Avion anciens threads

Bristols! Just that so many of the aeroplanes I thought I’d never see as a young enthusiast have all metamorphised.

John

Thanks John – useful to have the 1910 reference to “ornithopter”

Roger Smith.

ps which is tagline? the three Bristols or ex-member of Midland A.M.??

Roger

Sorry I got the title wrong, it’s Peter Lewis’s British Aircraft 1809-1914 (Putnam)and the quotation was on the page dealing with the Passat Ornithopter page 382. I was just tickled by this bird like thing heading quite naturally for a tree.

In my copy of “How to Fly”,(Richard Ferris Pub Nelson 1910) the term and description “Ornithopter” appears in the Glossary.
By the way I couldn’t agree more with your tagline.

John

…… British Aeroplanes 08-14 ………One entry had me chuckling, “The ornithopter flew sucessfully until it’s progress was arrested by a tree”. John

John, which “British Aeroplanes..” is this and do you know when it was published?

I am intruiged to know when the word “ornithopter” first came into use.

In some long-term research I am doing into the aeronautical work of Major Ross Franklin Moore (ex Indian Army/RE) I have a references to him in “The Aeronautical Journal” over a period of 9 – 10 years. In 1909 he and Mr Handley Page* were both on the Wings Committee of the Aeronautical Society of Gt. Britain (later the R.Ae.S) and jointly submitted a report “Experiments with flapping wings”. Three years earlier Moore wrote a brief article for the AJ “Wings versus aeroplanes”. The “wings” via their flapping motion provide both lift and forward motion whereas “aeroplanes” need the addition/disadvantage of a screw propellor. We might be amused now with hindsight but this was serious stuff.

It therefore seems to be the case that, even in 1909, (near, I assume, to the time when flapping wing experiments ended) the term “ornithopter” was not in use – at least by such an august body as the Aeronautical Society.

Roger Smith.

* The title of the published report has “….and S.H.Page.” I presume this was a typographical error and it should have read F.H.Page – or were there two brothers???

I’ve just finished reading the autobiography of the Hon. Mrs Victor Bruce (‘Nine Lives Plus’) which, unsurprisingly, deals with the demise of the Satyr – or was it? Both Don Brown (‘Miles Aircraft since 1925’) and A.J.Jackson (‘British Civil Aircraft 1919-72’) suggest that the Satyr was destroyed when Mrs Bruce crashed it in August or September 1936. However Mrs Bruce suggests otherwise. In her autobiography, of the circumstances of the crash (“on the green outside Stafford”) she says:

“Suddenly there was an almighty crash. I thought that I had hit one of the houses, because the noise was terrific. Then I realised that I had flown into the telephone wires. The Satyr and I must have remained hanging inthe wires for at least half a minute. Then the wires gave way and we fell fifteen feet to the ground with a bang”.

She goes on to say that:

“The Satyr, of course, was badly damaged…………..”

and then:

“While the Satyr was being repaired I hired a Gipsy Moth to take its place in the show……….”.

So did the Satyr survive the crash; and was it repaired; and, if so, what was its ultimate fate? Any suggestions, anyone?

Now this reminds me of the demise of the Miles Satyr. In ‘Miles Aircraft since 1925’ Don Brown recounts the tale as follows:

“The end of the Satyr was unusual and dramatic. One day in September 1936 Mrs Victor Bruce was approaching to land in a small field and, at the last moment, when it was too late to take evasive action, she noticed a large mass of telephone wires dead ahead, so close that there was no time either to climb or dive under them. Thinking what bad luck it would be on all the people whose telephones would be disconnected, she sailed on gaily into the wires expecting to go straight through them. However, she had overlooked the number of wires and the low momentum of the little Satyr. Instead of passing through the wires and landing in the field, the wires stretched but did not break. In a matter of seconds the Satyr was stopped dead in the air and then catapulted backwards into the field over which it had just flown. It was all over in a flash. Mrs Victor Bruce was unhurt but it was the end of the Satyr. This must be one of the few instances in which an aeroplane has landed backwards, although not very successfully.”

Did any similar incidents occur on aircraft carriers equipped with braking wires (or whatever is the correct technical term for these bits of kit – it’s not my field)? Being slung back into the briny would, I imagine, have been a little more traumatic than the Hon. Mrs Victor Bruce’s experience in the Miles Satyr.

Wittering! Blimey John, I’ve just made the connection! As you say, a long time.

…
One entry had me chuckling, “The ornithopter flew sucessfully until it’s progress was arrested by a tree”

by the by, i remember a salvage squad episode, where they rebuilt an old puss moth (or something very similar) with the last entry in the loogbook being

“pranged kite into hill”

they had a wonderful way of wording things back then 😀

Thanks Steve, It’s a long time since the old Wittering days.

Regards

John

That is a fascinating photo, thanks for sharing it. The quote is great too!