5 Minutes of Flyboys

Blackadders last show is often apparently shown in schools doing projects about the Great War. I think that’s disgraceful – it is entertainment (and very enjoyable imo) but not history.

Having retraced the route of my Great Grandfather in the first month of the war, and visited the graves of those he left behind on the field of battle (he came home a cripple) I have a serious and interested outlook on it – but there is a distinction between fact and fiction, and both are valid.

I enjoy Ice Cold in Alex. My Grandfather was in North Africa too – but I can distinguish.

agree with Dazdaman …..looks great – provided employment for a certain number of aviation related enterprises and will probably thrill the Star Wars generation … I can’t believe the amount of petty carping going on here …some production company has spent millions producing an aviation-related film…its not a documentary ferchrissakes …go and enjoy..

Why should I enjoy rubbish?
You wouldn’t expect me to enjoy a bad game of football or a bad play or a bad book or bad restaurant meal so why this?
Your attitude seems to be that we should be thankful that someone’s been kind enough to make us an aviation film. Give me one reason why I should pay out hard earned money to indulge in something sub-standard?
Andy

Flyboys

agree with Dazdaman …..looks great – provided employment for a certain number of aviation related enterprises and will probably thrill the Star Wars generation … I can’t believe the amount of petty carping going on here …some production company has spent millions producing an aviation-related film…its not a documentary ferchrissakes …go and enjoy..

Well, I’m looking forward to it, even if 99% of people on the forum are not. So what if it’s not an accurate description of the aerial battles of the First World War? So what if the Nieuports and Fokkers look as though they’re being flown by Luke Skywalker? It’s a Hollywood movie, not a Discovery Channel special!! So long as you remember that, where’s the problem? :rolleyes:

I’m totally with you on this Daz. From all that I’ve seen it’s exactly what I’d expect it to be, and despite that I’m GLAD they made it. Accept it for what it is, pure entertainment. “Hell’s Angels” for the 21st century. As it is, there is as yet no UK distribution deal. So most of us may not even get to see it anyway, until the day it arrives on digital versatile.

What does one think of ‘Blackadder Goes Forth’, then…?

I feel much the same about it actually.
Apart from the last one where the clever writers got themselves off the hook somewhat and some of the one liners in it amuse me to a certain extent.

Blackadder has been quoted in several serious pieces about Great War tactics as to how the myth of bad generalship/tactics etc is perpetuated. Even in a BBC Timewatch programme too on Douglas Haig I think.
Just goes to show that many believe what they’re told even if it’s in a comedy show.

A.

It sure was a fun movie to make, most of the time. And a darn good excuse for visits to Old Warden, Duxford, Breighton, etc.

The credits (from http://mgmmaterials.com/ ) include some familiar names, including some Old Warden-ers:

AERIAL UNIT
Aerial Photography by
HENRY BRAHAM BSC
SPACE
First Assistant Director
ALEXANDER OAKLEY
Camera Operator
GRAHAM HALL
Script Supervisor
DIANA DILL
Chief Pilot
NIGEL LAMB
Safety Pilot
ALISTER KAY
Helicopter Pilot
FRED NORTH
Pilots
BRIAN BROWN
JOHN DAY
BOB GAULD GALLIERS
ANDREW KING
KEN KELLETT
TAFF SMITH
ANNA WALKER
DOUGLAS GREGORY
ROBB METCALFE
DESMOND PENROSE
ROB MILLINGSHIP
ANDY SEFTON
Engineers
MIKE FENTON
NEV GARDENER
PAUL NICHOLLS
DAVE PROCTOR
JEAN MICHEL MUNN
TOM SOLOMON
Aerial Co-ordinator (USA)
MICHAEL PATLIN
Aerial Co-ordinators (UK)
THE OLD FLYING MACHINE COMPANY

Why so many red Fokker Triplanes??? :confused:

Not every German pilot painted their aircraft red.

Fantastic – really enjoyed the clip. After the ‘other world’ CGI physics of recent films this looks pretty good to me.

It’s excellent to see a WWI film getting the CGI treatment. Should be interesting listening to any technical chat on the DVD. It looks authentic enough in some respects (but not the obvious cliches) and I think it’ll stir some vintage aviation enthusiasm around the audience.

Oh dear – I’m out of step with the furrowed brows on this one.

Never mind 😉

“Flyboys”…which I suspect is meant to be a bit of escapist fun…

Mr Boyle,
I think that’s what worries me.
I’m not absolutley sure that ‘escapist fun’ should be applied to The Great War.
I do accept that ‘Flyboys’ won’t be the first case of this but I don’t like it.

I do seriously think that there’s a massive difference in the way the Great War is viewed on either side of the Atlantic.

One can even sense this in quite respected journals about that conflict. Try contrasting the styles of ‘Over The Front’ with the British ‘Cross and Cockade’ journals to see my point.
Both I hasten to add excellent publications.

Andy

But when we start to turn such momentous and horrific events into pure entertainment then we are already on the slippery slope to repeating history’s mistakes.
Steve.

While I don’t disagree with your sentiments, I’m afraid the cat’s been out of the bag for a few centuries.

Tragedy has always been a croud pleaser in the arts.
Whether it be Shakespeare and his retelling of history for the enjoyement of theater goers, or “Titanic” on the big screen (or for that matter “BoB”, “The Dam Busters”, “The Longest Day” people want to see their history retold. And it’s all been in the name of entertainment. Some may have had loftier amitions than “Flyboys”…which I suspect is meant to be a bit of escapist fun…

[B][SIZE=4] I don’t see much wrong with it “glorifing the American war machine”

Surely glorifying any war machine is wrong, war means people die, real people that is not actors on some Hollywood celluloid.

Of course we should remember and honour those who have died to protect our freedoms; we should also endevour to study the roots and causes of armed conflicts in the hope of avoiding such loss of life in future wars.

But when we start to turn such momentous and horrific events into pure entertainment then we are already on the slippery slope to repeating history’s mistakes. The people who gave their lives deserve any film about them to be an accurate and fitting memorial to their sacrifice NOT a cynical money spinner.

Steve.

[QUOTE=J Boyle][SIZE=4]Andy, I’m sure the 50,000+ Americans killed in the war appreciate your summary of their sacrifice. [/SIZE] :rolleyes:

[B]DON’T YOU KNOW IT IS RUDE TO SHOUT ON THE INTERNET!B] polite people use small case, even if they have an angry point to make. I think a week ban from the RFC Officers Mess and 25 orderly officer duties should sort you out young fellahmelad! :diablo:

Mr Boyle
Yes, you’re correct I did rather denigrate the losses that the American forces suffered during The Great War and for that I apologise.
The actual figures are as follows:-

Killed in action = 53,513.
Killed or died by other causes = 63,195. (Influenza probably played a big part here).
Wounded in action = 204,002.

Everyone a son, a husband or a brother.

Surely then, a better memorial to them is needed than comic book nonsense.

In fact you do in the Americas have a better memorial to them.
In Kansas City you have this:-

http://www.libertymemorialmuseum.org/

I visited there last year and the ongoing refurbishment project is turning the museum into a World class exhibit.

Later.
Andy

glorification of the American war machine which was involved in all but the last five minutes of that conflict.
Later.
A.

[SIZE=4]Andy, I’m sure the 50,000+ Americans killed in the war appreciate your summary of their sacrifice. [/SIZE] :rolleyes:

If you read the other threads, especially about the Vulcan, much is being made that there isn’t a greater appreciation for aviation heritage.
Okay, here’s a film that will expose it to a new generation.
Sure, it’s not a history lesson…then again most entertainment programs aren’t…but it might get a few converts. Yes, the “Memphis Belle” remake was a collection of cliches…but then again there were more than a couple in “BoB” and “A Piece of Cake”. I’m not saying it’s the finest film in the history of cinema…but I’m sure it’s worthy of more consideration that a “review” based on a trailer. If nothing else, the producer/director should at least get a round of applause for putting their money..with emphasis on “their”..into something that might help interest in aviation heritage. Something that can’t be said about most Hollywood or London productions.

It seems no film can get a break in this forum unless it glorifies “the few”, or the members of 617 Squadron…and it better have an all UK cast. 😀

And since it is an American movie made with American money…and not much of it all things considering… I don’t see much wrong with it “glorifing the American war machine” (which is credited with breaking the stalemate in a war the US really had no business being in any earlier that it was).

And whether you (and I) like it or not…and I know you don’t…don’t worry about films being directed at American audiences.
Nowdays, “Hollywood” makes more of it’s money in Asia…we’ll soon all be at the viewing mercies of what young Asian males want to see.

…The reason is that it’s so bad is that modern films are produced (not written or directed) to appeal to the widest possible audience spectrum.

No, they’re NOT. They’re produced for the lowest level of non-intellegence.

Unlike even modern kids films (which have jokes for the adults) movies like the sequence we’e been patronised with here have nothing for anyone who might want to engage on a greater than ‘whiz-bang’ level. The way the whole sequence has to slow-right-down so we can ‘see’ the ‘heros’ stupidity and ‘fear’ before he (predictably) doesn’t get shot (now that was a surprise – I don’t think). I was preying for a Peckinpah moment. We certainly seemed to have switched to slow-moron-comprehension-motion there.

No thanks.

Well, I’m looking forward to it, even if 99% of people on the forum are not. So what if it’s not an accurate description of the aerial battles of the First World War? So what if the Nieuports and Fokkers look as though they’re being flown by Luke Skywalker? It’s a Hollywood movie, not a Discovery Channel special!! So long as you remember that, where’s the problem? :rolleyes:

I admit I’ll probably see it -and enjoy it.
In fact a true film about the subject would probably be difficult to watch and would simply not be believed by many of the modern generation.

Well, I’m looking forward to it, even if 99% of people on the forum are not. So what if it’s not an accurate description of the aerial battles of the First World War? So what if the Nieuports and Fokkers look as though they’re being flown by Luke Skywalker? It’s a Hollywood movie, not a Discovery Channel special!! So long as you remember that, where’s the problem? :rolleyes:

It doesn’t have to be good to be enjoyable.
See the film , have a good laugh, then try to get your money back from your mate- that should be an even bigger laugh. Then tell us all about it. 🙂

Yes, he’s coming here for our mutual friend’s annual aviation lecture at Old Warden on November 4th.
That’s a shameless plug for
‘The first Annual Aviation Lecture’ to be held at The Shuttleworth Collection on Saturday 4th November 2006.
Guest speaker Mr Andy Sephton, followed by a buffet lunch and then in the afternoon a guided tour of the collection and a behind the scenes look at the old place. Cost £35.00 or £30.00 for SVAS members.INTERESTED???–post here.

I have this argument over on ‘The Aerodrome’.
There a certain individual is so convinced that I’m going to enjoy this film that he’s offered to reimburse the cinema entry costs if I really hate it.

I’ve yet to see anything that I’d find good about it.
A.

It doesn’t have to be good to be enjoyable.
See the film , have a good laugh, then try to get your money back from your mate- that should be an even bigger laugh. Then tell us all about it. 🙂

Yes ! yes! yes! – and with the “Hells Angels” sequence from “Aviator” plus the airship attack sequence from “Zeppelin” poached for good measure.

I have this argument over on ‘The Aerodrome’.
There a certain individual is so convinced that I’m going to enjoy this film that he’s offered to reimburse the cinema entry costs if I really hate it.

I’ve yet to see anything that I’d find good about it.
A.