This question was discussed on the forum years ago, but I can’t find that thread now.
The attached photo appeared in Flypast about 10 years ago, with the query ‘what is it?’
The general supposition was that it was a Besson MB.411 (The floatplane used on the Surcouf), but it has a number of features not found on any description of that type I can find, namely a different fin, curved wingtips and what appears to be a raised spine (and presumably enclosed cockpit).
There are reports that the MB.411 was flown in England in late 1940/early 1941 and was damaged in an air raid on Plymouth in 1941 (Either being removed from Surcouf following that, or before)
So does anyone have any more information? Was the MB411 modified as described or is the photo a clever fake (either Photoshopped or a model).
The Disney ‘Donald Duck’ artwork is interesting too.
[ATTACH=CONFIG]254065[/ATTACH]
By: DaveF68 - 15th June 2017 at 16:30
The wingtips on real photos of MB411s appear to be ‘square cut’ rather than rounded tip, with quite a thick section (giving an optical illusion of curved in some shots). The ‘RN’ shot appears to have curved wingtips which appear to have ‘grab handles’.
[ATTACH=CONFIG]254115[/ATTACH]
[ATTACH=CONFIG]254116[/ATTACH]
[ATTACH=CONFIG]254117[/ATTACH]
The apparent fairing on the upper fuselage (Like a DH4A one friend noted!) also seems strange.
By: Graham Boak - 15th June 2017 at 14:23
Are the wingtips modified or simply missing, as possibly removable for stowage on the submarine? The missing ventral fin is odd, but that could explain any change to the fin (if there is any such).
By: DaveF68 - 15th June 2017 at 11:35
Found this:
“Throughout the rest of the war, 765 Squadron were stationed at Sandbank………..
Thanks Martin, that’s interesting. Certainly a lead to pursue. The modifications to the rear fuselage and the wing tips still make me wonder if this is a fake photo, but at least we have confirmation that it operated in the UK
By: DaveF68 - 15th June 2017 at 11:30
Huh?
[ATTACH=CONFIG]254108[/ATTACH]
By: wieesso - 15th June 2017 at 08:18
Found this:
“Throughout the rest of the war, 765 Squadron were stationed at Sandbanks, flying a number of different planes. The Mitchell designed Walrus with a “pusher” engine mounted under the high wing, hanging over the cockpit, which made a particularly high pitched unpleasant noise, Fairey Swordfish, [known as “Stringbags”], Fairey Sea Fox, American built Vought-Sikorsky Kingfishers, and in 1943 the new Supermarine Sea Otter along with the French Marcel Besson MB-411.“
https://www.rmyc.club/rmyc/history/
“Perhaps the most intriguing story – concerns the Marcel Besson Seaplane MB-411: Petrel which had been attached to the Free French Submarine Battle Cruiser Surcouf, moved from Plymouth to Poole (issues of security), during Autumn 1941. It then sailed to be involved in the liberation on 24th. December 1941, of St Pierre et Miquelon – French isles off Canada. Petrel was left at RNAS Sandbanks for uncertain purposes – but was scrapped at RAF Mount Batten when spares ran out.”
[ATTACH=CONFIG]254107[/ATTACH]
“Marcel Besson MB-411 Seaplane, formerly of the French Sub. Battle Cruiser Surcouf, when placed with 765 Squadron at the Royal Naval Air Station Sandbanks, in the Winter of 1941, and renamed Petrel”
http://archive.pooleflyingboats.com/03%20Newcomers-at-Poole-with-RNAS-Sandbanks.pdf
Martin
By: Lynx815 - 13th June 2017 at 19:43
Old thread here:
http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/628458-Identify-this-plane-pls
By: longshot - 13th June 2017 at 19:01
It doesn’t look much like the photo of the MB411 in Wasley’s book on Mountbatten[ATTACH=CONFIG]254072[/ATTACH]
By: avion ancien - 13th June 2017 at 18:40
Might I suggest that you try posting the photograph here where the level of knowledge would, I suspect, offer you the best chance of getting reliable answers to your questions.
Sign In
June 13, 2017 at 3:11 pm