D-Day Duxford press commotion

I don’t thing Ian was being discriminatory. I think he was pointing out facts about funding. If any of you have tried to get funding for anything (and Ian and I both have to get public funding for memorials as officialdom couldn’t give a toss) then you might feel bitter too. Itrs a sad reality that minority concerns get the majority of help. Thats the correct thing to an extent, but its gone way over the line now. Besideds, I suggest that you take the posting in the manner intended instead of getting all high and mighty. And consider the plight of those on a tiny allowance – disability benefit and pensions – and compare it to the 15 year old mum of two that I know with home, council tax and everything else paid for, plus enough spare cash to go down the pub 3 times a week. I can’t go that often, and I know a few of the veterans we are talking about here that are livid about council tax raises once again.

This is all off topic and quite pointless, so lets forget about it eh?

Surely people who have served in the forces before a certain date have passports,driving licences,i d cards of some sort & they could be given excemption to payment.
If it is too late for the paperwork side to be completed now before the Display could they not pay on the day,keep the reciept and then claim it back later on.
I don’t think it’s the sum of money thats an issue but the fact that it’s being charged,maybe they could get another free day later in the year with someone to help with any mobility problems.
Regarding the comments by en830 ,unfortunatly it is not P/C but it is a way alot of people in this country feel,it’s a boil waiting to burst and one day it will.
Just out of interest i wonder how many veterans would say that the sacrifices made were now worth while,have the reasons for fighting been justified in the way the world has turned out now,is this country and the world in general the one they thought they would be proud to live in after the war.Just a question for debate.

Whether you get in “free” or not to Dux (or any other airshow) is not generally the problem. Blokes of my generation and the next one up (the WWII blokes) are more than willing to pay entry if we go to shows as we appreciate the on-going cost of running/staging such events. No, the problem is in physically getting around to see things when we’re in there!

A large proportion of the blokes that were part of such events as D-Day, BoB, CW, etc, now have some difficulty walking the distances around the various displays, traders tents, statics, etc on airfields (someone out there is making airfields bigger I swear!) – think mobility. It’s easy for you young guys to trot around these things, bet you walk miles, but in many cases it’s not so easy for a vetern no matter how fit he/she looks or acts (or says they are).

So, my suggestion for what it’s worth is this – that these blokes get free transport around the whole site whilst on-site, (particularly at Dux, the Dux “train” comes to mind here). I’m sure that the availablity of “golf cart” type things (or similar “trains”) to a visiting vetern would be appreciated much more than giving them “free” entry. Oh, and restrict the use of such “transport” to veterns only please. 🙂

They let veterans in for free on the 50th anniversary so I believe so why not this time lets face it the numbers are getting less and less each year. I think it is penny pinching and at the best f$%king disgusting, it would be a lot better to let them in free and put the prices up for Duxford 2004 which is a c**p airshow anyway.

Splendid idea for the over 70’s to get into Duxford free of charge, however, I too suspect it wouldn’t be possible to administer in time for the D-Day Anniversary show (even if they agreed to it in principle). Perhaps they would seriously consider it for the next big event, such as the 60th Anniversary of VE day?

Regards,

Paul

The ‘free over-70s’ idea isn’t such a bad one.

Just how many of them would go on their own? Afew. Each of the rest would bring one or two full price ticket buyers with them. People who probably wouldn’t attend otherwise.

I can’t see how Dux would end up with a loss.

Moggy

It is, on the face of it, quite a generous gesture. But it is simply a small part of the debt we all owe.

Kev, as always, you’ve made sense of it. I don’t know how you do it, but I’m glad you do. Welcome back mate, I think we’ve missed your sense of fairness and perspective recently.

Mind you if they were gay, left handed, single mothers of an ethnic minority and not a British Passport holder they would be given a grant without question.

I’m sorry… This is the Key Publishing Historic Aviation forum isn’t it?

For a moment I thought this was the single minded forum.

These comments do not belong here or anywhere else. Aviation related disputes are great, the above, no. 😡

“if they were gay, left handed, single mothers of an ethnic minority and not a British Passport holder they would be given a grant without question”

As a left handed British resident minority Australian (yes, without a pommie passport), despite being happily married, I feel impelled by your crass racist (and illegal) remark to try and become a gay single mother.

May I suggest you retract your remark? I thought better of you. I would be delighted if you try to substantiate it., but such bile, or debate about such has no place here.

Sorry EN830. Not funny, not clever, a bit rich coming from a tax haven, and damages only your credibility.

Other points made in the debate, fair enough. One extra, is how would DX administer any single veteran group entry? Campaign Medals? Signed chitty from Eisenhower? Can you imagine the queues?

Andy’s over 70 or over 65 point is great. Andy, please put it to DX, with our support. (Though EN830 would like to except the Gurkhas and the Sikhs no doubt.)

Don’t do it again.

The VERY unamused

It is, on the face of it, quite a generous gesture. But it is simply a small part of the debt we all owe.

Forget, the Aces, the V.C.’s, men with more ribbon than chest space to display it. And think about what the debt actually is. From the greatest ace to the humblest erks we owe them. And what we do owe them is the opportunity to live the lives we lead today. We owe them our lives pure and simple. Now, if we have the gall to believe that our lives are not worth a donation of £8, what is it all about? Europe, North Africa, the Far East, all the seas and oceans, even our own fields hold our dead. The War Memorials that our drunken and callow youth choose to defile by using them as a toilet name those who made the supreme sacrifice. If we’re now struggling to Honour the dead, for God’s sake let’s do what we can for those who are still with us.

Andy in Beds is right. Free entry to the over 70’s, let’s all pay a bit of the debt while some of them can appreciate the gesture.

Regards,

kev35

Hi all
I’m certainly not going to get into a political argument about minorities.
However I believe it wouldn’t hurt to let all over seventies into Duxford free of charge–preferably all the year round. That way all contributors to WW2 would get in.
Before some bean counter starts to work out how much loss that’ll be at the gate–forget it.
These people should be given a much greater prominence in society in my humble.
Andy

The over seventy seems like a good ideal, Andy. If they made it 65 then they could say that anyone who lived during the war years could get in free. That seems to be a fair way of doing it, that said I still think the IWM should get some applause and not totally lambasted for this.

Over Seventy….

Hi all
I’m certainly not going to get into a political argument about minorities.
However I believe it wouldn’t hurt to let all over seventies into Duxford free of charge–preferably all the year round. That way all contributors to WW2 would get in.
Before some bean counter starts to work out how much loss that’ll be at the gate–forget it.
These people should be given a much greater prominence in society in my humble.
Andy

[RIGHT]C’mon guys! To allow D-Day vets in would be a great stance and a very nice gesture but how would the IWM do it, lets think this through. If the IWM do let all D-Day vets in then why should the IWM have an event for one campaign with free entry to veterans and then for other campaigns, not. How fair would it be to have veterans who made an equal contribution in other campaigns or men and women who served at home in important vital capacitys, to turn up and not be allowed free entry simply because they didn’t serve in this particular campaign. Either make all vets pay or let everyone who contributed in to the event free, thats including everyone from the women who made the buttons to go on the uniforms to the people in the factories at Yeadon, Woodford etc, assembling the lancs.

At least the IWM have done something to make this a special day for anyone who served. Lets contribute on this postive aspect and the factthat this show and the many others will contribute to keeping the memory,
of these brave people, alive and fresh in the minds of new generations.

Mind you if they were gay, left handed, single mothers of an ethnic minority and not a British Passport holder they would be given a grant without question.

This is perhaps the most narrow minded thing i’ve ever read on this forum, what a shame someone who makes such a usual valuable contribution would post such a bitter and unfounded post. Im tempted to write more about your comment but this isnt the place for it, I do want to submit my disapproval of those comments though. [/RIGHT]

“I believe in the UK the veterans have had to apply to the Lottery commission for a grant.”

Simpler. My friend Jim enquired and was offered £300 towards his costs to go. He phoned back to cancel due to a doc appointment and was told they wouldn’t be cancelling it yet as it was valid up until 2005 if he wanted. It wasn’t the same as applying for a village hall extension – nice and straightforward instead.

Tough one to call this, I saw both Look East and About Anglia news this evening and the reply from Tracey Woods of the IWM. On balance they ought to be let in free BUT because of the marquees and the Gold Pass to same, someone has to fund this and to my knowledge the Lottery Fund have not stepped forward.

Of course the IWM at Duxford leave the gates open on Rememberance Day which honours all veterans from many conflicts and donations go towards the very worthwhile funding of The Royal British Legion.

I will be at Duxford on June 4th, it was intended for June 6th. My thoughts will be for all those that went to Normandie and especially to those that did not return. I paid my respects to most of the dedicated sites from Cherbourg to Caen in 1998 a privilege I shall never forget, lest we forget……..

Andy, I too have a friend who went through Italy, unfortunately for him he knew nothing about the campaign as he was in an artillery battery and was very lucky to survive, he only has his service record and medals to remind him what he went through. I know there are many youngsters who read these forum pages, please make sure you pass on to your children and grandchildren the debt of gratitude we owe these people who for some, paid the ultimate sacrifice, thank you.

D-Day Dodgers….

Hi all
While big events were taking place in Normandy in 1944 another British army were being accused in Parliament of having an easy time in Italy.
The MP in question who brought this was up was Lady Nancy Astor.
With typical British wit the guys in Italy became known for evermore as the D-day dodgers.
They eventually had a little song to the same title.
The first line of which began I think.
“Down in old Salerno, down among the Yanks”
It went then went on to extol the virtues of places like Anzio, Cassino and Salerno and what fun it had been being ‘on holiday’ there.
Why do I raise this here?
Well on 6th June 1944 my own father was somewhere north of Casino–‘on holiday’ with the Yanks.
I know what his views would be on paying to get into Duxford.
Then again if they ever had ” an Italian Campaign Day” I doubt he’d go anyway.
As someone said on the other thread perhaps a sign of actually having been there is the silence about it.
I’ve had a number of conversations like this with him over the years.

Dad, why did you volunteer for The Suffolks on your eighteenth birthday?
Because working in a shoe factory was sh*t son.

Dad, who had the best army?
The Germans, I still can’t work out how we beat them.

There’s more but mostly very politically incorrect.
Dad’s still around, driving, helping my wife to decorate the bathroom, gardening and a voracious reader–he’s 81.
Thanks for reading
Andy

The Canadian Gov’t has offered to pay C$1,000 to any D-Day veteran who would like to travel to France to be at the ceremonies taking place.

I believe in the UK the veterans have had to apply to the Lottery commission for a grant. Mind you if they were gay, left handed, single mothers of an ethnic minority and not a British Passport holder they would be given a grant without question.

Well how tight can you get,
I don’t mind sending down £8.00 to get one of them in.

I see the main problem as being it is very discriminatory.

Over the years we’ve seen a few ‘aces’ paraded up and down in jeeps to be applauded and cheered. Cruickshank the Coastal Command VC was one I recall, and there were some 8th AF vets last year.

Did they all pay to get in?

I doubt it. They were honoured guests.

But because a lot of the poor bods (who I believe have been specifically invited) were lowly footsloggers and erks they have to pay?

Not happy.

Moggy

No matter what they put on surely it should be free to the people we are commemorating , do we pay our debt to them with a free marquee , a few sannies and a program ??? – surely we owe them much more than that , these heroes are few and fewer between every year – but the sad fact is that fewer will visit by being insulted to be asked to pay an admission fee .
We are in their debt – lets prove it by treating them in a befitting manner. 😡