Aussie Meatbox

RE: Aussie Meatbox

I always find it funny when people complain about aircraft leaving this country to display elsewhere.
If you count the number of imports to the UK I bet they outnumber the home grown varieties.

Lets see, P51, B25, B17, Skyraider, Wildcat, Bearcat, Corsair, Hellcat, P47, Harvards, Yaks, Beech (all types), Buchons, Black 6, Pilatus, and even when you have a British aircraft are you sure it was from Britain? Blenheim (Canada), Hurricanes (Russia), Beaufighter Australia etc.

I think it is very healthy to have an exchange of types. Sometimes what saves an example from extinction is the fact it was exported. No point keeping her here if their is no desire or funding. I would rather see the Meteor display in Australia then languish in a field here (as has happened to many jets). I have never seen Winston display so isn’t it our fault that she has been sold? I bet however one day Winston will return!

RE: Aussie Meatbox

Philo

Dream on…..

Wombat

RE: Aussie Meatbox

Wombat be assured that if by chance I come across the odd few thousand quid under the mattress tonight I’ll be on a plane straight away…………. to Florida mate.

Having said that I suppose I could come and help our boys carry the Ashes back this winter.

RE: Aussie Meatbox

Loke here fellas…

If seeing Winston, Canberras and other old kero cans fly is your thing, your are always welcome to visit sunny Oz and watch them go round.

We don’t have that many airshows out here, and the number of airworthy old aircraft is less than the UK or the US, but at least our climate lets us use them frequently.

So, swallow a bit of pommy pride and take a trip to Oz – we can guarantee it will be worth the trip.

Regards

Wombat

RE: Aussie Meatbox

Ant you missed a gem in the 2000 show.
The Noratlas was certainly the main star, particularly as this was the first time I had seen one in the air.It was also great to see the rare Howard 500, a pair of Pembrokes, DC3 DC6 Electra and Convair 440 of course,Flamard and the little Nord whose true indentity always escapes me,Anson, Twinpin, Prentice,Piston Provost, Dove and Heron. But this was nicely mixed with Hunter, Canbera, Meteor F8 ,Gnat and L39.
I know Mike Collett is a piston man( and very nice with it if you ever meet him)and it would a great show to pull off, but I just wonder if no jets at all will appeal to Joe public.
Of course if he can secure the dutch Connie and maybe the Swiss Super Connie (if in Europe by then)and get the Shackleton moving (especially as BAe systems have now relinquished on design), and …. well thats probably enough to draw a good crowd.
Phil

RE: Aussie Meatbox

Just a point about the RAF’s Canberras.It has to be remembered that these machines are knocking on a bit-most of the pilots who fly them are younger than the machines themselves.Despite this,the old faithful Canberra is still a very useful and well used aircraft. This means that they have to be extremely frugal about the amount of hours they are putting on the aircraft to ensure that they remain operational for as long as possible.The PR.9’s are only flown operationally or for other essential reasons.All type conversion and currency flying etc is done on the non-operational PR.7’s,but the hours on these are getting short aswell.So bascially,they can’t afford to be too generous when it comes to supplying them for display work.
I think it’s great news that Air Atlantique are doing thier 50’s show again.I didn’t manage to get to this event when it was staged before,so fingers crossed I’ll make it to this one.My mouth waters to think of machines that fit the bill for the show-Noratlas,SuperConnie or even the Shackelton.Oh well,we can dream can’t we…??

RE: Aussie Meatbox

Very strange to hear that. A few classic jets have connections with Coventry, the RNHF Sea Hawk and Hunter F6A’s XF515 and XF516 were all built in the city, so would be nice to see them returning ‘home’ for the show.

M

RE: Aussie Meatbox

Why single out the Canberra?

They’ve some Hunters too.

But you must realise that Mike Collett is a props/pistons man. He doesn’t really bond with paraffin burners, even though he uses on (A baby Citation) to commute from home in Jersey to the office each day.

Moggy

RE: Aussie Meatbox

What i also should have said before being too eager with the send button was the Air Atlantique are planning a 50’s show next year but it is to be exclusively prop aircraft……….Why ?. Quite odd as they have a Canbera!!!.

Phil

RE: Aussie Meatbox

OK Ant, I concede the point about the meatbox in RAAF service and I wasn’t trying to belittle that. It was more a case of finding any excuse to moan about important aircraft leaving these shores.
And yes you were right, we did see very little of ‘Winston’ on the display circuit, I think the last time I saw it was at Air Atlantiques 50’s display in 2000 shortly before the sale was secured.That was probably the last display I saw a Canbera at as well!.
What is it with airshow organisers and early jets ?, OK we get to see loads of Vamps, Venoms and Hunters but not great deal of Meteors (NF11) , Canberas (private or service) or the Sea Vixen.
The next thing we know is that the RAF will finally chop the Canbera and we will not get a chance to see any before the axeman cometh.

RE: Aussie Meatbox

Know how you feel Philo!My own personal feeling is that the Meteor is in atleast the second best place that it could be.The RAAF flew the Meteor into action in Korea despite being outclassed by the MiG15’s of the Communist forces.The colour scheme ‘Winston’ now wears actually represents a Meteor called ‘Halestorm’,flown by SqnLdr Goerge Hale.He actually managed to down a MiG in this machine,quite a feat!The RAAF Meteors in general flew a very tough war out there in Korea,so it’s fitting that there should be an airworthy example in Auz.Afterall,we weren’t seeing much of her while she was over here. 🙁

RE: Aussie Meatbox

Look you antipodean whingebags, be bloody grateful that someone sold you the best looking (and sounding) Meteor that used to grace our display skies. I don’t think that ‘Winston’ should have left these shores in the first place.
And anyway if you want the record of history changing just get the Americans to make a movie about it !!!.

RE: Aussie Meatbox

Can I just point out what a fine paintjob has been applied to the Meteor (in case you hadn’t noticed).

Anyway, John Wayne won WW2 on the sands of IWO Jima.

RE: Aussie Meatbox

Ant

Yes, I can see your point. Would have been a bit difficult fighting Hitler from Canada, wouldn’t it? At least we would have had aircraft which could reach Europe, the Jerries would have been stuffed trying to return the favour!!!

Actually, you have raised a valid point. Had Britain fallen, where would the war have gone? It’s probable that Hitler would still have turned his attention to Russia by mid or late 41, and we know that he would eventually have lost the war in the East. Assuming that Germany had control of the continent plus the British Isles, how far back would he have been pushed by the Russians if the Allies didn’t have a base in the west from which to launch Overlord? The only real option might have been to launch from North Africa on a bigger scale than Torch.

Maybe the Brits would be speaking German or Russian today.

Wombat

RE: Aussie Meatbox

Hi Wombat,
I’ve no intention of belittling the efforts of Australia or the other Commonwealth/Dominion countries.My point is that if Britain had folded,there would have been nowhere from which to operate against Nazi Occupied Europe.It’s less a question of what went on on the battlefield or in the air,and more to do with what happened on the home front and in politics.The fact that Churchill and the British people decided not to surrender enabled there to be a BattleOfBritain,D-Day etc.It came EXTREMELY close to Britain making an agreed peace with Nazi Germany at the time of thier conquest of France.There were many such as Chaimberlin,Lord Halifax and Loyd-George who all wished to avoid further bloodshed and arrange terms with Germany.It was only the resolve and character of Churchill and his supporters that stopped this from happening.There wouldn’t have needed to be an invasion,the Nazis would have strolled right in.
So I would say that Britain stood alone in the sense that it’s people and it’s leader held it’s future in thier hands and,perhaps inadvertantly,the future of Europe and perhaps the world.

RE: Aussie Meatbox

Hang on there, fellas – Ja is right.

I have seen the statement “Britain stood alone” on a number of occasions and it p****ed me off too. Australia declared war on Germany within 24 hours of Britain in September ’39. I don’t know how long it took Canada, New Zealand etc – perhaps other members can enlighten us. So what if we were “dominions and colonies” – our support was offered and given to Britain from day one. The contribution provided by those “dominions and colonies” was not insignificant. During the North African campaign, the Australian 8th Division wrote its own history which is acknowledged today as the Rats of Tobruk.

History has shown that Hitler really didn’t get as close to invading Britain as was thought at the time, and this had to be because of the combined efforts of the British Commonwealth military units. Certainly, Britain contributed the vast majority of the personnel in the three services, and almost all the aircraft and materiel. Australia contributed significantly in training, munitions, food, clothing, raw materials and the Royal Australian Navy provided significant support in the Atlantic and Mediterranean theatres, at least until early 1942, when our own problems became serious.

We should also recognise that, following the collapse of their own countries, many troops from Poland, Holland, Belgium and France were available to support Britain.

I accept that it is popular to depict Britain as “standing alone” as an island fortress, separated from the blackness of German dominated Europe by a narrow strip of water, but please don’t denigrate the contribution of many other nations to Britain’s defence during that time.

Regards

The Wombat

RE: Aussie Meatbox

Hi folks,
I do see Ja’s point about Britain not standing alone,but I only agree with it to some extent.Whilst it’s true that Britain survived through aid from the US,personnel from the Empire etc,it has to be appreciated that the situation was still pretty grim.
Britain was alone in the sense that it was the only European power facing the Third Riech,and all the other countries at war with Germany in 1940-41 were British colonies and Dominions.Without Britain,there would not have been any opposition at all to Nazi Germany,and it’s difficult to see how any other countries could have later become involved if Britain had folded early on.

RE: Aussie Meatbox

It’s about time Australia’s contribution to wars in the past was recognised over seas, especially in england who would rather send us in to do the dirty work while they bugged out.

I hate it with a passion, who every documentry about England during the second world war saying that “England Stood Alone”, WHAT A CROCK. England never did, what about the Commonwealth that bolstered the British defences by contributing personel. Australia had Four squadrons in England during the war. Two fighters, a Bomber and a Squadron in Coastal command. not to mention New Zealand having Two Squadrons One Fighter and One bomber And India and South Africa also contributed. So with this evidence they were never alone!

Nice pic Ant, Thanks for the mention.

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