72 Sqn Vampire mid-air collision

Plt Off Taylor belly landed his Vampire at North Weald, was stripped of his wings and grounded.”

Blimey ,was that normal seems a bit harsh:eek:

Vampire mid-air

Some new information has come to light which confirms the date and the aircraft involved. The information in my book ‘Swift to Battle. Vol 3’ is in error. (Very annoyed about my mistake!). Here is what should have been in it:

30 December 1951

VV539: struck by WA361 while formation flying and abandoned. Sgt D Mobberley

WA361: Struck VV539 and RTB. Pt Off Taylor

And from one of the witnesses, Sgt Pilot Sydney Hyams:

Thank you for the question re Sgt. Pilot Mobberley’s collision.

I have consulted my log book and can confirm that on Sunday 30th December 1951 that a wing exercise as you describe did take place. My aircraft was WA424 and Sgt. Dennis Mobberley’s No.2 was a Pilot Officer Norman in WA361.

WA539 flown by Dennis was a write off.

Sorry for any confusion caused and many thanks to all who helped to clear this up.

Tom

Vampire mid-air

Tom

It mentioned Jim Barton who is re-union co-ordinator for 72 Sqn. He has apparently put Mobberley in touch with Sydney Hyams so the latter might be able to pass on his address to you.

Peter

Hi Peter, I know both well. Sydney was until recently the 72 Sqn Assoc treasurer and I am the membership secretary, newsletter editor and webmaster! I am trying to get an answer from Sydney to the date conundrum and will post when I do.

Just in case that some forumites have not come across the works of ‘Colin Cummings’; he has researched post war losses up to 1996 utilizing many sources but mainly Movements and Crash Cards.

My own gut feeling is the Crash Cards are most probably the closest to a correct date especialy as the Times quote the same date.

If Mr Mobbley is still alive (his son was when Sir Patrick Moore passed) and his Log Books are still in existance this may assist in clarifying the information.

Tom

The lack of detail in the ORB doesn’t surprise me but not mentioning a mid-air collision it taking it to the extreme!

By the way I did a Google search for Sgt Mobberley and turned up another article in the Brentwood Gazette (sorry, don’t know how to do links). It mentioned Jim Barton who is re-union co-ordinator for 72 Sqn. He has apparently put Mobberley in touch with Sydney Hyams so the latter might be able to pass on his address to you.

Peter

THe ORB has no record of either incident! Like many ORBs it is a bit sparse in the 1950’s. I am ,however, in touch with Sydney Hyams in the hope of clarifying the dates.

Tom

The two descriptions seem to be of the same event but the discepancy with the dates is puzzling. I wonder if the Squadron ORB would help?

Peter

Times 31st Dec 1951 says “

Two RAF Vampire aircraft from North Weald were involved in a mid-air
collison at Purleigh, Essex during local flying yesterday. Both pilots escaped”

Vampire mid-air

Further to the link posted earlier that gives Dennis Mobberley’s version of events is the information I received in writing directly from one of the pilots involved and he stated that it was recorded in his log book as having occurred on 5 April 1952:

Sydney Hyams was one of the pilots in the formation that day and recalls the crash:

“I can confirm from my log book on 5th April 1952 there was a Wing Formation which involved 72, 601 and 603 Squadrons. Wg Cdr Don Kingaby DFC led the formation over the North Sea, consisting of 32 or 33 Vampires Mk 5 fighters.

During our descent from 30,000ft, when approaching Maldon, the order “Dive brakes – Go” was given by the CO. Pilot officer Taylor, who was behind and beneath Sgt Dennis Mobberly, was a little slow in lowering his dive brake control lever with the result that he moved beneath the tail plane in front and his nose rose through the tail plane and caused a wing to collapse. All of this was a few yards away from me to my right, as I was formating on Sgt Mobberly, with Sgt Jimmy Stewart beneath and behind me.

Both Jimmy and I broke away to port and followed the stricken Vampire right to the point of impact in a ploughed field and flew low across another field to wave to Dennis, who appeared to have parachuted safely to earth. Dennis spent two days in Chelmsford hospital with a cut forehead, but was otherwise unhurt and resumed flying. Plt Off Taylor belly landed his Vampire at North Weald, was stripped of his wings and grounded.”

Tony

In the article attached to Wokka Bob’s post it mentions a frightening incident in a Victor in the 1960s so the reference probably refers to this.

Hopefully Tom can enlighten us on what went on in April 1952.

Peter

Monsun he does say he had another near death experience

vampire collision

🙂 the date is december 30th 1951 for sure as reported in paper

Tony

It certainly did happen, but it looks as though it happened on 30/12/51. In Tom’s original post he enquired about a collision on 5/4/52 involving Sgt Mobberley. It would have been incredibly bad luck to have been involved in two mid-air collisions in four months!

Peter

Yes it happened and his aircraft was toast, the pilots recollection and a picture of its remains are here.

http://72squadronassociation.webs.com/sqnhistoryarticles.htm

As the photo shows him in 2012 and he’s not in the obituary section perhaps writing to the association and asking them to contact him might yield results.

Ps did a 6 week exchange on 72 Wessex..

I’m a bit confused on this one as well. From Wokka Bob’s post it seems pretty conclusive that Sgt Mobberley was flying VV539 when it collided with WA361 on 30/12/51.

Are you saying he was involved in another mid-air on 5/4/52? If this is the case it can’t have resulted in a write off as there is no record of an aircraft having been lost on that date.

Peter

Tom,

What do you know about this other collision? I think the obvious question we have to ask is, did it actually happen?

If it did, did it result in a write off or did the two aircraft survive to fly another day?

If it is the latter then none of our books will be of any help as they were virtually all written based on end fates. In that case you’d need someone who is going to the RAFM for a research visit to check the microfilms to see if there is an 1180 recording the incident.

Vampire mid-air

Thank you Peter.

The full wording in Aeromilitaria reads :

30/12/51 – Vampire FB.5 VV539 of 72 Sqn collided with WA361 and abandoned, location Purleigh, Essex.

There is nothing to show a mid-air on 5/4/52.

Peter

Vampire

According to Air Britain Aeromilitaria 1/82 the other aircraft involved was WA361.

Peter

Just a little confused. Can you clarify your statement ref ‘the other aircraft involved’? Are you able to post up the Aeromilitaria page or provide a full explanation of the context of the reference?

Thanks

Tom

Vampire mid-air

Thanks Wokka Bob,

I knew about the other incident and it is not the one I am trying to pin down.