picture) coming on!!!

N.

Thanks flat12, that is a section of the whole photograph that I worked from to establish the locations, they should be pretty exact as I have traced over the actual locations.

There appears to have been about eight Blisters at various times, including one which was relocated to the domestic site and used as the station theatre!

From Google Earth, without the benefit of the original camera lens to shorten the pic. Pretty much the right spot ? just outside of the north doors of the western big hanger.
The markers on the horizon are the location of the blister and big north hanger and Church tower as mentioned in my previous post

Pagen
Here you go, a more exact location of the blast pens

Per the original pic question, the B markers at the top are the location of the blister hanger, red front, yellow rear corners. H is the southern corners of the main hanger and C is the Church tower, all will become apparent in the next pic.

It is often forgotten that St Eval was a Fighter Command sector station for 10 Group for a while from June 1940, squadrons based were, No 222 from 18 June, No 236 from 8 August, No 238 Squadron from 14 August. Spitfires, Hurricanes, Blenheims were used.
To this end ‘E’ type fighter blast pens were built to protect the aircraft, these also housed a stanton shelter and two escape ways in the rear middle sections. Going off aerial photos and scalling them against the runway, these pens appear to have been the larger twin engined ‘Blenheim’ type, of about 150ft across.

When the runways were extended past the original peri track in 1942 some of these pens and trackways were removed, the latter dispersals work eradicated them completely.
However with prolonged dry weather you can make out the original marks in the ground, and GE earth images below show them up quite well, I have added the E pen location and orientations to them.
In theory there should be one more pen, as they were usually built in mulitples of six, one of them may have been removed by bombing in the photo I used or maybe it wasn’t built.

st eval nw cs by Glassjar, on Flickr

st eval nw cc11s by Glassjar, on Flickr

st eval swca by Glassjar, on Flickr

st eval swcs by Glassjar, on Flickr

There was also an unusual three bay blast pen used for smaller fighter types, this is shown in the last pic, blister hangars have been anotated in grey.

The E pens would have looked like these at Perranporth, you can see the personnel escape openings, the second shot shows the stanton shelter within, and the last shot the rear exit way.

pen1 by Glassjar, on Flickr

E pen shelter by Glassjar, on Flickr

e pen exit by Glassjar, on Flickr

Sorry for the effort I’ve been putting you chaps to!

Any more St Eval pics anyone?

The photograph is said to be taken in April 1945. On 24th April AVM Mateusz Iżycki visited St. Eval. Such events were usually recorded by the Polish Air Force Film Unit and I would guess that that is when the photograph was taken. It is also likely that the PISM have many more photographs of the visit. There must be a lot of stuff in their archives that has not been published. For example there are close to a hundred photographs of 305 Squadron’s Wellington IIs taken very few people know about. Also photographs of 304 Wellingtons at Dale, Davidstow Moor, Predannack, Chivenor, Benbecula as well as St. Eval.

be awfully ‘preciated!;)
I know you lived in the MQs there for a while when your old man was at Mawgan.
Didn’t he also fly in this version (XIV?) of the Wellington?

I remember Eval as a great place to play before most of it was fenced off, forever finding merlin exhaust stubs, and the counter weights from Lancaster rudders. One day me and my mates found one of those big Yagi aerials of the type fitted to Liberators, it looked like new, very shiney stainless steel appearence but seemingly the weight of alloy. I only made
it back to St Mawgan before I hade to jettison it, it was way too big for the bike.
Shame the semi sunken and protected Ops block was demolished aswel.

Nick, or anyone else, do you want this to become a St Eval in general thread? There is other stuff I can add gradually.

Finding merlin exhaust stubs!!! Blimey! I’ve often thought there must be stuff dumped around the airfield…

Yes, happy for this to become a ‘general’ thread.

The second pic that was posted – I’m not convinced it is of St Eval, but perhaps need to study it a little closer.

Didn’t he also fly in this version (XIV?) of the Wellington?

He sure did, but mainly overseas, not at St Eval. 🙂

be awfully ‘preciated!;)
I know you lived in the MQs there for a while when your old man was at Mawgan.
Didn’t he also fly in this version (XIV?) of the Wellington?

I remember Eval as a great place to play before most of it was fenced off, forever finding merlin exhaust stubs, and the counter weights from Lancaster rudders. One day me and my mates found one of those big Yagi aerials of the type fitted to Liberators, it looked like new, very shiney stainless steel appearence but seemingly the weight of alloy. I only made
it back to St Mawgan before I hade to jettison it, it was way too big for the bike.
Shame the semi sunken and protected Ops block was demolished aswel.

Nick, or anyone else, do you want this to become a St Eval in general thread? There is other stuff I can add gradually.

No worries Nick, twas only a suggestion. Living so close to St Eval I can stop by & get more photos if required 🙂

Sorry for the effort I’ve been putting you chaps to!

Pagen01 – looking at your second plan with arrows I more convinced than ever that I’ve got the correct location (Sorry Dr. Strangey!!)

Definitely going to have to make another trip back to St Eval next year and visit the spot in person to clarify…

Any more St Eval pics anyone?