258, 317, 72 and 308 Squadrons (Stabrowski)

That would be very interesting. Thanks

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apparently he flew this plane the same summer this picture was taken, even though this isn’t him in the picture I can imagine it being so.

Excellent information.

P8647 was ZF*Y. In mid-July 1941 303 Squadron left Northolt and the Polish Wing was reorganised. Spitfire IIbs orginally delivered for 306 Squadron were taken over by 308 Squadron and 308 Squadron’s surplus Mk IIas transferred to the incoming 315 Squadron. Many Polish pilots had preferred letters and it is not unsual for them to transfer the letter to a new mount.

The other possibility is that the other Spitfire is a Mk Vb. 308 Squadron began conversion to Mk Vs at the end of August. In the middle of August oders were issued to change the camouflage from the Temperate Land Scheme (Green/Brown) to the Day Fighter Scheme (Grey/Green) with yellow leading edges on the wings. I cannot see the yellow leading edges on the wings on the second Spitfire which is why I think it is more probable a Mk IIb.

I agree but the Far Left and Far right photos are of the same spitfire so maybe the one with the canons was relabeled with the ZF-Y?

The left and right photographs are not the same Spitfire, they have a different shaped spinner. The one on the left has cannons so might be Spitfire Mk IIb P8647. Spitfire Mk IIb were used from mid-July 1941 at Northolt.

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Yes if you look at these two photos you can see the faint Y underneath the prop and you can see the drunken angel on one. my guess is that both photos were taken at the same day. as the prop is in the same position

The photograph is a known one of a unidentified 308 Spitfire Mk IIa at Chilbolton, late June 1941, just before moving to Northolt. The large chessboards are typical of 308 Squadron at this time.

It is possible that your photograph provides additional information as I do not recall any version that shows the individual letter ‘Y’. The white patch looks like it could be the angel and there appears to be small letters following the ‘Y’. YWONA?

From the lists published by Wojtek Matusiak there was one Spitfire Mk IIa coded ZF*Y, P7919.

Another photograph taken at the same time. Notice the fitter is wearing slippers.

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From some recent review of many photos it seems that this was the spitfire that eventually became the “Drunken Angel”

That makes a lot of sense, I’ll take a look at his school records tonight and see where he was stationed. Well anything I can decipher.

I think you mean Ułęż. That is a letter L with a stroke through it not a letter T.

Polish Air Force Training establishments were combined at two centres.

No 1 Air Force Training Centre (CWL-1) that included the Air Force Cadet Officers’ School (SPL) at Dęblin, the Flying School (SP) at Ułęż, the Air Force Reserve Cadet Officers’ School (SPRL) at Radom and The Engineering Class of the Air Force Cadet Officers’ School (SPL-GT) in Warsaw at Mokotów.

No 2 Air Force Training Centre (CWL-2) that included the Air Force NCO School for Minors (SPLdM) at Krosno (previously Bydgoszcz).

Many thanks, do you know if Utez was the training location as I have pictures of them there “captioned”

The top photo is a PZL P7a belonging to the Air Gunnery and Bombardment School (Advanced Flying Course) at Grudziądz.

The other photo is believed to be a PZL P.11a of 161 Eskadra.

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I will try and dig some photos out. I know my dad was a reservist, I presume in Warsaw where he lived. He came south from Poland, through the Med to France then to Liverpool on the Arandora Star.

My grandfather wrote the names of many of the people in the photos for reference maybe I could help with some. I’m more curious of the time from him being a reservist with Turon 4 Polish squadron and then the trip to france and the rest of the journey. I’ll be sharing some digital scans of the photos and I hope you do as well.

I have no names on the photos so wouldn’t know unfortunately. As far as the fake passports, I don’t know that either. I do know that my dad had problems in, I think it was Romania, when they were almost arrested and interned. I believe money changed hands and they made it out. He died in 67 and wouldn’t talk much about his experiences. I’ve found out what I can from talking to others much later when they realised that their histories should be passed on. Wojtek was helpful as was Jerzy Cynks books on the history of the Polish Air Force. Also Destiny Can Wait.

Do you know if they used fake passports as I have a passport with the right stamps, wrong name and wrong status (student), I find it strange that he would have kept a passport which wasn’t his?

Maybe you have some photos of my grandfather which I do not 🙂 here is another photo of my grandfathers plane. [ATTACH=CONFIG]234784[/ATTACH]

Love to see anything about 317sqd. My dad was a photographer in 317. A number of years ago I was visited by Wojtek who copied some of my dad’s photos. I have a diary with dates and places relating to his escape from Poland.