Ford Engines in Spitfires

It strikes me that CWH once took delivery of two or three V12s that were referred to as “Continental tank engines”…for potential small component spares use for the then-partway-finished Lancaster project, I think. Might they have been Continental-built variants of the Merlin’s AFV-engine cousin the Meteor?

S.

Nope, they’re HUGE aircooled behemoths. Leno has one in a car, they took off the carbs, converted it to F.I. & hung a pair of turbos on it….
Here:
http://www.jaylenosgarage.com/extras/articles/now-thats-a-hot-rod—article/

Chrysler built the engines under license.

It strikes me that CWH once took delivery of two or three V12s that were referred to as “Continental tank engines”…for potential small component spares use for the then-partway-finished Lancaster project, I think. Might they have been Continental-built variants of the Merlin’s AFV-engine cousin the Meteor?

S.

Gunston’s Encyclopaedia,1986,P.137 has: “Half a dozen development V-1650s were made by Continental”. Curiouser and curiouser.

Thanks alertken and Merlinpete for your replies,I remember reading an article back a bit ago by Graham White in EAA Warbirds mag where he said that Continental had built Merlins but not how many.

Gunston’s Encyclopaedia,1986,P.137 has: “Half a dozen development V-1650s were made by Continental”. Curiouser and curiouser.

[QUOTE=alertken; The Contienental A/c Corpn. agreed to lay down a Merlin line and preliminary arrangements were made in 1944. The project did not materialise however as it became obvious by the middle of 1944 that the additional output would no longer be required”.

[/QUOTE]

Exhibit “A”.

I don`t know, but I would assume that they were doing more than simply assembling engines to warrant having a makers plate.
I have seen another Continental-built Merlin as well, a late-model V-1650-7.
Perhaps they made a few but never went into full production or were simply an assembly line for Packard.

The attached photo is from SpitfireSpares.

Pete

No Continental Merlins

sopwith,#34: a good reason that I have seen no number might be Lloyd/Pugh, Hives & the Merlin, Icon,2004,P.107: “in 1943 demands for (Merlin) increased so heavily that the US authorities seriously considered expanding production facilities beyond (Packard). The Contienental A/c Corpn. agreed to lay down a Merlin line and preliminary arrangements were made in 1944. The project did not materialise however as it became obvious by the middle of 1944 that the additional output would no longer be required”.

Much herein on non-Derby fabrication. I recall no suggestion of superiority, whether in “tolerances” or other: only commendation of everybody’s efforts to deliver product to the fighting man.

In Sir Stanley Hookers book (Not Much Of An Engineer) (a very good read)

There are parts of that book that had me in hysterics… “Well rowed Balliol!” :D:D

(Might a Continental genav. flat 4 by now be up there with 168K Merlins?)

Possibly. I was surprised that Merlin production was greater than any of the US radials but then there were quite a lot of similarly-powered US radial engines.

Pugh has Crewe/26,065: my bad typo.

(Might a Continental genav. flat 4 by now be up there with 168K Merlins?)

Oh, of course! I should have thought of that, Kenilworth used to have an abbi

:p

Richard

I had to look up a priori

Richard

Similar to a Monastery? :D:D:D:D:D

Miniman, when I visited the Rolls Royce body line at Cowley, they were forming body panels by bashing tin into a mould with a nylon mallet, and madly lead loading seams where no other car had them (top of the C post). This was the 1990’s

Richard

As a Rolls-Royce car mechanic I can say that the cylinder liners on the V8 from 1966 up were fitted using the select fit method and on rebuild or replacement liners we measure and grind the liner to achieve the correct ‘Nip’ for sealing at the head. this is just like the video’s posted earlier on the Merlin build. pistons were also select fit being lettered to fit liners of a certain letter size. I don’t think Rolls Royce did things any differently in the car or aviation side of the business……..

I think the key to this is that car manufacturers still group components during manufacture today, and that this is not the same as selective fitting, the various components are matched so that the combination of tolerances still add up to a total that is acceptable for that particular assembly.
Pete

GM stopped doing this a few years back & as a result some GM engines sound like a bucket of bolts being thrown down a cast iron stair & others sound *ok*. The quality is pretty bloody dire overall.

Yes, clearly. My money’s on it being in ‘Magic of a Name II’ rather than by AlertKen! 😀

Appears to be a typo; they do happen!

Your figure for Merlin production at Crewe seems a little low. 😉

According to ‘British Piston Aero-Engines’ by Alec Lumsden:

Rolls-Royce Derby – 32,377 (plus 5,800 Griffons)
Rolls-Royce Crewe – 26,065 (plus 2,229 Griffons)
Rolls-Royce Glasgow – 23,647 (plus 79 Griffons)

Rolls-Royce Totals – 82,089 (plus 8108 Griffons)

Ford Trafford-Park – 30,428

United Kingdom Total – 112,517

Packard (Merlin) – 37,143
Packard (V-1650) – 18,380

United States Total – 55,523

Of the eventual total, including post-war production, of 168,040 Merlin engines, over 165,000 engines had been produced by VE-Day.

Apparently Merlin production exceeded that of any other piston aero-engine.

Pugh, Magic of a Name II, P.81 has Derby, 32,377/Crewe,6,065/Glasgow,23,647, Ford/Trafford Park, 10/41-45, 30,428 of, in all, 168,040 Merlins. CAC did 108 Mk.85s, so that leaves 75,395 in US. I have seen no breakdown of this as between Packard and Continental.

Ford Merlins

I have now received a private e mail confirming that the Trafford Factory produced over 25,000 Mk 20,22,24,25 engines between 1941 and 1945, if that helps this discussion, and their production manager received the OBE for this work.

Anyone want to trawl the BBC People’s War database, or check the RR Heritage Trust Booklets?

Ok – Quick search shows these. The first is interesting for mentioning drawings and tolerances but in a measured way. The last I would put down to basic patriotism – as always corroboration is essential.

The Development of the Merlin Engine for Lancasters

The drawings were already in America having been sent there at the fall of France, but much work remained to be done before production could commence, and the drawing staff had to work night and day to prepare working drawings from the master copies. Packards went into production in a big way, clearing their car-producing lines (for three-quarters of a mile!) and then installing completely new tools. When they started to make the engines they found some difficulty in working to Rolls Royce tolerances, but still managed to produce their first engine within a year.

From Girl to Woman in Manchester

There was an engine running which I discovered was an engine for the Merlin [engined] Bomber planes. These huge engines were dismantled after 24 hours of running. Every part being stripped down and laid on a long table where we girls had to sit and check all the different parts over and over for burns, dints, bumps and if found they had to be reported to the supervisor. These engines were then assembled and run again for 12 hours before being taken back to Metropolitan Vicars ready for going into the planes.

So you want to be a flier – An air gunner’s story

The English Merlin was always preferred against the Packard, for many said you could get more height, a precious commodity on many occasions.