Westland Whirlwind Shipped To The USA 1942

sorry…..tyhat would be the coast off Jersey

[sorry omitted to tell you, that the report had been somewhere of the coast of Jersey…..There were in all quite a few possible Whirlwinds lost in this area anyway…..]Hi Jerry I know that you are over there and well I’m still here in Blighty, but the owner of the Battle of Britain museum in Hawkiinge, once told me ( a year or two ago, I would guess) that some divers, possibly from the U.S.A had found the outline of what appeared to be a wrecked Whirlwind off the coast somewhere, anyone you know with diving contacts over there?…..[/QUOTE]

rumours of Whirlwind of Jersey

Hi Jerry I know that you are over there and well I’m still here in Blighty, but the owner of the Battle of Britain museum in Hawkiinge, once told me ( a year or two ago, I would guess) that some divers, possibly from the U.S.A had found the outline of what appeared to be a wrecked Whirlwind off the coast somewhere, anyone you know with diving contacts over there?…..

Hi
yeah still in canada,looks like it’s permanent now.
I have a few leads I am trying but no success yet, i am still amazed that I can’t find any photos.
I can’t remember if it was NARA or college park, that had a file/s on testing british aircraft, college park gave me the reference in a response to a letter requesting info on P6994, hoping next year to somehow get a trip to the archives ….
cheers
Jerry

J.P Coyne

J.P Coyne got a roasting from your uncle for the way in which he man handled a Whirlwind…….It would be interesting to hear the tape you have…..

I am a nephew of the late W/Cmdr Thomas P Pugh, DFC who served with 263 Squadron between June 1940 and February 1942 and as S/Ldr was Commanding Officer from August 1941.

Prompted by having recently made a good copy of the audio from a BBC recording from January 1942 on 78rpm 12” vinyl of Uncle Tom giving an account of a sortie to a German airfield in coastal France, for my father for Christmas, I have been doing some research on Uncle Tom.

Going through 263 Squadron records it appears that Uncle Tom flew Whirlwind P6994, among many others and in particular was the pilot who baled out of P6984 on 29 January 1941 due to double engine failure. For a short period when he was Squadron CO, P7116 was his “personal mount”. Whilst I haven’t made a full tally I note that others included P6977, 6990, 6995, 6996, 7004 and 7007.

My father has a few pictures of his brother but I would be really interested to know if you have any other images that might include Uncle Tom or the aircraft that he flew during his time with 263 Squadron and if you might be able to make any available. Uncle Tom is seated second row, fourth from the left (black sheepskin flying jacket) in the Squadron photo attached to one of your posts (I have a version of this photo).

Uncle Tom was later W/Cmdr with 182 Squadron operating Typhoons and was KIA on 2 August 1943 divebombing a destroyer in Dunkirk harbour. My father S/Ldr Robert M Pugh AFC RAF (Ret’d) flew Wellingtons with Coastal Command in particular with 38 Squadron in Libya in 1943. His other brother P/O John C Pugh was killed in a Spitfire crash in 1940.

It would certainly be great to be able to gather some images to accompany the copy I have made of the recording.

Thanks in anticipation.

Anthony[/QUOTE]

Jerry,

Thanks for the kind offer. I have sent PM with my e-mail address.

I see there is a picture of P6984 in Crawford & Listerman’s book “Allied Wings No4 – Westland Whirlwind Mk.1”. I only got the book yesterday having purchased it on Amazon for my father for Christmas, yet to have a good read before wrapping!

Cheers

Anthony

Hi Anthony,
e mail sent, let me know if it doesn’t arrive, (I have had a few e mail prob’s recently).
cheers
Jerry

Jerry,

Thanks for the kind offer. I have sent PM with my e-mail address.

I see there is a picture of P6984 in Crawford & Listerman’s book “Allied Wings No4 – Westland Whirlwind Mk.1”. I only got the book yesterday having purchased it on Amazon for my father for Christmas, yet to have a good read before wrapping!

Cheers

Anthony

Joe,

I am a nephew of the late W/Cmdr Thomas P Pugh, DFC who served with 263 Squadron between June 1940 and February 1942 and as S/Ldr was Commanding Officer from August 1941.

Prompted by having recently made a good copy of the audio from a BBC recording from January 1942 on 78rpm 12” vinyl of Uncle Tom giving an account of a sortie to a German airfield in coastal France, for my father for Christmas, I have been doing some research on Uncle Tom.

Going through 263 Squadron records it appears that Uncle Tom flew Whirlwind P6994, among many others and in particular was the pilot who baled out of P6984 on 29 January 1941 due to double engine failure. For a short period when he was Squadron CO, P7116 was his “personal mount”. Whilst I haven’t made a full tally I note that others included P6977, 6990, 6995, 6996, 7004 and 7007.

My father has a few pictures of his brother but I would be really interested to know if you have any other images that might include Uncle Tom or the aircraft that he flew during his time with 263 Squadron and if you might be able to make any available. Uncle Tom is seated second row, fourth from the left (black sheepskin flying jacket) in the Squadron photo attached to one of your posts (I have a version of this photo).

Uncle Tom was later W/Cmdr with 182 Squadron operating Typhoons and was KIA on 2 August 1943 divebombing a destroyer in Dunkirk harbour. My father S/Ldr Robert M Pugh AFC RAF (Ret’d) flew Wellingtons with Coastal Command in particular with 38 Squadron in Libya in 1943. His other brother P/O John C Pugh was killed in a Spitfire crash in 1940.

It would certainly be great to be able to gather some images to accompany the copy I have made of the recording.

Thanks in anticipation.

Anthony

Hi Anthony
I have a copy of the crash report for P6984, PM me with your e mail, and I will send it if you want ?
cheers
Jerry

Thanks Jerry, are you still the other side of the pond? Did you ever find out if anyone in the Pensicola/Eglin area had any other memories of the Whirlwind there? I know you have already posted a number of observations on this,don’t suppose anyone in the powerboat fraternity ever had any information on what happened to the twin Pergrines…

Hi
yeah still in canada,looks like it’s permanent now.
I have a few leads I am trying but no success yet, i am still amazed that I can’t find any photos.
I can’t remember if it was NARA or college park, that had a file/s on testing british aircraft, college park gave me the reference in a response to a letter requesting info on P6994, hoping next year to somehow get a trip to the archives ….
cheers
Jerry

Does anybody have access to a copy of ‘Peregrine Aero Engine – Air Publication 1761A’?

PM me your email CD, I think I can help…

Stuart

Thanks Jerry, are you still the other side of the pond? Did you ever find out if anyone in the Pensicola/Eglin area had any other memories of the Whirlwind there? I know you have already posted a number of observations on this,don’t suppose anyone in the powerboat fraternity ever had any information on what happened to the twin Pergrines…

S/Ldr T P Pugh 263 Squadron

Joe,

I am a nephew of the late W/Cmdr Thomas P Pugh, DFC who served with 263 Squadron between June 1940 and February 1942 and as S/Ldr was Commanding Officer from August 1941.

Prompted by having recently made a good copy of the audio from a BBC recording from January 1942 on 78rpm 12” vinyl of Uncle Tom giving an account of a sortie to a German airfield in coastal France, for my father for Christmas, I have been doing some research on Uncle Tom.

Going through 263 Squadron records it appears that Uncle Tom flew Whirlwind P6994, among many others and in particular was the pilot who baled out of P6984 on 29 January 1941 due to double engine failure. For a short period when he was Squadron CO, P7116 was his “personal mount”. Whilst I haven’t made a full tally I note that others included P6977, 6990, 6995, 6996, 7004 and 7007.

My father has a few pictures of his brother but I would be really interested to know if you have any other images that might include Uncle Tom or the aircraft that he flew during his time with 263 Squadron and if you might be able to make any available. Uncle Tom is seated second row, fourth from the left (black sheepskin flying jacket) in the Squadron photo attached to one of your posts (I have a version of this photo).

Uncle Tom was later W/Cmdr with 182 Squadron operating Typhoons and was KIA on 2 August 1943 divebombing a destroyer in Dunkirk harbour. My father S/Ldr Robert M Pugh AFC RAF (Ret’d) flew Wellingtons with Coastal Command in particular with 38 Squadron in Libya in 1943. His other brother P/O John C Pugh was killed in a Spitfire crash in 1940.

It would certainly be great to be able to gather some images to accompany the copy I have made of the recording.

Thanks in anticipation.

Anthony

Went through the Ashworth photo/neg collection and he has about 80 Whirlwind aircraft prints, and another dozen negatives. Thought I might be able to help. But I am certain this neg and print have wrong ID. They ID this as 6994 and I am fairly certain it is 6984. Thought I would offer it here for enjoyment AND.. confirmation? There are a number of photos that only show the side lettering Reg #s and not the SNs numerals on the lower rear fuselage. (so a few are not yet ID’d) I am assuming (never ASSUME! :eek:) that 6994 only had the SN numerals and no reg lettering, when it was shipped to U.S.? Rob traded for many of his negatives and photos and almost always listed the source, if so. Some of these prints have notes on the back “please do not publish.” and the original owner’s name and early date of photos from their own album. Many others will be familiar photos such as the prototypes and armament details, and a few crashes.

Does anybody have access to a copy of ‘Peregrine Aero Engine – Air Publication 1761A’?

No intention to hijack this thread, but is there a source of accurate Whirlwind drawings/blueprints?

Thanks

Hi,
PM me your e mail address and requirements, and I will see what I have.
cheers
Jerry

Wirlwind Blurprints

A good book on the Whirlwind is this one:-

“WHIRLWIND” The Westland Whirlwind Fighter

By Victor Bingham

ISBN 1 835310 004 8

Airlife Publishing.

Regards
Mark

No intention to hijack this thread, but is there a source of accurate Whirlwind drawings/blueprints?

Thanks

I went to Kew and found the index card for the shipment of the Whirlwind, on it did say’Waterland’ but I could find no reference to any ship in the Merchant Navy with that name, perhaps an American ship. a Merchant Navy researcher suggested that ‘WaterLand ‘ was just the method of dispatch. i.e Water and Land….so perhaps this is a red herring~?

Hi
previously in the thread

a ship of the royal dutch lloydd, which why you may have trouble searching for her…

P6994 left liverpool on the Koninklijke Hollandsche Lloyd WATERLAND 6,847 built 1922, which sailed in Convoy ON101 which departed 05 Jun 1942 from Liverpool, arriving at Boston on 18 Jun 1942.

cheers
Jerry

There’s on on E-bay, 4 hours to go. £20.00

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/The-Westland-Whirlwind-Fighter-Victor-Bingham_W0QQitemZ190356084449

A good book on the Whirlwind is this one:-

“WHIRLWIND” The Westland Whirlwind Fighter

By Victor Bingham

ISBN 1 835310 004 8

Airlife Publishing.

Regards
Mark

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Whirlwind-Westland-Victor-F-Bingham/dp/1853100048/ref=sr_1_8?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1260707123&sr=1-8

at this price, I’d expect it to come with a free intact Whirlwind !!!

A good book on the Whirlwind is this one:-

“WHIRLWIND” The Westland Whirlwind Fighter

By Victor Bingham

ISBN 1 835310 004 8

Airlife Publishing.

Regards
Mark

Browns aircraft was relatively intact when it came down on the 23rd january 1943…

I went to Kew and found the index card for the shipment of the Whirlwind, on it did say’Waterland’ but I could find no reference to any ship in the Merchant Navy with that name, perhaps an American ship. a Merchant Navy researcher suggested that ‘WaterLand ‘ was just the method of dispatch. i.e Water and Land….so perhaps this is a red herring~?

http://www.flitzerart.com/ww2.htm

some artwork here – I’ve touted this WWW site before, I like this stuff, especially the “what if’s”.

the guy posts on the secret projects forum, I’m sure if you contact he’ll say where he got the details for the scheme from, may have been a picture

Hi BSG-75,

Not seen that site before, and the Whirlwind there with the stripes on the wings is in incorrect ‘Operation Starkey’ colours. The white bands should cover the roundels.

There is and ‘Operation Starkey’ site but even on there the info is obscure. Which is why some of us have been chasing photos instead.

All the best,

Steve.