This came to me as an e-mail and its provenance is not known to me, but it rings true.
Pat Gilmore is a Delta pilot retiree..
I haven’t seen the movie (UAL 93), yet, but I
intend to when I get the chance. Retirement has made me busier than
ever, and I haven’t had the chance to see many movies lately.
As a Delta B-767 captain myself at the time of
the attacks on 9/11, I was in crew rest in Orlando that morning. I had
just turned on the TV in my hotel room only to see the WTC tower on
fire, then saw the second airplane hit the other tower. My immediate
reaction was “Terrorists. We’re at war,” followed by the realization
that we airline crewmembers had all dodged a bullet; it could have been
any one of us flying those planes.
As soon as the news stations flashed the first
pictures of the terrorists I knew just how close and personal the bullet
I dodged was. There, on the screen for all to see, was a man who had sat
in my jump seat the previous July. His name was Mohammad Atta, the
leader of the terrorist hijackers. Atta had boarded my flight from
Baltimore to Atlanta on July 26, 2001 wearing an American Airlines first
officer uniform He had the corresponding AA company ID identifying him
as a pilot, not to mention the required FAA pilot license and medical
certificate that he was required to show me as proof of his aircrew
status for access to my jump seat. An airline pilot riding a cockpit
jump seat is a long established protocol among the airlines of the
world, a courtesy extended by the management and captains of one airline
to pilots and flight attendants of other airlines in recognition of
their aircrew status. My admission of Mohammad Atta to my cockpit jump
seat that day was merely a routine exercise of this protocol.
Something seemed a bit different about this jump
seat rider, though, because in my usual course of conversation with him
as we reached cruise altitude he avoided all my questions about his
personal life and focused very intently upon the cockpit instruments and
our operation of the aircraft. I asked him what he flew at American and
he said, “These”, but he asked incessant questions about how we did this
or why we did that. I said, “This is a 767. They all operate the same
way.” But he said, “No, we operate them differently at American” That
seemed very strange, because I knew better. I asked him about his
background, and he admitted he was from Saudi Arabia. I asked him when
he came over to this country and he said “A couple of years ago”, to
which I asked, “Are you a US citizen?” He said no. I also found that
very strange because I know that in order to have an Airline Transport
Pilot rating, the rating required to be an airline captain, one has to
be a US citizen, and knowing the US airlines and their hiring processes
as I do, I found it hard to believe that American Airlines would hire a
non-US citizen who couldn’t upgrade to captain when the time came. He
said, “The rules have changed.”, which I also knew to be untrue.
Besides, he was just, shall I say, “Creepy”? My copilot and I were both
glad to get rid of this guy when we got to Atlanta.
There was nothing to indicate, though, that he
was anything other than who or what he said he was, because he had the
documentation to prove who he was In retrospect, we now know his uniform
was stolen and his documents were forged.
Information later came to light as to how this
was done. It seems that Mohammad Atta and his cronies had possibly
stolen pilot uniforms and credentials from hotel rooms during the
previous year. We had many security alerts at the airline to watch out
for our personal items in hotel rooms because these were mysteriously
disappearing, but nobody knew why. Atta and his men used these to make
dry runs prior to their actual hijackings on 9/11. How do I know? I
called the FBI as soon as I saw his face on the TV that day, and the
agent on the other end of the line took my information and told me I’d
hear back from them when all the dust settled.
A few weeks later I got a letter from the Bureau
saying that my call was one of at least half a dozen calls that day from
other pilots who had had the same experience. Flights were being
selected at random to make test runs for accessing the cockpit. It seems
we had all dodged bullets. Over the years my attitude towards the War
Against Terrorism and the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq have been known
to be on the red neck, warmongering, rah-rah-shoot-em-up side of things.
I’ve been known to lose my patience with those who say the war in Iraq
or anywhere else in the Muslim world is wrong, or who say we shouldn’t
become involved in that area of the world for political correctness
reasons. Maybe it’s because I dodged the bullet so closely back in 2001
that I feel this way. I have very little patience for political rhetoric
or debate against this war because for a couple of hours back in July
2001, when I was engaged in conversation with a major perpetrator in
this war, I came so close to being one of its victims that I can think
in no other terms.
I don’t mind admitting that one of the reasons
I retired early from Delta last May, other than to protect my
disappearing company retirement, was because it became harder and harder
for me to go to work every day knowing that the war wasn’t being taken
seriously by the general public. The worst offenders were the Liberal
detractors to the present administration, and right or wrong, this
administration is at least taking the bull by the horns and fighting our
enemies, which is something concrete that I can appreciate. Nobody was
taking this war seriously, and it seems everyone found fault with the US
government rather than with those who attacked us. I found that
incomprehensible I also found myself being scrutinized by TSA screeners
more and more every day when I went to work, and suffered the
humiliating indignity of being identified about half the time for body
searches in front of the general flying public who looked at the entire
process as being ludicrous. “They don’t even trust their own pilots!”
Accompanied by an unbelieving snicker was the usual response. Here I
was, a retired USAF officer who had been entrusted to fly nuclear
weapons around the world, who had been granted a Top Secret clearance
and had been on missions over the course of 21 years in the military
that I still can’t talk about without fear of prosecution by the DOD,
who was being scanned by a flunkie TSA screener looking for any sign of
a pen knife or nail file on my person.
It wasn’t until six months after my retirement
when my wife and I flew to Key West, FL last November that I was finally
able to rid myself of the visage of Mohammad Atta sitting behind me on
my jump seat, watching my every action in the cockpit and willing to
slit my throat at the slightest provocation. I missed being a headline
by a mere 47 days, and could very well have been among the aircrew
casualties on 9/11 had one of my flights on my monthly schedule been a
transcontinental flight from Boston or New York to the west coast on the
11th of September. Very few people know that, while only four airliners
crashed that day, four more were targeted, and two of them were Delta
flights. The only reason these four weren’t involved is because they
either had minor maintenance problems which delayed them at the gate or
they were scheduled to depart after the FAA decided to ground all
flights Theirs are the pilots and flight attendants who REALLY dodged
the bullet that day, and my faith in a higher power is restored as a
result.
I will see United 93 when I get the chance, and
I will probably enjoy the movie for its realness and historical
significance, but forgive me if I do not embrace the Muslim world for
the rest of my life. The Islamic world is no friend of the West, and
although we may be able to get along with their governments in the
future, the stated goal of Islam is world conquest through Jihad and it
is the extremist Jihadists, backed and funded by “friendly” Moslem
governments, whom we have to fear the most. We must have a presence in
the Middle East, and we must have friends in the Middle East, even if we
have to fight wars to get them. Only someone who has dodged a bullet can
fully appreciate that fact.
Editor’s Note: For some reason which is beyond
me, some people do not want to believe this. Perhaps they do not want to
believe that Jihadist terrorism actually exists, because if someone
doesn’t believe it yet, they never will. Capt. Gilmore himself posted
this comment, in our comments below, but I will put it here for all to see:
I assure you this letter is true. As to the fact
that I wrote that a holder of an Airline Transport Pilot rating (ATP)
must be a US citizen, I admit that I was mistaken here. I had always
assumed so, because that’s what I had heard, so I looked up the
requirements for an ATP just now. There is nothing that says that US
citizenship is required. Okay, I’ll bite the bullet on that one. I
received my ATP back in 1975 and now that I think of it I do not
remember having to prove my citizenship. However, the rest of the story
is true.
As for my airline career, I worked for Western
Airlines (who merged with Delta in 1987), Jet America Airlines (who was
bought by Alaska Airlines in 1988), and Delta Airlines, as well as a few
“fly by night” cargo airlines during my furlough period from Western
from 1981-1985. I also flew in Vietnam as a transport pilot and retired
from the USAF Reserve in 1991 after the Gulf War. I have 21,500+ flight
hours in T-41, T-37, T-38, C-141/L-300, CE-500, CV-440, MD-80/82, B-727,
B-737, B-757, and B-767 aircraft, all logged between 1970 and 2005 when
I retired from Delta. Trust me, folks, this was real.
I must admit I am quite surprised that my
letter made it this far on the internet. The letter was nothing more
than am innocent reply to a group of friends, one of whom sent me a
similar letter from another Delta pilot who had been flying the morning
of 9/11 and who had experienced the flying that day for himself. His
letter had detailed his thoughts as he viewed the movie “United 93”, and
he also told in detail how he had been diverted to Knoxville when the
FAA shut down the airspace. My friend had asked me if I had known of any
other similar experiences, so I wrote him what I had encountered myself
a few months before. This was my letter to him.
Another retired Delta captain contacted me
yesterday after reading this blog and related an experience his wife had
on a flight from Portland, OR to Atlanta in August 2001, just a week or
so after my experience with Atta. She was riding on a company pass and
seated in First Class. A person of “Middle Eastern” descent had sought
permission to sit on the cockpit jump seat, but was denied access by the
captain because he did not have an FAA Medical certificate. She said he
ranted and raved because he couldn’t ride the cockpit jump seat, even
though there were three empty seats in First Class, which the captain
offered him. What pilot in his right mind would refuse a First Class
seat over a cramped cockpit jump seat? He stormed off the aircraft and
they left him at the gate.
You see? Mine wasn’t the only experience leading up to 9/11.
Delta Airlines Corporate Security even contacted
me a few days ago to ask if I had, indeed, written this letter. I wrote
them back that I had. They were worried that someone was using my name
without my knowledge. I assured them I was the author.
Keep the faith, and don’t let the *******s get you down.
Pat Gilmore
By: Grey Area - 1st March 2007 at 17:52
Moderator Message
OK, that will do.
Personal bickering, personal attacks and/or adverse personal comments aimed at other members simply are not tolerated in here.
You were warned, gents.
GA
By: Kernowglyn - 1st March 2007 at 16:28
ATFS Crash was perfectly civil (if slightly abrupt) in his response to this, and has argued his points well. If he’s become a little abrasive it’s probably because of your own indignant and defensive replies, Kernowglyn. I feel you’ve overreacted somewhat, which is understandable when you’ve put yourself out there with something like this. If you were posting in good faith there’s no need to feel like that about it; just accept the criticism with good grace.
Your interpretation of the term ‘perfectly civil’ does not accord with mine. One good thing about the previous exchange is that ATFS Crash no longer calls himself an ‘Ace’.
By: JonathanF - 1st March 2007 at 11:59
ATFS Crash was perfectly civil (if slightly abrupt) in his response to this, and has argued his points well. If he’s become a little abrasive it’s probably because of your own indignant and defensive replies, Kernowglyn. I feel you’ve overreacted somewhat, which is understandable when you’ve put yourself out there with something like this. If you were posting in good faith there’s no need to feel like that about it; just accept the criticism with good grace.
By: Grey Area - 24th February 2007 at 14:18
A Moment Of Moderation
Gents…. this is becoming a bit too personal now.
Calm down and make your respective points without resorting to vilifying one another, if you please.
Thank you.
GA
By: Kernowglyn - 24th February 2007 at 14:11
I will not dignify the writer with a full reply to his points. He was gratuitously rude in the first instance and this latest is in a similar vein. My spell in the Intelligence services was not with Stalin or Hitler, but in the service of the crown. I shall ignore any further post from you on the subject.
By: ATFS_Crash - 24th February 2007 at 10:57
No such thing. It was on another forum that it was doubted. I asked the writer of that post (a friend of mine) for his reasons. As I didn’t want to be involved with perpetrating ‘dubious’ information I immediately notified this forum.
It would seem, what you actually did is; you were not happy with the other forum because they did not agree with the alleged e-mail, so you posted it here to see if we would agree with your theory. Then when we point out discrepancies, instead of accepting the truth or debating and supporting your claims with evidence, you attack.
Do try to follow your own logic.
I have supported my logic with facts. I already have posted enough logic and facts to debunk the e-mail.
I grovel at the feet of a genius. What do you think a forum is? I will tell you that it is a place for debate. You seem to think that it is for mannerless put-downs and tantrums.
I have been debating. I have put forward my logic and supported my claims with facts.
You have ignored our logic and facts that discredit the hearsay e-mail. Instead you attack us because you want to live your delusion.
Having served in the intelligence services after my flying career I was of course completely unaware of that!
Under Stalin or Hitler? We have different standards, we do not naturally assume hearsay is true. Hearsay might trigger an investigation, but in the relatively free and honest world we try to follow logic and evidence when we are investigating, not hearsay.
I find it hard to believe that you were in the intelligence service (at least not in the free world). Part of being a good investigator is not propping up your theories, but to try to poke holes in them, to knock them down. If your theory stands and does not deflate then you are probably on the right trail. If you do not challenge your own theories (or take heed to external challenges), you are not doing proper investigative work. Under some circumstances it would be called framing not to investigate contradictions and not to test your theories.
If you were to imprison someone on hearsay, that would be false imprisonment.
I still have my doubts about this; even if true it’s still a blatant piece of right-wing propaganda. Why didn’t this guy come forward sooner? His information would assuredly have been of interest to the authorities. If he’d acted on his suspicions he could even have prevented the attacks.
That was part of my point. It is a common con to give the appearance of credibility. In this case we have hearsay, supporting hearsay.
If Pat Gilmore so willing to send out e-mails and post on blog(s), you would think he would talk to the media. You would think after the world wide outcry for evidence, that he or his other crew members would have volunteered the information. By law, if a crew knew something like that you would think they would come forward, by law they are required to. You would think some of the passengers on the flight would have noticed, remembered and came forward. I would think the crew the passengers would be figuratively beating down the doors of the 9/11 investigators before there was even an outcry.
You would think of the media and the investigators would be able to sniff out such a big story and that it would be a matter of public record in a big way. There would be a big media storm over something like this, if it was true.
I am right wing, and I like a lot of the patriotic things that were said, however I am not going to go along was something that has a political message that I like if it is largely based on fiction that is quite likely just part of a publicity stunt to promote a movie.
I do not know if it is true, and will reserve judgement on that until it can be proved – either way
On the contrary. You seem to wish to think it is true. You even said “it rings true”. You just cannot seem to except that the facts do not match your wishes.
The hard evidence indicates the story is untrue.
He gives no details about himself in his profile that leads me to believe he is an authority on anything.
A person’s profile description on this message board is just hearsay. I can’t understand why you believe so much in hearsay, yet this regard sound Erie and hard evidence. You have received several good arguments and facts debunking the e-mail. You want to believe the e-mail, but you give no real evidence or sound arguments that it is true. Instead you attack others.
You are in such heavy denial what you do not realize that you have asked asks for its and you have gotten some expert answers. Just because people do not want their credentials around does not mean they are not experts.
Extraordinary claims, require extraordinary evidence. Hearsay is not extra ordinary evidence. The evidence we already posted debunks the e-mail.
You want someone to publicly flaunt their credentials, well I got some. The 9/11 commission. I wonder if you will even thake heed of official public experts with credentials in a public criminal procedure.
“The question has been raised about whether one or more of
the hijackers may have used pilot’s credentials in order to sit
in the cockpit with the pilots during the flight to facilitate
the takeover. In view of the requisite paperwork and other
procedures which must be followed to permit a jumpseat privilege,
there is no evidence that such a tactic was used by the
hijackers. They actually had reservations and sat in the seats
that they were assigned.”
Source
http://www.9-11commission.gov/archive/hearing7/9-11Commission_Hearing_2004-01-27.pdf
One would think if Mohammad Atta had ever road in the jump seat on a passenger flight on a major airline that would be mentioned in the investigation, and it also would be mentioned many other public places by credible sources.
It’s funny this information is public yet people want to think that they got a chain letter e-mail or found something on a blog that the media would want to know and would jump on like a starving squirrel on the last acorn in the world, yet still months later it is virtually unknown. Perhaps the reason it has remained virtually unknown is that it is not credible. Would not you think the reason the media has not covered this e-mail is because it has no credibility?
We already debunked the e-mail you posted. You would not accept it, so I just debunked it even more. No matter how much you attack me, it will not convince me. If you still want to believe the e-mail fine go ahead, but do not expect us to believe it unless you can come up with some pretty good arguments and evidence.
Using your logic Einstein was an idiot because he failed math, Stephen Hawking is an idiot because he cannot write or speak, Edison was incompetent because he had so many failures, the Wright Brothers were failures because they crashed.
I am definitely no Pulitzer prizewinner, never claimed to be. If you want to criticize someone else’s spelling, perhaps you should work on your own spelling and grammar first.
By: Kernowglyn - 17th February 2007 at 19:13
Kernowglyn, don’t take it so personally. I appreciate that you received it in good faith, but any criticism of the email shouldn’t be taken as criticism of you or the person you received this from. Urban legend style emails rely on people’s good nature to propagate.
You must have your own suspicions about this; it reads like classic political rhetoric dressed up in language designed to sway opinion in favour of the Iraq and ‘stan conflicts. Hundreds of stories like this, usually “from the troops” have done the rounds since 2003.
Someone claiming to be Gilmore made replies to doubters here.
I still have my doubts about this; even if true it’s still a blatant piece of right-wing propaganda. Why didn’t this guy come forward sooner? His information would assuredly have been of interest to the authorities. If he’d acted on his suspicions he could even have prevented the attacks.
I do not know if it is true, and will reserve judgement on that until it can be proved – either way. I am not a political animal, so I do not base my opinions on whether a person is from the Left, Right or Centre of the political spectrum. After all, even a stopped clock is right twice a day. I am aware of the difference between criticism of the message and the messenger. I was not prepared for comments like
So you don’t think you have to support your claims, but anyone that doubt you has to? and
Why should we spoon feed you every little detail about why we think it is fake? There are several things in the letter that makes me suspicious it is fake.
The fact that the writer calls himself ‘Ace Debunker’ and then mis-spells the third word, fails to favourably impress me. He gives no details about himself in his profile that leads me to believe he is an authority on anything.
By: JonathanF - 17th February 2007 at 18:44
Kernowglyn, don’t take it so personally. I appreciate that you received it in good faith, but any criticism of the email shouldn’t be taken as criticism of you or the person you received this from. Urban legend style emails rely on people’s good nature to propagate.
You must have your own suspicions about this; it reads like classic political rhetoric dressed up in language designed to sway opinion in favour of the Iraq and ‘stan conflicts. Hundreds of stories like this, usually “from the troops” have done the rounds since 2003.
Someone claiming to be Gilmore made replies to doubters here.
I still have my doubts about this; even if true it’s still a blatant piece of right-wing propaganda. Why didn’t this guy come forward sooner? His information would assuredly have been of interest to the authorities. If he’d acted on his suspicions he could even have prevented the attacks.
By: Kernowglyn - 17th February 2007 at 11:15
a
I suspect that it is a fake. I suspect much of the information in the email is true, however I think it might be fabricated from facts. I am skeptical Pat Gilmore wrote the alleged emails and I supect much of the claims are false.
So you don’t think you have to support your claims, but anyone that doubt you has to?
No such thing. It was on another forum that it was doubted. I asked the writer of that post (a friend of mine) for his reasons. As I didn’t want to be involved with perpetrating ‘dubious’ information I immediately notified this forum.
Newforest’s has posted a very good skepticism to doubt your post. I don’t know if Newforest’s claims are true, but the logic of his skepticism is sound.
Do try to follow your own logic.
Why should we spoon feed you every little detail about why we think it is fake?
I grovel at the feet of a genius. What do you think a forum is? I will tell you that it is a place for debate. You seem to think that it is for mannerless put-downs and tantrums.
There are several things in the letter that makes me suspicious it is fake.
If you were professional pilot and someone else claimed to be a professional pilot and wanted to see the cockpit. While the visitor pilot that claimed to be certified on that type of aircraft was is in the jump seat proved to be very unfamiliar with the aircraft type, would not that set off an alarm bell?????? I would have escorted the visitor out of the cockpit immediately, and I would have radioed security to give him a little greeting and debriefing at the next destination, I would also alert the crew of the discrepancies and suspicions and asked them to keep an eye on him.
I suspect this e-mail may be a fake released as a publicity stunt to spark interest in their movie. I suspect you and your alleged trusted source has been duped.
I am not going to tell you every reason I think it is a fake, because the wrong people might be listening, so next time they could make a better fake. Discretion is part of security.
Having served in the intelligence services after my flying career I was of course completely unaware of that!
If it is publicly known that Atta flew from Baltimore to Atlanta on July 26, 2001, then why isn’t it listed?
* July 1, 2001: Atta flies from Boston to New York City.
* July 3, 2001: Atta flies from Newark to Fort Lauderdale.
* July 7 or July 8 or July 9, 2001: Atta fly from Miami to Madrid, Spain via Zurich.
* July 19, 2001: Return flight to America, Fort Lauderdale, Florida via Atlanta’s Hartsfield International Airport.
* Late July, 2001: Atta flies to Newark, New Jersey to meet with other hijackers in the area.
* July 30, 2001: Atta flies back from New Jersey to Florida.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohammed_Atta
http://www.globalsecurity.org/security/profiles/generate_movements.php?name=Mohamed+Atta
By: Hurrifan - 17th February 2007 at 09:02
sounds very suspect.. yes they gained access to a lot of flight decks but there is too much political rhetoric for this to be simply a story telling.
By: ATFS_Crash - 17th February 2007 at 04:45
I suspect that it is a fake. I suspect much of the information in the email is true, however I think it might be fabricated from facts. I am skeptical Pat Gilmore wrote the alleged emails and I supect much of the claims are false.
I also posted the letter on another forum. Somebody has said that he doesn’t believe it, so I have asked him to give his reasons for such a statement. I posted it in good faith as it came from a trusted source – a retired tin-pusher in Canada. If it does turn out to be bogus I will unreservedly apologise to our membership.
So you don’t think you have to support your claims, but anyone that doubt you has to?
Newforest’s has posted a very good skepticism to doubt your post. I don’t know if Newforest’s claims are true, but the logic of his skepticism is sound.
There is a pilot named Pat Gilmore in the database who is an ATPL. According to the database, his medical expired June 2005, but the writer of the letter claims he retired in May 2006.
Why should we spoon feed you every little detail about why we think it is fake? There are several things in the letter that makes me suspicious it is fake.
If you were professional pilot and someone else claimed to be a professional pilot and wanted to see the cockpit. While the visitor pilot that claimed to be certified on that type of aircraft was is in the jump seat proved to be very unfamiliar with the aircraft type, would not that set off an alarm bell?????? I would have escorted the visitor out of the cockpit immediately, and I would have radioed security to give him a little greeting and debriefing at the next destination, I would also alert the crew of the discrepancies and suspicions and asked them to keep an eye on him.
I suspect this e-mail may be a fake released as a publicity stunt to spark interest in their movie. I suspect you and your alleged trusted source has been duped.
I am not going to tell you every reason I think it is a fake, because the wrong people might be listening, so next time they could make a better fake. Discretion is part of security.
If it is publicly known that Atta flew from Baltimore to Atlanta on July 26, 2001, then why isn’t it listed?
* July 1, 2001: Atta flies from Boston to New York City.
* July 3, 2001: Atta flies from Newark to Fort Lauderdale.
* July 7 or July 8 or July 9, 2001: Atta fly from Miami to Madrid, Spain via Zurich.
* July 19, 2001: Return flight to America, Fort Lauderdale, Florida via Atlanta’s Hartsfield International Airport.
* Late July, 2001: Atta flies to Newark, New Jersey to meet with other hijackers in the area.
* July 30, 2001: Atta flies back from New Jersey to Florida.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohammed_Atta
http://www.globalsecurity.org/security/profiles/generate_movements.php?name=Mohamed+Atta
By: Ren Frew - 17th February 2007 at 02:56
I also posted the letter on another forum. Somebody has said that he doesn’t believe it, so I have asked him to give his reasons for such a statement. I posted it in good faith as it came from a trusted source – a retired tin-pusher in Canada. If it does turn out to be bogus I will unreservedly apologise to our membership.
There’s more than a fair share of rhetoric and jingosim attached to it to be honest. If this is personal opinion then I’m glad the fellow is no longer flying…
TBH the entire thing sounds like a party political broadcast for the ‘Dubya’ campaign… Either that or an outake voiceover for said ‘9/11’ movie… ?:o
By: Moggy C - 16th February 2007 at 22:17
Well worth posting as a discussion starter.
If it does turn out to be an urban legend / internet myth I am sure nobody will hold it against you.
Moggy
By: Kernowglyn - 16th February 2007 at 18:52
I also posted the letter on another forum. Somebody has said that he doesn’t believe it, so I have asked him to give his reasons for such a statement. I posted it in good faith as it came from a trusted source – a retired tin-pusher in Canada. If it does turn out to be bogus I will unreservedly apologise to our membership.
By: Grey Area - 16th February 2007 at 17:59
Looks like an “urban legend” to me…….. :rolleyes:
By: Newforest - 16th February 2007 at 17:53
There is a pilot named Pat Gilmore in the database who is an ATPL. According to the database, his medical expired June 2005, but the writer of the letter claims he retired in May 2006.:confused:
By: Moggy C - 16th February 2007 at 17:31
I also found that
very strange because I know that in order to have an Airline Transport
Pilot rating, the rating required to be an airline captain, one has to
be a US citizen
How odd. All the thousands of non-US airline pilots must be flying around unlicensed.
Now that’s scary.
Moggy
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February 16, 2007 at 2:51 pm