Avro Avian 625 Monoplane?

Avro Avian Sports monoplane, G-AAYW

A bit more extra history

From Aldershot News – Friday 31 May 1935

re: EMPIRE AIR DAY AT FARNBOROUGH 

“A private monoplane which aroused much
curiosity as to its ownership was the green
Avro.” belonging to Flight Lieutenant Atcherley,
who has had a powerful swivel searchlight
fitted to the underneath of the
port, side wing, so that he can effect night
landings without, the necessity for ground
flares.”

Thank you John, that’s really excellent! The colour really was ‘pea green’ wasn’t it! To have that kind of colour documentation from someone who knew the aircraft is very much appreciated.

Thank you,

Jon

Mono Avain

Hello
Here is a picture of the landing light my father fitted to the underside of the Avro Avian. The plane had navigation lights and my father rigged up an old landing light under the port wing. The lamp was from a scrapped Vickers Virginia. The battery for it was strapped in the luggage compartment just behind the cockpit.

Model Avian Monoplane

That would be cool!

Do you have any pictures of your fathers model John? I’d be interested to see them or track it down at Newark…

Thanks
Jon

Hello Jon
Yes I do have some pictures. Not very good as the one called “Avian model by EAS” are scanned from prints. I might be able to find the negs. but I think they will be a small format. I am not sure if the other one called “green avian” is my fathers model or someone elses.

Thanks Mark, I did have those images, but really appreciate the extra details…

Thanks
Jon

Hi all.

I’m researching the 625 monoplane version of the Avro Avian. Two were built, one with a Genet engine and one with a Cirrus Hermes. It’s the latter aircraft, registed G-AAYW, that I’m interested in. There doesn’t seem to be an awful lot of info on the web.

I’m looking for photos and hopefully a reasonable 3-view of G-AAYW. Apparently it was pea-green but I can’t find any documentation to back that up?

Thanks in advance!

Jon

There is brief mention of G-AAYV and G-AAYW on page 101 of “Avro – an aircraft album” by Harlin & Jenks, 1973 Ian Allen books, under the type 594 & 616 Avian (the type 581 Avian is treated seperately).

Below is a summary of the entry.

The type 625 Avian Monoplane is listed as consisting of a single seat Avian fuselage fitted with 30ft span wire braced wings and a special wide track undercarriage.

Two were build for racing, registered as G-AAYV (Genet Major I) and G-AAYW (Cirrus Hermes I), they were entered in the 1930 Kings Cup but were too serverely handicapped and the race was won by an Avian Mk III.

G-AAYV is listed as being converted into a sports Avian (ie Mk IVM) in 1931 and G-AAYW being passed into the hands of S/L RLR Atcherley of Schneider Trophy fame.

A side on photo of G-AAYV (lifting off or landing?) flown by F.Tomkins at the 1930 Kings Cup Air Race is credited from Flight International.

Perhaps Flight have photos of G-AAYW at the same event?

The photo of G-AAYV shows the same prominent fuselage stringers of the welded metal tube fuselage of the Mark IVM, the fin / rudder seems identical as does the Genet Major and townsend ring as compared to the adjacent photo of G-ABMF a racing Mk IVM with its forward seat replaced with an 18 Gal fuel tank.

As Paul suggests earlier, the main differences would therefore seem to be the wing, bracing and the unique undercarriage, although the windscreen, and cut-away cockpit differs from G-ABMF and may be derived from a Sports Avian referred in the text as being a modified version of the Mk IVM with a cut-away cockpit sides, racing windscreens and a modified undercarriage with a straight-through axle, (apparently 16 were built – mostly with Cirrus Hermes I engines).

There are close up on the ground pictures of G-AAYV (without its Townsend Ring) and G-AAYW on the Flight Archive.

The 3/4 forward view of G-AAYV provides a good view of the undercarriage while the side on view of G-AAYW shows the wing bracing, the cut-away cockpit and the Hermes installation.

There are larger format versions on the flight archive.

http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1930/untitled0%20-%200769.html

Although as you mention yourself google provides many excellent images of G-AAYW in anycase.

regards

Mark Pilkington

Beautiful machines! Thanks for the photos Bill.
Mr Byron Reynolds has sent me a bunch of photos of the Avian taken during restoration and it has turned out a treat.

Best regards,

Paul

G’Day Bob,

I have had a quick look and the only reference to the Monoplane I can find is for the steel tube frame, which is also used for the Mk IV M, VI M Sports and Mk V. Mind you, I have found two iterations of the steel frame, basically in the way the forward end of the frame is braced.
Going by what I have seen so far though, the fuselage, tail group and Hermes engine installation are all common to both the biplane and monoplane Avians. One would need to come up with wing drawings, main undercarriage and the bracing of these two items.

Best regards,

Paul

Hi Paul:

Sorry to bend this thread a little. I promised to send a pic of the Canda Av museum’s Avian in their storage building. See attached. Also I’ve attached a Pic of the museum- restored Travelair 2000. Both of these are now on display in the main building along with the long-time stored Cirrus Moth.
Regards
Bill

Do you fancy trying to dig it up?

That would be cool!

Do you have any pictures of your fathers model John? I’d be interested to see them or track it down at Newark…

Thanks
Jon

G’Day Bob,

I have had a quick look and the only reference to the Monoplane I can find is for the steel tube frame, which is also used for the Mk IV M, VI M Sports and Mk V. Mind you, I have found two iterations of the steel frame, basically in the way the forward end of the frame is braced.
Going by what I have seen so far though, the fuselage, tail group and Hermes engine installation are all common to both the biplane and monoplane Avians. One would need to come up with wing drawings, main undercarriage and the bracing of these two items.

Best regards,

Paul

You can buy plans for a model of it here! 🙂
Beyond that, I’m not much help I’m afraid.

Do any of the surviving Avian drawings say if they are also for the monoplane ?.

Bob T.

Avro Avian Monoplane

I believe the airframe was used for ground instruction, fire practise and then it was pushed into a pond which was then probably filled in. Where this pond is/was I am not sure. Do you fancy trying to dig it up? Best of luck! John

Thank you very much John! I have nearly finished designing a balsa and tissue free flight rubber powered model of G-AAYW. That kind of information makes the process even more enjoyable… my grandfather worked on gypsy engines in Dominies (Dragan Rapides) during the war.

I seem to remember G-AAYW ended up in a pond. Have I got that right?

Jon

Would I be correct in thinking that 23 February 1946 may have been the effective date on which the ARB undertook a post-war ‘spring cleaning’ of the UK civil register, whereby an aircraft whose existence and/or ownership could not be verified was removed from it? If so, it may be that an aircraft recorded as ‘scrapped/withdrawn’ on that date could have given up the ghost at any time between that date and 1939 (hence Jackson’s comment).

The CAA register says that ownership passed to Walter Leslie Handley on 23rd August 1939 and was scrapped/withdrawn on 23rd Feb 1946

Information like that, John, make fora like this worth their weight in gold. It’s the sort of information that you won’t find in books or on the web. Personal recollections that probably never would find an outlet in print and if not for media such as this, would pass with the possessor of it. Thus I thank you.

You say that G-AAYW “had to be abandoned at the time of the Munich crisis”. Are you able to elaborate by saying why the Munich Crisis precipitated its abandonment and where it was abandoned? A.J.Jackson says that it owned by Flt. Lt. Atcherley at Market Drayton for ten years from 1930; that it was at Elmdon, owned by W.L.Handley, in June 1940; and that it was scrapped during the 1939-45 war.

Avro Avian Sports monoplane, G-AAYW

My father knew Flt. Lt. R L R Atcherley (Batchy). He was a test pilot at the Royal Aircraft Establishment and kept his green, private Avro Avian Sports monoplane, G-AAYW, in the hangar and my father was asked to look after the engine. Batchy had recently returned with G-AAYW from a Middle East posting where he had gained some notoriety and also some disciplinary measures against him. The Avro Avian was specially built for air racing and the machine was given to Batchy for £200 which was his share of the 1929 King’s Cup Air Race prize money. The engine was handed over by the makers on “extended loan”. The aeroplane was kept for nine years until it had to be abandoned at the time of the Munich crisis. I have some pictures and some further notes. My father made a non flying model of this aircraft from plans kindly supplied by BAE. The model is now at Newark Air Museum – or it was the last time I saw it! John Shipman. E mail: j.m.shipmanATntlworld.com (replace “AT” with “@”)

Thanks guys…

As I was thumbing through ‘British Light Aeroplanes’ (by Arthur Ord-Hume) last night, I noticed that on p.108 there is a forward 7/8 view photograph – admittedly not large – of G-AAYW at Heston. Sorry to be so late in mentioning this.