Some folk buy scrap.

…… casts a furtive glance at the mainwheel from PA908 sat in the corner… 🙂

Hi Tony T, Thanks for taking the time and trouble to photograph and post them. Very nice to add to any aviation collection.
Cheers.
Jim.

Lincoln .7

Here you go Lincoln,

The one in question is on the right, it was a combined design effort by all of us original engineers and was based on the USA one… certain members wanted Groundcrew on it to stop pilots buying them…..odd that, the top left one was produced i think by Boeing and given to qualifying crews, Captains was Gold, the Co pilots was I think Silver and the Loadies White….. This I got too, though I have another original worn one I was given by a namesake Pilot, additionally the Boeing badge was also presented by Boeing and I aquired one from the rep, it is different to the other versions I have seen on the CH47 website, but is original. I also got a pair of Wessex Puma OCU badges as well, If I find someone who was on it and is wanting one I can sort that out for them……. 🙂 I also have my name badges which are like the black pilots patch, but it is not shown

Tony T. Nice to have purchased an item that has brought memories back for you, I know the feeling.
I also, (Arn’t we men all alike?) a Magpie when it comes to collecting, and one , or a damned site more that one item I collect is lighthouse/lightship redundant bits and bobs which I restore, but as with all things, it gets out of hand, so most of my collection had been donated to the museum, Hurst Castle, Isle of Wight, however, I digress. Amongst the items I collect are the old lighthouse keepers, pilots etc badges. I had the very last remaining stock of ALL badges given to me by Trinity House, London.
Most weeks go by, and there is a T.Hse lighthouse keepers embroidered cap badge on there for sale, I have contacted the seller to ask him how he has managed to find one in such pristine condition, and the reply was that he owned an outfitters shop, and supplied T/Hse, which I know for a fact is a lie, and can prove it without a doubt.He has them made especialy for him in India.
The Irish Lighthouse keepers had a Victorian cap badge which is very, very rare to come by, but every now and then a very good fake appears, and there are 2 giveaways. And where are these fakes made,?. INDIA, and BIRMINGHAM. so when buying the bullion badges or metal ones, try and know what to look for, to see if they are genuine items.
Once bitten, twice shy, as the saying goes.
Jim.

Lincoln .7

All very relevant points, I would certainly want to know if it had provenance, for sure, but PPs original point wasn`t about provenance, it was more general than that, and I still say it is worth what someone wants to pay for it, and clearly takes more than one person to bid something up.
“Old scrap” is simply an opinion of someone who can`t see the wider picture, but the whole point of a Forum is so everyone can express a view.

Pete

I’m not sure I’d totally agree with you there; the important thing, in my view, is not whether the seller answers but how reassured you are by their answer.

It is easy to find details of (say) a Hurricane lost during the Battle-of-Britain, to find one that has been excavated, when and by what group and to have some knowledge as to what may have been recovered at the time. Now, who is to know if the seller, who swears he ‘dug it himself’, is telling the truth?

A seller can choose to (or not) post questions and answers on eBay.

I never ask questions if I think other buyers may be interested…..it tips them off that I am interested! 😉

The point I was and still am making Warren, that a genuine seller is more likely to answere your question than a dodgy one. After all, it’s in the sellers interest to do so,and if you can’t be bothered to ask the questions as for the reasons you state, it’s no use shouting if you get your fingers burned.;)

Jim.

Lincoln .7

G’day folks,

There’s a danger in making objective statements about items of subjective interest. Those ‘bits of scrap’ are things that at least two people are willing to pay fifty quid to acquire. They’ve decided that there is enough probability that the items in question are what they’re claimed to be and they’re happy to pay the price of their bids.

‘One man’s rubbish is another man’s treasure.’ Who is anyone to determine what anyone can spend their hard-earned on?

If the items are as claimed (and the chances are good), the value is determined by their association. One could argue that they’re worth more by association than an unused NOS Merlin piston.

Fifty quid? Cheaper than a night out’s dinner, a couple of pints and a movie.

It’s all subjective. I collect military firearms from the Brown Bess to late No4 .303s and I have a good collection of rare examples. The most poignant and ‘valuable’ item of my collection is a nosecap from a Great War SMLE rifle. This nosecap was recovered from a French field, the site of a battle between a Welsh regiment and German forces. It is well and truly rusted but is still clearly a rifle nosecap. It was dropped over ninety years ago and nobody will ever know the circumstances. It’s worth a lot to me. So to, some pieces of aeroplane alloy.

Cheers,
Matt

I have found, that when an item such as we are describing appears on ebay, and the seller is 100% genuine, than any relevant questions asked by a prospective buyer will always be answered. And this is one of the biggest giveaways, when they don’t post answers to questions.

A seller can choose to (or not) post questions and answers on eBay.

I never ask questions if I think other buyers may be interested…..it tips them off that I am interested! 😉

Nice that you found something that was of value to you…..and a bargain too!

It totally depends on your interest, I recently bought a Sqn badge off ebay and would have quite happily paid up to about £100 for it, though I paid nothing like that……
Why you may ask, well my Chinook unit (the first) had some badges made up for the groundcrew only and we only had a very limited amount made, I.E as many as each Sqn member wanted with no spares, mine over the years got nicked from my overalls or I gave one away..
Now we are talking early eighties here and I never expected to ever see one again when lo and behold an unused one bought by a collector and kept under glass came up for sale, I bought it and the odd other one that were produced for my Squadrons, but sadly no longer exist in any way shape of form, these I will reframe and hang on my wall….. these hold a sentimental and personal feeling for me of a time never to be relived……..

Perhaps these small shards of aircraft also do the same for someone else.

Flat12x2. I have found, that when an item such as we are describing appears on ebay, and the seller is 100% genuine, than any relevant questions asked by a prospective buyer will always be answered. And this is one of the biggest giveaways, when they don’t post answers to questions.

Also be VERY aware of the auctions that only last a few days, and not a full week or more.
Hope this helps, I am sure there, in fact I KNOW that there are members here who, should you have the chance of buying something your not sure of, just ask, you would be surprised at the responce you will get.Providing you do collect naturaly.

Jim.

Lincoln .7

And also, did anyone noticed that not a single person of the 9 bidders asked a single question regarding this item, which looks remarkably like a bit of the ally chassis of my Grandsons Go Cart, seriously.

Jim.

Lincoln .7

I think you have to set it up for any questions to show on the auction page, I have asked many questions of ebay sellers (and got answers) and only a few have shown up on the ebay page.

Well I’d pay a few quid more than that but I don’t think I’d ever pay enough to win an auction of ‘Dambusters’ relics. For ten quid it’d be worth having that chat with the vendor, asking the awkward questions and getting the ‘feel’ of the truth from him, but how small would a piece have to be to go for only ten quid…..a single rivet?

And also, did anyone noticed that not a single person of the 9 bidders asked a single question regarding this item, which looks remarkably like a bit of the ally chassis of my Grandsons Go Cart, seriously.

Jim.

Lincoln .7

I think I would want to be a bit more certain that it was as advertised before I parted with any money!

Ditto.

Jim.

Lincoln .7

I personaly wouldn’t give a single penny for it.

Well I’d pay a few quid more than that but I don’t think I’d ever pay enough to win an auction of ‘Dambusters’ relics. For ten quid it’d be worth having that chat with the vendor, asking the awkward questions and getting the ‘feel’ of the truth from him, but how small would a piece have to be to go for only ten quid…..a single rivet?

[QUOTE=Tangmere1940;1758354]Provenance with items like this is everything, of course. However, how does one actually establish a provenance on any item like this unless one witnesses its recovery. Quite simply, one doesn’t. But very often a fraud is obvious, a vendor is “dodgy” or things seem too good to be true. On the other hand, one often gets a “feel” for if something is right or not –

I couldn’t agree more Andy?. you do get a feel for these things. however, I have a new “Spitfire” short skirt piston, con rod and a full set of new piston rings as part of my collection, and could well, and truthfully state it’s from a Merlin. (Peter Grieve certified, and thats good enough for me, and a set of inlet and exhaust valves). What is to say that I couldn’t put them all on ebay and state they all came from Guy Gibsons Lanc?.Well, it did have 4 Merlins, didn’t it?.
Nothing, which is why I agree provenance, and actualy being there when the piece is dug up, means buying junk, and/or the real deal.
Jim.

Lincoln .7

Provenance with items like this is everything, of course. However, how does one actually establish a provenance on any item like this unless one witnesses its recovery. Quite simply, one doesn’t. But very often a fraud is obvious, a vendor is “dodgy” or things seem too good to be true. On the other hand, one often gets a “feel” for if something is right or not – and experienced collectors and e-bayers will know what I mean. That said, most collectors and dealers have all been stung at some time or another!

Certainly, there have been scams – especially with Dams raid stuff. However, and I don’t know why, but I just get a feel that these are right. And no, I’m not the vendor, not connected with him and have no idea who he is.

Is it worth the price? Its worth what anyone is prepared to pay for. But, if the items are from the said Dams raid Lancaster then, yes, they are certainly “worth” this when one considers what Dams raid items and artefacts from Dams raid aircraft fetch and the value they maintain. It might be so much scrap to some, just as shreds of red fabric from Richthofen’s Fokker tri-plane might be considered bits of rubbish or junk to others. However, Piston Power, I rather suspect that even if you do consider such items to be scrap or junk that you would not treat them as such if they came into your possession. Of course, if they did come into your hands then I’d willingly give you scrap value for them! Cash waiting, as they say.

C.D. Just looking at the item on Ebay, I personaly wouldn’t give a single penny for it. I know you collect like me, and you know what I have, from pistons, Master con rods, singles, Merlin pistons,valves, radials etc etc. But before I part with a single penny, I make 100% certain the goods are as described, if rare, they have a known provenance that I can check out.
I have very nearly fallen foul to one or two deals on Ebay, and an sorry to say the Americans are the worst offenders of this.and have pulled out of 2 deals within the last few months because they were scams. Complain to Ebay, and the don’t want to know.It’s all to easy to print off a nice looking C.O.A. just to get those few extra pounds/
Guess it’s the old saying, “Buyer beware”.
Jim.

Lincoln .7

Me. 😮 Sorry.