dark light

Any Brit "executive warbirds"?

In the years between the end of WWII and the advent of the Gulfstream I, a number of ex-warbirds were converted to executive transports, most notably Howard 500s and On Mark Marksmen. Also B-25s, B-17s, even a proposed six-seat BT-13 and rumored Republic plans to turn P-47Ds into multi-seaters. Did anything of the sort go on in the UK? (Not talking about Lancasters turned into airliners and the like–just pure businessplanes.)

Member for:

19 years 1 month

Posts:

10,735

Send private message

By: J Boyle - 10th May 2017 at 14:39

Longshot…
One problem with the Martin B-26 being converted for corporate use in the 50s would have been finding suitable airframes. Even by that date, most had been scrapped.
Few made it to the USAF when that service was formed in 1947.

Member for:

19 years 1 month

Posts:

1,978

Send private message

By: j_jza80 - 10th May 2017 at 13:51

Was a civilian version of the Canberra ever proposed? I would have thought it an ideal candidate.

Member for:

19 years 1 month

Posts:

1,591

Send private message

By: longshot - 10th May 2017 at 12:51

Stepwilk’s original post omitted Bill Lear’s Learstar project…presumably the idea germinated after his historic flight to Moscow in a Cessna 310 for the Tushino Air Show 1956 ( 1st US private aircraft visit post war) making the US corporate warbird conversion scene very much a late 1950s/early1960s phenomenon so contemporary with the Gulfstream 1. The Lockheed twin warbirds were basically converted airliner designs anyway.With its fatter fuselage the Martin B-26 must have been more suitable for business conversions than the Douglas B-26 and there were a couple of early Martins converted….Lear must have moved on to the Learjet project about 1962.
BOAC used converted Hudsons in WWII so certification would have not been too difficult but it seems none were done postwar.The Percival Prince picked up a few corporate orders but as said the DH Dove got most. David Brown reportedly used his Dove from his Aston Martin factory at the small grass Hanworth airfield for direct overseas flights as late as 1956

Member for:

19 years 1 month

Posts:

9,127

Send private message

By: Mark12 - 10th May 2017 at 08:03

Does Aviation Traders 7 seat Prentice conversion count?

Ah! My first ever flight. September 1959 from Ramsgate.

The Prentice was formerly VR249…and is now static at Newark Air Museum.

Mark

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v634/Mark12/Album%206/Prentice%20VR249-01-001_zpswbbhamre.jpg

Member for:

19 years 1 month

Posts:

1,591

Send private message

By: longshot - 9th May 2017 at 23:17

Does Aviation Traders 7 seat Prentice conversion count?

Member for:

19 years 1 month

Posts:

2,313

Send private message

By: John Aeroclub - 9th May 2017 at 23:01

Walrus as whaling spotters.

John

Member for:

19 years 1 month

Posts:

9,127

Send private message

By: Mark12 - 8th May 2017 at 22:41

I remember looking at the mock-up at Southend at a BAPC meeting in the early 1970’s.

It could have been Aviation traders.

http://forum.keypublishing.com/showthread.php?21759-What-is-this&highlight=mystery%20jet

Member for:

19 years 1 month

Posts:

843

Send private message

By: Kenneth - 8th May 2017 at 22:09

The idea of corporate aircraft wasn’t as developed in Europe at that time as it was in the USA. The Americans have always been lightyears ahead in this respect, and still are, today mainly because of the (relative) total lack of municipal airport facilities in Europe as compared to the USA.

Member for:

19 years 1 month

Posts:

592

Send private message

By: farnboroughrob - 8th May 2017 at 20:04

What about Spitfire G-AHZI, wasn’t this used as a personal transport before it’s demise in 1947.? British designs didn’t lend themselves to conversion like the A-26, B-25, and Lockheed twins. Plus I guess the ARB would not have been too keen on conversions of clapped out bombers. I guess the US was awash with low time aircraft for conversions?

Member for:

19 years 1 month

Posts:

10,735

Send private message

By: J Boyle - 8th May 2017 at 19:37

The Jetcraft Mystery jet Vampire variant was headed up by a guy named Morgan. The concept was around for a fairly long time, every few years it would pop up again. I can’t help but think some of the ex-RCAF vampires mentioned above were kept around just in case the scheme ever materialized.

Member for:

19 years 1 month

Posts:

5,170

Send private message

By: Wyvernfan - 8th May 2017 at 17:28

I think it was Marshalls at Cambridge airport that had several vampires for possible conversion to four seater executive spec, but that never materialised.

Rob

Member for:

19 years 1 month

Posts:

1,503

Send private message

By: Sopwith - 8th May 2017 at 17:17

There was the Howard 500 that was at Shobdon many years ago, which I believe went to Baker Oils. It was a Lockheed derivative. I know it’s American but used in Britain so does that count?

Member for:

19 years 1 month

Posts:

9,127

Send private message

By: Mark12 - 8th May 2017 at 17:06

I believe a company in the US drew up plans to produce an executive jet based on converted Vampires, no more details to hand just yet.

A British company also embarked on a Vampire four possibly six seater.

I remember looking at the mock-up at Southend at a BAPC meeting in the early 1970’s.

It could have been Aviation traders.

I will have an image somewhere…but if not Spitfire family it might not be so easy to locate it.

Mark

Member for:

19 years 1 month

Posts:

100,651

Send private message

By: Arabella-Cox - 8th May 2017 at 16:49

Probably not what the OP had in mind but the Beagle-Auster 6As and A.61 Terriers were created from “warbirds” (!!!!), the Auster AOP 6 !!!

Member for:

19 years 1 month

Posts:

1,720

Send private message

By: D1566 - 8th May 2017 at 16:44

There were also questions of need and affordability. Distances in the UK made it less easy to justify and Post WWII Austerity would have weighed against the idea too

Member for:

19 years 1 month

Posts:

100,651

Send private message

By: Arabella-Cox - 8th May 2017 at 16:42

Just checked Jackson’s de Havilland Aircraft since 1909:- “” “At least 39 surplus R.C.A.F. Mk.3s were demilitarised and sold in the USA as fast private ‘hacks’ or executive aircraft….”””””

Member for:

19 years 1 month

Posts:

870

Send private message

By: Graham Boak - 8th May 2017 at 16:39

A second-hand Provost, Oxford etc. cost a lot less than a new Dove. That’s a very strong need.

The other side of the original question is to ask which British aircraft would have been suitable for conversion as executive transports. Roomy twins were not a British speciality, the services relying upon the US to fill what were minority roles. Mosquitoes and any surviving Blenheims couldn’t carry anyone, it would be difficult to produce an executive aircraft from a Beaufighter, and Buckinghams were rare and little roomier. There would also have been the difficulties in obtaining civil airworthiness judgements on military aircraft.

Member for:

19 years 1 month

Posts:

43

Send private message

By: Albanian Bob - 8th May 2017 at 16:26

No real need for converting tired warplanes, when de Havilland launched the Dove in 1946. Not that that stopped a lot of companies using Proctors, Arguses, Ansons, Oxfords (often as Consuls), Rapides etc etc

Member for:

19 years 1 month

Posts:

1,519

Send private message

By: ericmunk - 8th May 2017 at 16:11

I believe a company in the US drew up plans to produce an executive jet based on converted Vampires, no more details to hand just yet.

The Jetcraft Mystery Jet.

1 2
Sign in to post a reply