166 Sqn Lanc

Take it you have seen this:
http://www.aircraftresourcecenter.com/Rev1/901-1000/Rev916_Zotz48015/04.jpg

and this:
http://www.ww2aircraft.net/forum/album/black26-white-photos/p684-fair-fighter-27s-revenge.html

There is a good photograph of her in the IWM collection at Lambeth. I have a copy and a scan on the other computer

There is a copy of it posted here :

http://www.lancaster-archive.com/lanc-noseart-d-f.htm

As a coincidence we are in the process of painting the artwork onto a small piece of Lancaster fuselage.

fair fighter revenge

hello ll.

many thanks for all your help..

my aunts husband warrant officer ARTHUR DOWNS DFM flew in both of the named aircraft .

he actually named the lancaster as he said all they wanted was a fair fight …….hence the name was given….

the first fairfighter crashed at woodbridge and broke in half on return from a mission . it was badly shot up with engines out … for getting the aircraft and the crew home arthur downs was awarded the DFM… at that time he was a flight engineer…….

after the war arthur never flew again ….he said it brought back too many bad memories …

once again thank you for all your help

best regards paul…….:)

hello all .

looking for info and pictures of a special lancaster bomber from 166 sqn .

the lanc was named FAIRFIGHTER later name FAIRFIGHTERS REVENGE .

my aunty who,s in here seventys . her husband flew in her and is trying to find out about her late husbands aircraft …

can any one help… any info would be of great help and interest to my aunt….

many thanks paul……..:)

Paul
Hi, my grandad flew in both these planes ( sadly no longer with us ) his name was Fred Holyoak and was the wireless operator, he also recieved a medal for helping to keep flames down when Fairfighter was hit. These stories I’ve heard from my dad ( Fred’s eldest son ) and my nan, my dad has documents and more stories, does your Aunt have a print copy of that painting of Fairfighter ?
Regards
Mark

Hello Paul, get yourself a copy of the book ‘Claims To Fame The Lancaster’ by Norman Franks, which has full details on Lancaster ME812 ‘Fair Fighters Revenge’ with crew lists and details of all the 105 operations she flew, as well as a photo of the crew and her nose art. There is also a picture of her on page 54 of ‘Lancaster at War 3’ by Mike Garbett and Brian Goulding.

166 sqn

thanks you all…..

hey mark H i wonder if my aunt new your grandad . she was very much in with the reunions …

yes my aunt does have a painting of fairfighter on her wall at home …

ive an original photo of fairfighters nose section …

send me a PM ….

thanks for the book advice captain slow . will try and find a copy …

best regards

paul…………:)

I was amazed to find these photos of Lancaster ME812 Fair Fighter’s Revenge, including my dad, pilot F/Sgt and later F/O Keith Groves with crew.  He’s gathered with crew under the wing of the plane smoking a cigarette, in 2 other photos sat in the cockpit looking out and in another photo in the centre of the crew of 7 with 4 kneeling in front whom I think might be ground crew..  Thanks very much to whoever posted these photos.

My Dad said that it was difficult scrambling in and out over the main wing spar so he used to drop his parachute from the cockpit window and then retrieve it.

He grew up on a farm in Australia, trained there, and came to England via the US and on Queen Mary as a troop ship across the Atlantic, to join the war effort.  No doubt others from Australia/New Zealand came the same way.

For other families to hopefully find this thread, photos and information, the crew members who transferred with my dad from 166 Squadron at Kirmington as founder members of 153 Squadron at Scampton were  …

A426695  F/O        Groves,K.G              PILOT

1697884  Sgt         Clay,E                       F/Eng

A419059  F/Sgt     Selkirk,R.R              A/B

A426662  F/Sgt     McDonnell,N.D     NAV

A419185    F/Sgt     Kirby,H.B                W/Op

A426975   F/Sgt     Healy,W.C              MU/G

1667173     F/Sgt     Foot,W.H.J             R/G

I think they kept together as a crew for their 32 operations, apart from possibly earlier changing the wireless operator.  I have records for their operations in 153 Squadron at RAF Scampton mostly in Lancaster PB633 but don’t have records of their operations in 166 Squadron from RAF Kirmington.  ME812 Fair Fighter’s Revenge also transferred from 166 to 153 Squadron, but they are not recorded as having flown ME812 from RAF Scampton which leads me to suspect that they flew it and maybe the photos were taken at RAF Kirmington before 7th October 1944, the date of their first Op from Scampton.

When they completed their tour of 32 operations in mid December 1944, he went on to RAF Transport Command flying freight from RAF Lyneham to support the war in the Far East.  He was awarded the DFC for gallantry which he says was for the whole crew.  Their rear gunner, a big Yorkshireman used to stand up in the small cramped turret instead of sitting, to look down and be sure to see and catch any enemy fighters coming underneath from behind.

The very next trip after their tour, PB633 on an Op to Ulm in Germany with a different crew was involved in a mid-air collision, I think in bad weather and I think whilst returning, and crashed near Laon in Northern France on 18th December 1944, with the loss of 4 crew who are buried there.  3 from the rear of the plane survived and with help from US troops they got back to RAF Scampton 10 days later.

Afterwards my dad was a commercial airline pilot flying extensively based in Australia, Indonesia, Switzerland, Beirut and for some time in the UK, where I live.  In the 40s and 50s there were still a number of aircraft crashes and occasionally into the 60s.  At age around 85 he returned to Sydney, Australia, visited England again in 2012 in a group of 100 Australian veterans for the unveiling of the Bomber Command Memorial at Green Park in London and passed away in Sydney aged 94. Very lucky indeed, and we were lucky to travel extensively and live in the places mentioned.

I would be delighted to have contact with any family of other crew members.  Around 10 years ago we had the pleasure of meeting with the Selkirk family of their bomb aimer near Melbourne, Australia.

Thanks again

Paul Groves

I am pretty certain that the IBCC at Lincoln had a poll of sorts and the Hatchette model (Weekly parts issue) they had, was built in the guise of FFF

Hello John. I’ve been away for some time. I would dearly like to meet Sid coole grand daughter. Could you possibly arrange contact at all please. Do you know the 2019 reunion details at kirmington this year . Best regards Paul

Awesome!

This weblink has just been forwarded through concerning James Kiltie #23 http://www.maybole.org/community/citizens/profiles/SgtJamesKiltie/index.htm

A photograph of him was located! 🙂

That is fantastic. I just had a look at the link.

This weblink has just been forwarded through concerning James Kiltie #23 http://www.maybole.org/community/citizens/profiles/SgtJamesKiltie/index.htm

A photograph of him was located! 🙂

As others have already said – An amazing thread, with some wonderful photos.

I feel a scale model of Fair Fighters Revenge is imminent; I happen to have a ‘spare’ Airfix Lancaster in the stash… 😉

From a modelling perspective I have a question.
If you look at the photo’s of the lanc, particularly the engine exhaust stains, it looks as if the exhaust is escaping the shroud? I would have expected the exhaust to go out the back of the shroud, not downward?
Something interesting to model.

As others have already said – An amazing thread, with some wonderful photos.

I feel a scale model of Fair Fighters Revenge is imminent; I happen to have a ‘spare’ Airfix Lancaster in the stash… 😉

A photograph of Bruce Forrester Bird has now been sourced for the memorial in Goudriaan.

We are still looking for leads regarding – “Flight Sergeant James Kiltie, wireless operator, age 22, service number 986311”

Current leads include possible relatives in Ayrshire (an active potential contact is already underway there); plus another possible lead in Devon.

Further details of the Dutch memorial can be found here!

Earlier today I managed to make a positive contact in the south of England with regard to Bruce Forrester Bird. 🙂

So I thought that one quick bump might be in order to see whether anyone might be able to assist with: “Flight Sergeant James Kiltie, wireless operator, age 22, service number 986311”

I hope that you won’t mind me tagging the following appeal onto this thread, which seemed like an ideal place as it refers to another 166 Squadron Lancaster.

I have been asked to try and assist a group in the Netherlands who are preparing a commemorative display board in the memory of a crew. Here are the background details:

“In the village of Goudriaan, are 5 graves of the crew of R.A.F. Lancaster ND956, AS-I, 166 squadron that came back from Germany after bombing Duisburg. I was shot down by a Messerschmidt, a German fighter. This was in the night of 21-22 May 1944.

The people and the Municipality of this village take good care of the graves and every May 4th we have the commemoration of our and allied fallen men and women. By this crash two men escaped death, were arrested and brought to Stalag Luft 7 near Bankau in Poland.”

They are trying to obtain photographs of the following crew members:

Flight Sergeant James Kiltie, wireless operator, age 22, service number 986311

Bruce Forrester Bird, navigator, age 23, service number 155025

If anyone is able to assist them please PM me; if you would prefer me to post this elsewhere then also please let me know.

More photos

I have more photos that I am archiving from my Grandfather, Neil McDonnell’s collection. Hope you guys enjoy them.

Regarding Australian F/Sgt

Very interesting posts.N.D McDonnell the Nav in F/Sgt Groves crew.He was an Australian F/Sgt A.426662 posted to 166 on 06.08.44 and to 153 Sqn on 07.10.44.The crew went missing on 22/23.1.45 Duisburg,if I have the right chap.
I think the photo was taken on 153 Sqn not at Kirmington but I could be wrong!

Yes my Grandfather was Australian F/Sgt A.426662 posted to 166 on 06.08.44 and to 153 Sqn on 07.10.44. I am not sure about the crew going missing on early 45 but my grandfather didn’t pass away until 2008, so he must have been a lucky one?!? I have a lot of documentation but I can’t understand half of it!

Fair Fighters Revenge….

I’m amazed that someone else has a copy of the photo of Fair Fighters Revenge with the crew milling around under the wing!

I would never have thought two copies would have survived almost 70 years!

By the way, the third photo showing the grouping on the wing of the Lanc could include my grandfather- he may be the dour looking chap on the front right hand side as we look at the photo….but its not quite clear enough for me to make out!

MWMike

When folks are having a grumble or go as far as a flounce in relation to what is posted on this forum they should take a look at threads like this. Amazing stuff.

I agree 100%. Makes a refreshing change. Excellent story. I love threads like this. Well done!:)