Cessna 152

Every aircraft has limitations but that doesn’t rule them out as a good trainer. Plenty of people have learned to fly in a Cub and it has all sorts of issues that a more complicated aircraft doesn’t have to deal with. You’ll never find an aircraft that doesn’t have issues that a pilot has to deal with, its a matter of finding an aircraft that has it’s positives and negatives in balance. The Cessna 152 is one of those aircraft in my opinion.

I’ve never seen a C152’s airspeed indicator indicate incorrectly in crosswind conditions, it can happen in a slip though. The pitot tube isn’t the issue as it has to do with the static port’s air supply being disturbed in the slip. Common practice for most situations is to fly in a crab until nearing touchdown then transitioning to the slip. By then you not looking inside anyway to see what the speed reads. Plus, these airspeed errors are common in any aircraft that doesn’t have a dual static port system.

Originally posted by Moggy C
You don’t like flying then WD? 😉

Moggy

Flying straight and level for 3 hours isn’t flying to me and that’s where George comes in handy. Now I agree that anything not at cruise or below 10,000′ should be hand flown. That’s when the real fun happens.

I have flown both types, not hundreds of hours you understand but none the less.

I love the view DOWN from a 152 and the simplicity of it, and importantly the cost per hour to rent one. They can be a bit cramped and two decent sized chaps and full fuel gets you to the weight limit, but to learn in, fine. There are a few Robin 200’s at the club I fly at and these are very popular, I have never flown one to know, but they have a stick as opposed to a yoke so in some terms they can appear to be more of a sports model (apart from the performance).
However, I do like the solid feel of a PA28, the view is a bit more restricted, but as stated a cracking view when turning and putting something of interest on the ground on the wingtip is just great.
Moggys point about the instructor is really important, as is the costs, cos once you start you can never fly enough!
The other thing I have found is that once you are in an aircraft, particularly when navigating (however you choose to do it) you forget what you are in and just enjoy it.
Basically just get going and enjoy the ride, there really is nothing that comes close to the experience, each time!

regards my last post,

I have experience flying both the C152 and the SA Bulldog.

I dont think its any good to anyone not being able to see right around your airframe as much as possible. This includes(the very important) upwards and to the side.

It is a failing in my own personal opinion that you have to bank in the opposite direction to the one you want to turn in just to make sure its actually clear in the direction you want to go, you have NO idea if your going to climb up into somebodys flight path, and you have NO idea if some is going to descend into your flight path,

why?

well you can’t see can you?

This is why this aircraft is dangerous.

The Pipers are only a little bit better you still cant bloody see upwards, although you can see to the upper side and rear/forwards.

In my cross country experience in low wing aircraft, such as the bulldog and the grob tutor, i have had more of a problem finding features directly in front of me than anything else, if they are quite close by.

I have no nav experience in high wing aircraft. Although it is obvious that the downwards view is superior to low wing types.

But of course your not enjoying that downwards view too much are you? (mind you there is bugger all else to look at, except metal.

Another note on the 152, The fuel gauges are notoriously wrong(or not working), and because of the positioning of the pitot tube, the ASI can be out by as much as FIFTY knots in a crosswind. What a bloody stupid design.

This isnt meant to offend anyone, more to critique the aircraft design

coanda

Throw in ….. a nice autopilot and it won’t get any better than that. 🙂

You don’t like flying then WD? 😉

Moggy

Originally posted by SteveYoung
I’m glad you’re so enthusiastic about it all, but please do take Moggy’s advice seriously. This is a man who owns his own vintage aircraft (a Piper Colt if I’m not mistaken?), and therefore knows exactly what the pitfalls of flying are.

But he also knows how wonderful flying is, and has frequently said so in words more eloquent than mine.

Thank you for those kind words Steve. Much appreciated.

Yes I bob around at the bottom of the aviation food chain with a shortwing Piper whose little wheel and wing are both in the wrong place for my tastes.

The main argument against a high-winger (in my opinion) is not being able to see the runway once you start the turn from downwind (We invariably fly curving circuits where possible). Local knowledge gets you by at the home strip, but elsewhere it can be a bit of a chore. Lifting the wing once in a while to take a quick peek does so ruin the symmetry of the curve :rolleyes:

If you’ve never flown a PA38 it is certainly worth doing so, just for comparison (It has a door each, too)

Moggy

The only version of the C172 that I know of that has a variable pitch prop is the C172RG Cutlass. It came with the slightly larger engine with 180 hp which showed a noticeable cruise performance increase with the prop. The climb and takeoff roll were no better in my opinion than your standard C172 if not worse depending on atmospheric conditions and loads.

The C172 is a much nicer version of the C152 in many regards. But, as a primary trainer I still feel the C152 is a better platform. The C172 is a bit too stable in my opinion for a primary student but is a great tool for the more advanced Instrument student. The addition of the approximate 50 hp is nice as it provides a better climb rate and faster cruise. Neither of those make a student a better pilot so as a trainer aren’t a factor.

As a personal aircraft I think the C172 is a lot nicer for the same reasons it’s not a better trainer. It’s more stable, climbs better and cruises faster. Throw in a nice avionics package and perhaps even a nice autopilot and it won’t get any better than that. 🙂

As for the high wing/low wing issue. A low wing provides as much a blind spot as a high wing, only on the opposite side of the aircraft. The high wing lends itself better to training in my opinion due to the high amount of ground reference work required. It’s just easier to work if you can see down. 😉

The 152 is definately an efficient plane, but I dont think it climbs very well because it has a fixed pitch prop optimized for high speed. Ive never flown a 172 but I know it has a variable pitch prop and a plenty powerful engine. Anyone care to compare the two?

ewenT- coanda mentions in the spin thread that hes done military type flight training for which the view in a highwing is not suitable for the extreme manuevers which they do. I think thats what he meant by his statement.

Coanda, you say:

the view out, in my opinion is one of the most dangerous going.

Will you expand on this statement please.

the view out, in my opinion is one of the most dangerous going.

coanda

Hey, just joined the forums and thought I’d throw in my 2 cents.

I’ve flown a couple of the more popular basic trainers out there and I really like the C152 the out of all of them. The high wing setup provides a bit more stability in gusty conditions which is nice. It also makes for a better training environment as you can see the ground easier when flying cross countries and other ground manuevers. Also on those hot sunny days the wing gives that extra bit of shade. Cessna’s are also unique (as compared to equivilant trainers) in that both windows open to give both pilots a nice breeze. There’s nothing worse than sitting in the left seat of a Piper sweating with only that little fist sized window to let air in. The Cessna’s also give each pilot their own door. It’s nice not to have to climb over another seat or pilot/passenger to get in and out.

It’s cockpit size is obviously smaller than some but I never thought of it that much once I was inside. Even through the high wing provides added stability it’s light weight does make it likely to get pushed around by winds. On a good windy day, proper crosswind technique is more important in a lighter aircraft than say a light twin. Now, of course the C152 isn’t any lighter than say an Arrow or Musketeer. I think it pays off to learn in a lighter aircraft as it requires a bit more effort to learn the basics. But when you move on to a larger aircraft, say a C172, the transition is easier than those that go from the larger/more stable to the smaller C152.

A bit deciding factor for most pilots is “what aircraft is the cheapest?” as learning to fly is an expense pasttime. Most likely the C152 will be the cheapest at the school you fly at. Nothing wrong with that. It’s a great plane to fly and the best trainer for the primary student.

I’m glad you’re so enthusiastic about it all, but please do take Moggy’s advice seriously. This is a man who owns his own vintage aircraft (a Piper Colt if I’m not mistaken?), and therefore knows exactly what the pitfalls of flying are.

But he also knows how wonderful flying is, and has frequently said so in words more eloquent than mine.

The bottom line is, to fly takes money. Focus on it completely if you’re serious about it, and you won’t go far wrong.

Oh, and the 152? I love it because it’s what I first solo’d in, but I much prefer a PA28, and am working towards a Chipmunk. Like EwenT said, you’ve got loads of time.

Where are you flying out of, by the way?

Hmmm so if i got a job as soon as possible i can get flying as soon as pobbible! Im putting my name down somwhere right away.

Originally posted by brenmcc1
Well actually i havnt started my PPL yet asim only 15 and i have to be 16 to get it 🙁

Can you give me an idea on how much it would cost?

Steve’s answer is OK as far as it goes.

But really it is a question of no importance. The cost to get your PPL is irrelevant. All the little brown licence does is entitle you to carry passengers and plan flights without asking the blessing of an instructor.

The actual PPL is not your licence to fly. You will be hands-on flying the aircraft from hour one, you will be flying it solo from around hour fifteen.

You don’t suddenly stop spending money once the somewhat disappointing brown wallet is in your sweaty little mitts.

The truth is the moment you take that first lesson you are committing yourself to abject penury and a lifetime spend running into horrifically large numbers of thousands of pounds.

But who cares?

Flying an aircraft is the best feeling in the world. If you don’t devote your earnings to flying you will merely fritter them away on food, drink, rent, mortgages, fancy cars or worse still, women.

Sorry if I sounded negative before but I personally don’t like the 152 / 172 aircraft. None of that makes them any the worse as an ab initio trainer. It’s just there are far nicer ones around. However for you the quality of your instructor is far, far more important than the model of aircraft.

Moggy

It really depends on how long you need to complete it, as everyone is different. But typically, you could be looking at anything between £5,000 to £9,000. Some flying clubs will give you a discount if you book ‘blocks’ of lessons up front (sometimes throwing in stuff like text books, a log book, club membership etc). Leicester, for example, do this for about £4,600 (all the above, plus 45 hours flying time). It depends what works best for you. Most people don’t have five grand to spend up front, so most opt for the pay-as-you-go option.

Well actually i havnt started my PPL yet asim only 15 and i have to be 16 to get it 🙁

Can you give me an idea on how much it would cost?

Cessna 152’s are great!

I too am working on my private pilot’s license (PPL), and I soloed last year in a Cessna 152 II, and I’m still flying it. I’m trying to get certified on the 172 right now as well.

I have nothing but the highest regard for the 152. I feel that it is a blast to fly, and I always enjoy myself thoroughly. Consider yourself lucky to be training on what I consider one of the classic airplanes of aviation.

Good luck with your training too!

Moggy

The wing is in the right place but the third wheel that is at the wrong end.:rolleyes:

Bren’

Don’t worry about the 152, just go and enjoy yourself 😀 , at 15/16 you have plenty of time to fly something more exotic, its us old codgers that are running out of time:(

Don’t worry about it. My first lesson/flights were in a 152 and I loved it. Doesn’t matter what you’re in for the first time! Just enjoy the flying…

Well its the only one i can fly as im just 15 unless i go a bit further afeield for a flight

Smalland cramped, wing in the wrong place, lacklustre, not as good a starting point as the PA38 Tomahawk, or nowdays the Robin 200.

But it will never turn around and bite you on the bum.

Moggy