43 Squadron 'Fighting Cocks'

43 Squadron

John,

Your interest in 43 prompted me to join the forum.

After graduating from Halton as an Airframe Fitter I joined 43 in August 1959 and left them in October 1963 giving me time at Leuchars, Nicosia, Khormaksar and various other odd places in between.

If your still interested I have some photographs of my days with the squadron. Unfortunately most seem to show us ground crew types in various states of alchoholic disrepair but I do have a couple of aeroplanes.

Let me know and if I can figured out the attachment procedure I will let you have what Ive got. Sadly they are in black and white being the state of the art technology at the time.

Regards
Bee Gee

43 Squadron

“In 1956, 43 Squadron formed a four-ship aerobatic team called “The Fighting Cocks” when based at Leuchars, which were led by Sqn Ldr Roger Topp, who later went on the lead the “Black Arrows”

This is news to me as I allways thought that the 43 Squadron Hunter team was formed in March 1955 by the CO, Sqn Ldr Roy le Long. He was replaced the following August by Flt Lt Peter Bairsto, who continued to lead the Hunter team until September 1957.

Roger Topp was on the staff of the RAE at Farnborough and joined 111 Squadron in January 1955. He later formed and led the squadron Hunter team until replaced by Sqn Ldr Peter Latham in October 1958.

wasnt the first female fighter pilot posted to 43 for her first tour? :rolleyes:

Apropos very little,

1. Remember in those days the saying was take Courage, you’re entering the Strong country.

2. Things move on. http://www.wellsandyoungs.co.uk/wellsandyoungs/news/wells-and-youngs-and-courage

3. Someone mentioned Frank (Chota) Carey? http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v164/photo04/RAF2/streak44.jpg

= Tim

Errrm…..some bloke seems to have written a 43 Squadron History. 😉

Here:

http://www.ospreypublishing.com/store/book.aspx?bookcode=s4396

Hopefully won’t fall foul of the Mods for advertising? If so, I accept my slapped wrist. However, in mitigation I am not in receipt of Royalties and have no commercial interest in Osprey…..and….somebody was asking!

Very nice piece, Malcolm.

Is it just marked 43 Squadron….or named to a specific individual?

Will quite understand if you do not wish to divulge details or identity.

Andy Saunders

This .455 Eley, Smith & Wesson I own was issued to 43 Squadron RFC in 1916 and is so marked.

Really very nice, and interesting to see. Intriguing to see how they are marked.

Just out of curiosity – and forgive me for asking – but presumably you are certain that 43 refers to 43 Squadron? I have no idea about these things, nor how individual weapons were marked. Was it normal practice (ie to identify by Squadron/Unit) and a practice that is well recorded, or is it a case that you have come to this conclusion by a process of elimination – or maybe there is other provenance that ties it in? I am not in any way doubting you, and I know very well your meticulous approach to these things. However, just curious to know more since this is the very first time I have ever seen such a stamp. But then, not being into weaponry the way you are there is no reason why I should have!

Thank you for sharing, Malcolm,

Very nice piece, Malcolm.

Is it just marked 43 Squadron….or named to a specific individual?

Will quite understand if you do not wish to divulge details or identity.

Andy Saunders

Here you are Andy –

A very good evening to all.

I would like to share this photo with all the guys who have a keen interest in 43 Squadron. The aircraft is Hunter F-6A, XF515 and is based with Hunter Flying Ltd at Exeter airport. This aircraft served with 43 Squadron in the late 1950s and is maintained in airworthy condition.

Freebird

This aircraft was one of the non-111 Sqn a/c which took part in the 22 Hunter loop,
Jim

Hi John,
Fighting Cocks did some of the flying for the film ‘High Flight’
Robert.

This included shots at the 1956 SBAC show which included yours truly on one of them, as part of the crowd. (My one claim to fame!)
Jim

Interesting stuff, Malcolm, and thanks for taking the time to reply.

Really very nice, and interesting to see. Intriguing to see how they are marked.

Just out of curiosity – and forgive me for asking – but presumably you are certain that 43 refers to 43 Squadron? I have no idea about these things, nor how individual weapons were marked. Was it normal practice (ie to identify by Squadron/Unit) and a practice that is well recorded, or is it a case that you have come to this conclusion by a process of elimination – or maybe there is other provenance that ties it in? I am not in any way doubting you, and I know very well your meticulous approach to these things. However, just curious to know more since this is the very first time I have ever seen such a stamp. But then, not being into weaponry the way you are there is no reason why I should have!

Thank you for sharing, Malcolm,

That was the way they were marked – just the way they did it then.

The marks translate from the top –

8.16 = August 1916 which is the month of issue.

43.RFC = 43 Squadron RFC

147 = is the pistol’s individual number, what one calls a rack number.

43 Squadron was still flying One and a Half Strutters at the time this pistol was issued. From the various memoirs one reads about the use of pistols by aircrew in WW1 their principal use was by pilots potting at rabbits on their off days. Pretty much impossible to hit anything in the air with one, also the trajectory of a .455 slug tended to be a bit like a brick. This revolver is, I suspect, a kit bag special as while it has all the standard service marks it doesn’t have the -><- marking it out of service which is normally found on service weapons disposed of to the civilain market, so someone purloined it. Also it has seen very very little use. I suspect many of its companions wound up rusting away in the mud of the Western Front after their owners had been shot down. There are quite a few out here because they are popular collectors items – and there are lots of variations on the unit marks. They weren’t as rugged as the Webley Mk VIs and tended to be easily jammed up because of mud etc.

Only just noticed this resurrected thread, but thought anyone still interested might like to see the ‘nose art’ carried on a pair of Ex-43 Sqdn Hunters that passed through Changi, Singapore on their way to 28 Sqdn Kai Tak. This was July 1962.

‘The Fighting ****’ on the nose of Hunter XG272.

The re-fuelling crew try and work out where to put the AvTur on Hunter XG293 on it’s delivery flight to Kai Tak.

The two Hunters on the pan.
David
ps I love the way this forum has sensored my description of the ‘male chicken’ on the nose of the Hunter!

It took two years and two months to answer Johns question correctly with some great pictures, well done David!:)

Apropos very little,

2. Things move on. http://www.wellsandyoungs.co.uk/wellsandyoungs/news/wells-and-youngs-and-courage
= Tim

The cockerel is probably better off with Wells & Young than with Scottish & Newcastle (now notorious for brewing in neither Scotland nor Newcastle). They maintained for many years that no-one bought the stuff – but that should be no surprise when you discover that one year, about ten years ago, they spent on advertising for the entire set of Courage real ales a whole £87. No, there’s no noughts missing from the number.

Adrian

Strathallan Vampire

“In 1956, 43 Squadron formed a four-ship aerobatic team called “The Fighting Cocks” when based at Leuchars, which were led by Sqn Ldr Roger Topp, who later went on the lead the “Black Arrows”

This is news to me as I allways thought that the 43 Squadron Hunter team was formed in March 1955 by the CO, Sqn Ldr Roy le Long. He was replaced the following August by Flt Lt Peter Bairsto, who continued to lead the Hunter team until September 1957.

Roger Topp was on the staff of the RAE at Farnborough and joined 111 Squadron in January 1955. He later formed and led the squadron Hunter team until replaced by Sqn Ldr Peter Latham in October 1958.

Please find attached a couple of rather grainy photographs to support your 1955 position.

Very interesting thread.
I seem to remember that 43 Sqn used to have a ‘fighting c0ck’ very much alive and pecking when I visited RAF Leuchars some years ago.
I notice that the ‘boxer c0ck’ motif was only applied on Hunters. Can anyone here tell what is the origin of this drawing? Is it some sort of a cartoon character?
There’s a picture (scan1) of a similar bird, with ‘POLAND’ shoulder flash, that used to be linked (by Polish researchers) with Polish pilots of 43 Sqn (there were several during WW2, including a very famous one). However, a recently unearthed photo (scan2) shows the same emblem on the wall at RAF Hemswell in June 1943. The other emblems on that wall were those applied on Wellingtons of 300 (Polish) Squadron so presumably the ‘boxer c0ck’ was, too.

43 Squadron & Treble One Squadron

Hi John,
I guess you must be the John Cooper looking for information on the Fighting Cocks of 43 Squadron?
If so, you should ignore the duff information given on the forum, that they were led by Squadron Leader Roger L. Topp before he went to become the Boss of Treble One Squadron and leader of the Black Arrows.
He was never CO of 43 Squadron, who although, like several other squadrons equipped with the Hunter, had their own aerobatic team, and were all more or less in open competition to become the Hunter Aerobatic Team of Fighter Command, did not succeed in that endeavour. I cannot remember the name of their CO at the time, though they relinquished the delivery of their Mk6s, so that Treble One could have them to replace their Mk4s. Two members of the Fighting Cocks eventually joined Treble One Squadron and they were, Fg. Off. Ron Smith and Fg. Off. Marcus ‘Oscar’ Wild.
Boss Topp succeded Squadron Ldr. Pears who was the first CO of Treble One following their reformation at North Weald in 1953. Boss Topp became CO having been one of the test pilots to test the Comet following the crashes which were attributed to metal fatigue. He was CO of Treble One Squadron when I arrived in 1956, and in turn was succeded as Boss of Treble One by Sqn. Ldr. Peter Latham at Wattisham, who was still CO when I was posted from Treble One to RAF Seletar. It may interest you to know that Boss Topp’s aircraft XG194 – ‘N’ was recently acquired from North Luffenham, by the Museum at RAF Wattisham where it will be refurbished to static display standard, and put on display in one of the HAS which has been kindly allocated by the base commander at Wattisham (Army), Lt. Col. David Turner, who I understand is a keen historian so far as RAF Wattisham is concerned.
Incidentally in 1957 whilst on detachment to RAF Leuchars, the home of 43 Squadron, the ground crew of Treble One redecorated the 43 Squadron Airmen’s crew room with an array of cartooned fighting cocks in various array of having been beaten in the ring and plucked and trussed, the display reaching up the walls and across the ceiling, much to the chagrin of the 43 ground crew when they returned from their detachment, by which time Treble One were well on their way home!
I noticed in the Flypast magazine for February 2010 that the restoration of XG194 receives mention on page 16 with the dreadful mistake that Treble One Squadron CO was Flt. Lt. Roger Topp! What an excruciatingly embarrassing error for such a magazine to make, and I hope they will be addressing that error when I email them, and print the correction that the Squadron CO was in fact Sqn. Ldr. Roger L. Topp AFC, and that he retired as Air Commodore R. L. Topp AFC** (Yes 2 Bars). Not many have been awarded three AFCs.
I notice that a photo has been posted of XF515, and it may interest you to know that this aircraft also took part in the 22 ship loop performed by the Black Arrows with a few of their friends from other squadrons at Farnborough on 4th September 1958, flown at Black Four position by Flt. Lt. Alan Brindle.
The nose art photo is a great reminder of the Fighting Cocks of 43 Squadron, and you can imagine them in half plucked disarray all over the airmen’s crew room. I could tell you the name of our Treble One artist but he went to live abroad, after purchasing his discharge from the RAF.