BA LCY to NYC

On Jethro’s it has the order for Two Airbus A318 but are these Airbus A318 elite verison’s ?:confused:

http://www.jethros.dwsitech.com/fleets/fleet_listings/ba_a320srs.htm

James

PS How many A318’s have BA ordered sorry if posted
JAmes

Couldn’t see it either, but understand two have been ordered.

****** 😮 Was that a Summer flight only?

Regards
James

Yeah it only lasted the summer.

It was just a political ploy to allow AC to cease their St Johns service, I don’t think there was ever any chance it was going to be long term.

Been and gone mate!!

****** 😮 Was that a Summer flight only?

Regards
James

observing now that a tech stop in SNN is ness for fuel (which i queried in my OP that could the airbus make JFK from the LCY short runway) then the punters may put off by that,
premium pax dont like tech stops,

it doesnot affect flight crew limitations having a 2 sector flight re flying hours too much on an eastern seaboard destn but its fairly tight.

i just think trying to market commercially a flight with a stop will not be so attractive.
i am certain of that.
i think for BA there is a risk here can they sell it with 1 stop and fill it up!
OR they are doing this just to push the new competiton out because BA may have been losing pax to them??
maxjet have gone, so is it 1 down and 2 to go?

under open skies then they could pick up pax in ireland but SNN is not a huge premium market whereas DUB might be BUT as there is NO stop on the inbound flight then the pax cant be dropped off on the way back 🙁

re fast tracking pax thru US immigration in SNN ?
i have never heard of that being suggested again by border/homeland security as ever an option now for overseas visitors to be cleared before they land on US soil, so i doubt that can be considered here unless they change their minds which in current climates is unlikely.

again premium pax would NOT like to be disturbed by having to clear customs or immigration on a tech stop in ireland LOL

i also dont think the tech stop either has anything contracturaly to do with what branch of crew is used to fly these jets, it purely is a fuel stop.
a poster mentioned why not use cityflyer crews but these are not trained for etops or long haul whereas mainline are. (costs and possible industrial strife apart)

re LGA airport as an option for arrivals/deps in the US as a poster suggested,
is this an international airport facility?
i dont know if it has customs there and did it ever in recent history?

all aside i do think its a great idea BUT knowing very well from my experience exactly what super J class pax are like then the tech stop hurdle needs to be overcome via good marketing which albeit the LCY product does very well…

I not sure you’re anywhere close with what you’re saying… A few observations:

1. Even with two sectors, LCY-SNN-NYC is NOT fairly tight – for an acclimatised crew on a morning departure, maximum duty time is something like 13 hours or so, which is plenty

2. US Immigration clearance at SNN (and DUB for that matter) has been going on for years, and is still available – it also happens in a number of Canadian and Caribbean airports

3. LGA has customs – it handles flights from Canada and the Caribbean. It wouldn’t need immigration (see 2 above). However, LGA does have a perimeter rule and a no-new-international services rule that BA would have to do some work on IF (repeat IF) they were looking at LGA

4. Many [premium] pax would gladly trade a short tech stop combined with US Immigration in SNN for having to stand in lines at the New York end – the sort of pax this service is pitched at are likely to be mainly taking just carry on bags and aeroplane to curbside in just a few minutes wil be a huge selling point

5. The inbound to LCY will be even more attractive – none stop and an arrival shortly before office hours will be hugely attractive to those heading for the City or Canary Warf

As I said previously, BA will do really well with this operation… EOS may not be happy though!

ANdy

I think this is more to do with BALPA agreements on long-haul flying than anything else.

The agreement with BALPA regarding Cityflyer pilots is that they will not fly anything with more than a certain number of seats, 115 if I remember correctly. So in theory no problem there.

I suspect it’s more to do with BA having whatever ETOPS approval is needed as well as already having Airbus aircraft and crew.

I’m not sure where in the thread the tech stop got entwined with industrial agreements and traffic rights, but as rog747 says it is just that, a tech stop.

1L.

This reminds off the service AC wanna start with a A319 to LHR. Cant wait for this to start:cool:

Been and gone mate!!

Anyone know when this apron will be finished which is being build to handle the A318 and I think the EMB 170 aswel.

http://www.jetphotos.net/viewphoto.php?id=6120183 ?:confused:

This reminds off the service AC wanna start with a A319 to LHR. Cant wait for this to start:cool:

PS How many A318’s have BA ordered sorry if posted

JAmes

Ok…
The fuss would be that, you have an international service, and if this was done by BAcityflyer, then the wages would be cheaper than a 747 capt on mainline. Which would then open up a can of worms during contract time, as the “management” could use it as a bargining chip.

Hence why BA pilots held a vote to strike the other week, as the new subsiduary “openskies” wasn’t using mainline staff, but supposed to be employing others on greatly reduced benefits.

Ah right, I see. Thanks !

observing now that a tech stop in SNN is ness for fuel (which i queried in my OP that could the airbus make JFK from the LCY short runway) then the punters may put off by that,
premium pax dont like tech stops,

it doesnot affect flight crew limitations having a 2 sector flight re flying hours too much on an eastern seaboard destn but its fairly tight.

i just think trying to market commercially a flight with a stop will not be so attractive.
i am certain of that.
i think for BA there is a risk here can they sell it with 1 stop and fill it up!
OR they are doing this just to push the new competiton out because BA may have been losing pax to them??
maxjet have gone, so is it 1 down and 2 to go?

under open skies then they could pick up pax in ireland but SNN is not a huge premium market whereas DUB might be BUT as there is NO stop on the inbound flight then the pax cant be dropped off on the way back 🙁

re fast tracking pax thru US immigration in SNN ?
i have never heard of that being suggested again by border/homeland security as ever an option now for overseas visitors to be cleared before they land on US soil, so i doubt that can be considered here unless they change their minds which in current climates is unlikely.

again premium pax would NOT like to be disturbed by having to clear customs or immigration on a tech stop in ireland LOL

i also dont think the tech stop either has anything contracturaly to do with what branch of crew is used to fly these jets, it purely is a fuel stop.
a poster mentioned why not use cityflyer crews but these are not trained for etops or long haul whereas mainline are. (costs and possible industrial strife apart)

re LGA airport as an option for arrivals/deps in the US as a poster suggested,
is this an international airport facility?
i dont know if it has customs there and did it ever in recent history?

all aside i do think its a great idea BUT knowing very well from my experience exactly what super J class pax are like then the tech stop hurdle needs to be overcome via good marketing which albeit the LCY product does very well…

I’m confused… (not difficult) why would BALPA have issues with a BA crew flying London-New York in an A318 but not, let’s say a 747, 767, 777 or indeed 757 ?

I think DANTHEMAN77 has answered this, but yes, the reason why not CityFlyer would be with BALPA in that the contracts are different and cheaper so BALPA would insist on it being flown by mainline, hence no issues with this proposal.

Ok…
The fuss would be that, you have an international service, and if this was done by BAcityflyer, then the wages would be cheaper than a 747 capt on mainline. Which would then open up a can of worms during contract time, as the “management” could use it as a bargining chip.

Hence why BA pilots held a vote to strike the other week, as the new subsiduary “openskies” wasn’t using mainline staff, but supposed to be employing others on greatly reduced benefits.

I think this is more to do with BALPA agreements on long-haul flying than anything else.

I’m confused… (not difficult) why would BALPA have issues with a BA crew flying London-New York in an A318 but not, let’s say a 747, 767, 777 or indeed 757 ?

The westbound flight is planned to have a tech stop which to me rather defeats the object.

I was surprised to read that these will be operated by mainline BA rather than BA Cityflyer.

1L.

I think this is more to do with BALPA agreements on long-haul flying than anything else.

Its twice daily, LCY-SNN-JFK and JFK-LCY. The A318 with 32 seats can do that. 15 minute checkin – if you’re in the City of London (and even moreso Docklands), even with the short tech stop, it’d be a no-brainer to go for the LCY service rather than hike all the way out to LHR (unpredictable traffic or nasty public transport journey, longer checkin times, etc). If they can get passengers to clear US Immigration fast-track in Shannon during the splash and dash, it’d be even better as there’d be no waiting in the lines at US immigration in New York – that could even open up the option of BA using closer in LGA rather than JFK (BA haven’t actually confirmed JFK yet, have they?). I think this will be a big success, and I bet it’ll put the wind up EOS (and Silverjet) who actively promote their services as departing from airports easier to access from the City.

Andy

The westbound flight is planned to have a tech stop which to me rather defeats the object.

I was surprised to read that these will be operated by mainline BA rather than BA Cityflyer.

1L.

Have just done some quick research into this, it would have to be in an Elite config, seating up to 18 passengers…

A flight from London City to JFK is approx just over 3,000nm, so it would be possible.

am sure the a318 elite cld make lon-nyc with 18 pax BUT am not sure if LCY runway length would allow the weights for 32 pax plus fuel for upto a max t/o…also am not sure if 18 J or premium J class pax wld be profitable ???

tech stops for fuel are simply not an option for this market the punters would kick off big time lol!

great plan though and am sure if the niche market is there and its operationally possible then coool:D cant wait!

I’d imagine BA will have done their maths first in analysing the route, type to fly, passenger profile and market, before announcing the route:

BA launches business-class only flights

British Airways is to launch double daily business class-only flights from London City airport to New York next year.

Chief executive Willie Walsh said: “This niche service will fly passengers between the heart of the two largest financial centres in the world.

“We will offer a 15 minute check-in for customers in both London and New York. London City’s size means that it is a quick and easy airport to use and, with a maximum of 32 passengers onboard, getting on and off the aircraft will be a smooth process.

“By adding two new daily flights from New York direct into London City we can offer customers working or living in the Canary Wharf and Docklands area an opportunity to fly into an airport right on the doorstep of where they live and work.”

BA has ordered two A318 aircraft from Airbus to operate these flights. It is the first time the airline has ordered A318s, although it already has 69 Airbus A320 family shorthaul aircraft in its fleet.

Have just done some quick research into this, it would have to be in an Elite config, seating up to 18 passengers…

Airbus and Lufthansa Technik will offer the A318 Elite in two variants seating up to 14 or 18 passengers with a projected maximum range of up to 4,000 nautical miles (7,400 kilometers).

A flight from London City to JFK is approx just over 3,000nm, so it would be possible.

Yeah but how much fuel will a A318 Coperate Jet take and what about taking off at LCY. Landing will be fine as it has just completed a TAL flight so will hardly have any fuel but the takeoff willl be a bit of the pain with LCY’S shorty runway