Canadian Museum's Hampden Damaged by Snow Fall

I’ve been away for a few days and look what happens…
Seriously, it’s a great pity that the Hampden has been damaged, but I also think the less than original construction could have contributed to the collapse, on the other hand this might well be a second chance to restore her better. No critisism to the restoration team as the have succeeded in bringing back a Hampden before any other airframe was available.

Good luck to those involved and let’s help them in any way we can.

Cheers

Cees

Thanks Mark,

I’m not sure I recall that article and photo, my memory is of a side on shot in primer, perhaps when it was completed, but even the caption of this one is confusing if like me you read nose to mean the entire cockpit section, rather than the bomb aimer nose itself.

More accolades to the restorers to have recovered the forward fuselage to that condition given the damaged and corroded state of what they started with.

Regards

Mark Pilkington

Mark12 can you scan that Aeroplane Monthly photo and caption into the thread?

Regards

Mark Pilkington

MarkP.

I have located my copy.

Mark12

Sounds just like the voluntary museum sector in the UK! :rolleyes:

Keep up the hard work everyone!! 🙂

JDK

Funding in Canada for anything but Provincial/Federal Museums is a joke.

The policies are such that not for profit museums, read aviation, fight to stay alive with the exception of 1 or 2.

Federal dollars may as well be non existent, Provinces are better with matching fund grants that have allowed many things to happen, but first you need the matching funds. Our tax system does not really reward those donating making it very difficult to raise significant funds to grow or restore aircraft with.

This year is the 100th anniversary of flight in Canada and a great example.

Other than the Canadian Armed Forces there is no Centennial of flight program.

No Federal program, Alberta is having its 100th anniversary of flight and there is no provincial program.

At least in our case the City of Edmonton understands the importance of its history and the economic impact we create and has helped with support on the operational side.

There are lots of reasons for the problem and many in politics support our movement and their efforts appreciated. But the overall attitude is discouraging.

That said our museum is going to have its most successful year, 18 events planned and major centennial programming, and we are fighting to continue to grow and educate.

After doing a ton of research over the last several years it seems of the Western World the 2 countries that get the least support for aviation heritage are Australia and Canada…funny with Canada’s North and the Australian Outback the 2 countries that owe aviation possibly the most.

Ok rant over back on topic.

Tom

Could I suggest that the shot from ‘The Hampden File’ that I posted shows the RAF Museum nose glazing being mated to the then current state of the Canadian front fuselage restoration. In that shot you can see new top hat longerons and support structure is being incorporated in to the cleaned remains of the the recovered residue…as the captions quotes.

I can see that that level of cockpit work would have been a strong motivator for the President of the Handley Page group/Curator of the RAFMus store at Cardington, Ray Funnell, to ‘steer’ the nose glazing in that direction.

I note what is clearly a later image in the Aeroplane Monthly piece showing the new skins applied to that restored structure.

Mark

I have to say I was under the same misapprehension that a complete cockpit/nose had been sent from the UK to support this project, and wonder if that Aeroplane Monthly piece may have been poorly captioned to create that mis-understanding by many of us, as I recall reading about this many years ago and seeing what appeared to be a complete section within a building, which I now assume was the restored section in Canada after its UK nose was fitted?

Mark12 can you scan that Aeroplane Monthly photo and caption into the thread?

Regards

Mark Pilkington

I believe they are actively fundrasing.

I’m told by those in BC that government funding decreases in proportion to the distance from Ottawa; reaching a negative equity in Western BC. Funnily enough, the same noise comes from WA here, regarding to distance to Canberra. 😉

James I shold probably have ben more clear on my point, here is provincial and federal government funding. I am sure the B.C Government could provide some sort of grant money?

Ooops

I’m sorry I started all this!

I certainly had no intention of making a liar of anybody – life’s too short and it’s only an internet forum…………

Was just trying to clarify what went over the pond as I was under the clear impression though that the nose was substantially more than just the glazing section – as were others. I thought I’d seen pictures of a substantially larger lump consistent with the manufacturing break – perhaps before it came into the possession of the RAFM – on show somewhere.

I just seem to remember thinking at the time that “that’s a substantial lump” and would have been an excellent exhibit in its own right in the absence (then) of any other Hampden relic in the UK.

Could it have been so corroded that in less enlighted times only the extreme nose was considered worthy of saving?

A neighbour of mine flew in Hampdens and some years ago he saved up to go to Canada just to see the one recently damaged by snow. He appreciated that although it was re-constructed it was the only representative of that type available and I understand that he was quite overcome with memories of his flights and his missing friends. The enterprise in turning the remains into anything resembling a Hampden must be praised. Best of luck to the museum and their efforts in repairing it. We in the UK also have many people restoring old aircraft outside or without the luxury of proper facilities and I would never denigrate their efforts. Perhaps these restorations have in the past not been to current standards but thats not always possible without loads of cash and facilities.
Langley is high up on my list of places to go just because of the Hampden and although for various reasons it is not possible at present, I will make very effort to do so.

Could I suggest that the shot from ‘The Hampden File’ that I posted shows the RAF Museum nose glazing being mated to the then current state of the Canadian front fuselage restoration. In that shot you can see new top hat longerons and support structure is being incorporated in to the cleaned remains of the the recovered residue…as the captions quotes.

I can see that that level of cockpit work would have been a strong motivator for the President of the Handley Page group/Curator of the RAFMus store at Cardington, Ray Funnell, to ‘steer’ the nose glazing in that direction.

I note what is clearly a later image in the Aeroplane Monthly piece showing the new skins applied to that restored structure.

Mark

And where did the fuselage and wings “just materialize from” then? What museum “gave them up and now regret it”… since you feel the restorers of this aircraft couldn’t have done the work themselves?

There is a clear explanation of the work done from one who was there the whole time in that WIX thread… yet some here insist on calling those who were involved, and those who have spoken to others who were involved liars!

XM692, did you read Mark12s comment above yours? Or is he lying too?

If you have proof they are lying, then give it… otherwise shut up!

Err, calm please – there has never been any suggestion of lying by anyone in this thread. The WIX thread is great, but is hardly a step by step analysis.

No-one is in any doubt as to the achievement in rebuilding the Hampden; we are purely debating how original it is.

As the article posted by XM692 shows, the truth is not always that clear.

Bruce

Yep, thats the one – it isnt clear however which part was donated.

I always remembered that the photo above was taken in the UK – but I may be wrong.

Bruce

XM692, did you read Mark12s comment above yours? Or is he lying too?

If you have proof they are lying, then give it… otherwise shut up!

Well i’m certainly no ***ng liar sir, ~and~ i’ve found said news item. 😡

Cutting below taken from Aeroplane Monthly August 1988 p452. Considering thats just over 20 years ago, i thought that was quite a good result for my fading grey cells; so i’ll now put up & shut up as you so eliquently put it…..

.

.

Thanks Mark12 – like XM692, I definitely recall a larger piece of fuselage, unless the comics had the story wrong at the time. I will go digging.

Bruce

I’m told by those in BC that government funding decreases in proportion to the distance from Ottawa; reaching a negative equity in Western BC. Funnily enough, the same noise comes from WA here, regarding to distance to Canberra

The former Howard government was known to be very Sydney “Centric” in a number of heritage funding examples, the Sydney Harbour Trust being one.

The incoming Rudd Government with its original belt tightning due to inflation, and now its focus on the Economic crisis, is yet to demonstrate a preference of cultural funding “anywhere”?

But it seems a world wide phenonomen that volunteer, not for profit aviation museums sit at the bottom of the gravy barrel, well below performing and visual arts.

Here in Australia we have had a National Maritime Museum for over 20 years, fully funded by the Federal Government at over $13M per annum, with availability of $5k annual grants to regional Maritime Museums in addition to that.

The Pigott Report of 1975 also recommended a National Museum of Australia (delivered in 2000) and a National Air Museum – still to be delivered, but even the $5k regional museum grant would be better than nothing?

regards

Mark Pilkington

Hopefully two things can happen.
1) even with the current economic situation, funds will become available to help with repairs and

I believe they are actively fundrasing.

2) Government funding becomes available for a proper building to house the Hampden and others.

I’m told by those in BC that government funding decreases in proportion to the distance from Ottawa; reaching a negative equity in Western BC. Funnily enough, the same noise comes from WA here, regarding to distance to Canberra. 😉

Hopefully two things can happen.
1) even with the current economic situation, funds will become available to help with repairs and
2) Government funding becomes available for a proper building to house the Hampden and others.

Happy New Year to all…

Knowing a number of the folks from Langley and having just hosted them at the Canadian Aeronautical Preservation Asso conference that was held in our museum, I can assure you that within the means available to them they do a fantastic job of saving, preserving and restoring what they have.

As has been said Langley is not known for snow let alone the very unusual heavy snow they have been hit with this year.

Canada has had a very vicious winter coast to coast, I can personally attest to this as we have been trying to complete a mail flight recreation across the prairies and we have been fighting temps 20 to 30 degrees colder than normal and severe snow conditions.

To Gord and the team at Langley, if you read this before I call on Monday…

How can we help?

Tom Hinderks
Alberta Aviation Museum

Badger – people are interested in how much went to Canada simply because it’s fascinating to know what was still undiscovered in the U.K circa 1970’s and 80’s. I don’t see anyone calling anyone – clearly the Canadian’s achieved alot with some very corroded remains (and parts from other wrecks in Canada).