Do you think?????????????

I’ve been told to make provisions for my own pension (which will be taxed, when it’s time to receive it) while M.P.s are the only class of “workers” who make no contribution to their own pension.

Are you sure? Pensions aren’t really my thing but a brief ‘google’ would seem to suggest that 80% of MP pension costs are met by MP contributions and only 20% are funded by the Treasury. How does that compare to commerce and industry? MPs also pay National Insurance and Income Tax in the normal way.

Democracy is a wonderful thing but we can’t have everything we want even if we do all vote for it. No party can promise not to raise retirement-age; it is not affordable.

As for MPs salaries; how much do you think they cost each of us per month? Sixpence! 😉

I would also make their manifestos legally binding and those elected financially liable for them… So they could be sued for not acting on their promises…. it would get rid of all this we will do this this and this….. which is all hot air and simply made up to get them in power.

I would also make it possible for an MP to be sacked by their constituents then and there if they are seen to be not doing their job or listening to the wishes of their electorate… You could have an inline vote, similar to the one for getting questions debated in the house.

Megabucks Jim?

It’s a tidy sum, but I am not sure I count £65,738 pa as exactly in the pop-star / chavballer bracket.

Moggy

I think you’d find that a nurse would, but then most of them see their job as a vocation.

Edgar, beautifully put. I would fight tooth and nail to resist the idea of compelling people to attend and vote at a polling station. Police Stations, Prisons, Jails, and Courts etc, are the only places, that anyone should be compelled to attend, on the basis of having being accused of, or having been found guilty of, commiting a crime. Refusing to exersise your right to vote, is also a right in itself, and as such, the choice over using it, must be left to the individual. Compulsory voting/attending polling stations, has no place in a truly democratic society. Even MPs in Parliament, have the right to abstain in a vote, and attending the House at all, is only compulsory, due to it being an integral part of the career that they have freely decided to pursue. Compulsion is not the way to go here.

I do totally agree with your sentiments, however what is the answer?, we have the power of the vote which sadly seems to mean damned if you do, damned if you don’t.

We need a massive shift amongst the hierarchy in this country, all those with power and control are determined to retain it, the consequences and effects on the country and people are secondary in their eyes.

Can we bring changes by democratic means or will it need a revolt of some sort?

The problem is that MP’s do not represent the views of those in their constituencies. With exceedingly low turnouts the votes counted, whilst accurate, prove one thing. In many constituencies the winner is apathy.

It’s a pity to see the usual politicians’ “reasons” recycled, in this way. In my (admittedly narrow) experience, with working class employees, it has nothing to do with apathy, and everything to do with contempt, and total disgust at being treated with similar utter contempt by whichever party is in power at any one time.
I’ve seen the water industry sold off, with, for a short time, users being threatened with starvation of supplies, if they couldn’t pay their bills.
I’ve watched the “party of the working class” do away with the 10% income tax band, thereby ensuring that the low-paid and pensioners were hit proportionately hardest.
I’ve been told to make provisions for my own pension (which will be taxed, when it’s time to receive it) while M.P.s are the only class of “workers” who make no contribution to their own pension.
I now see the ruling classes, whose “work” entails nothing more strenuous than polishing chairs with their backsides, telling manual workers, who are on their feet during every 8-hour day, that they must now work for 55-60, rather than 50 years, and be grateful for the privilege of going to an early grave.
And now you expect me to waste my vote on these shiftless wastes of space? Dream on.

kev bad apples in every barrel including police. Every crime in the book including murder. Not on such a grand scale as the leeches in Westminster though.
How many dead and injured in Iraq and Afghanistan so far thanks to them?

The problem is that MP’s do not represent the views of those in their constituencies. With exceedingly low turnouts the votes counted, whilst accurate, prove one thing. In many constituencies the winner is apathy. Maybe 40 or 50% of the voting populace actually turn out for an election, yet 80 to 90% or even more complain about the Government which is subsequently elected. The only way to change this is to make attendance at a polling station compulsory. You don’t have to vote for any of the candidates, there should be an option ‘none of the above’. At least then everyone has to have a say, one way or the other.

As for MP’s not representing their constituents I offer a case in point. The Gurkha Pensions Issue. I wrote to my then MP (now retired) stating I was for the increase in pension to Gurkha Veterans and that I believed as my elected MP he should vote in favour. He wrote back to me agreeing with my point of view and stating that he would vote in favour of the increase. When you looked at the House of Commons website to see which MP’s voted for and against, he had voted against.

As for pay, I think perhaps MP’s should be paid more on the proviso that they work for their constituents for at least 35 hours per week and do not do any other work for which they receive any form of payment, be that money or favours.

As to my comment to Jim re perks for Policemen they used to be pretty good in this area. Within 500 yards of my home were over 50 properties owned by West Midland Police in which they housed Officers for the proverbial peppercorn rent. A former Officer I worked with left the Force, at their suggestion (and with a full pension) even though he was caught siphoning petrol from a Police car and had removed, and sold, a gas fire from the community room of the Station in which he worked.

Regards,

kev35

I’m not going to say that Labour are or were perfect, but they were doing a much better job of handling a bank created recession

ROTFL!

What ever you are having, I want some 😀

Moggy

Ah, yes! If we could only keep the Tories out of office for, say, thirteen years or so…

…then the electorate would see how good things could be and they’d never vote ‘Tory’ ever again! :rolleyes:

It’s a great pity that Tories did get back in again, I’m not going to say that Labour are or were perfect, but they were doing a much better job of handling a bank created recession than Camercon, Osborne and co.

Finances are tight, but there seems to plenty of money for Gove for instance to play his idealistic and very expensive games with schools.

Sadly our financial situation is ideal for Tories to attack their idealistic targets while hiding behind the need to economise.

Did you know that many of the public sector workers laid off as an economy are now being quietly re-employed because of staff shortages, I am definitely pleased to see people back in jobs, but which bird brained idiot of a minister pushed through all these job cuts, which were actually self defeating.

Clear evidence, last month political commentators were puzzled has to how unemployment figures had fallen, but productivity had also fallen, the question being asked were had the jobs come from?.

Megabucks Jim?

It’s a tidy sum, but I am not sure I count £65,738 pa as exactly in the pop-star / chavballer bracket.

Moggy

Possibly higher pay, but complete ban on extra-curricilar activities, or how about part of salary be payment by results?.

Even better how about looking after the interests of the country and it’s people first, rather than following their own undeclared agenda.

Megabucks Jim?

It’s a tidy sum, but I am not sure I count £65,738 pa as exactly in the pop-star / chavballer bracket.

Moggy

Perhaps the OP would care to answer the point that paying MPs nothing would mean that only the well-off would become MPs. Is that really what you want?

I didn’t say pay them nothing, I asked whether they were worth the mega bucks they earn, I had quite a bit in savings, until this lot got in, and I like many other retired folks, who have worked every day since they left school, never been out of work, saved, incidently as this Government and others said we should, have been erroding away,
I suggest you read what the O.P. stated, in the first place.What I should have put, was “What they don’t earn”.
Jim.
Lincoln .7

Indiaecho is right. How on earth could we encourage anyone to represent the people if we we reward them so little.

Those nominating them to a seat have the say over that.

To be nominated you have to put yourself forward. Why would you do that if you couldn’t afford to?

Perhaps the OP would care to answer the point that paying MPs nothing would mean that only the well-off would become MPs. Is that really what you want?

It is about time we moved on from this obsession with MPs pay and expenses.

MPs can no longer claim for second properties (or any accomodation in London if they are London MPs), cleaning, gardening or furniture. Likewise, MPs like the prime minister who have a grace and favour property can’t make any accomodation claims at all.

It is only right that, like any employee, they are able to claim for the expenses that they incur in doing their job. Again, it is right that they can claim for the costs of employing support staff and office accomodation, which all means that they end up claiming for a lot more than many of us who just put in an expenses claim for an ocassional train journey. Speaking of which, they can no longer claim for 1st class train travel.

I’m sorry, but this doesn’t seem to me to be particularly unreasonable.

Claims also have to be submitted to an independent body for authorisation and payment – they can’t do it themselves anymore.

And if you don’t like your MPs outside interests, the answer is simple – don’t for them.

If you want good people in Parliament, you are going to have to pay the sort of salary that will attract good people away from other professions, make sure that they are properly rewarded and recompensed. I’m not sure when you look at what a GP can earn, for example, the present system does this.

All this continual talk of paying them average wages or less is doing is providing further disincentive to the good people that we need in Parliament actually pursuing a political career, choosing instead to pursue better money elsewhere.

We complain about the standard of our public representatives and now you want to pay them next to nothing in return for giving up their careers, sometimes well paid careers in order to serve the public. How is that going to work?
Like all walks of life if you want better people, you have to pay more.

These ARE career MP’s these days… Simply nothing to do with giving up careers, if they wish to serve as an MP they should give up their careers.. You will then get people in the Job that are in the Job to do the Job, not just feather their own nests..
How can you have a MP voting on tax issues, employment issues, incentives to industry who have their own companies etc, you are then getting a conflict as they are not serving their constituents, but more their own pockets.. A lot of companies when they retire pick up MP’s as consultants / directors etc… This isn’t for their skills, but who and what they know…. Another case of lobbying MP’s with a possible position when you retire from the house… Again conflict.

Good idea. That way the only people who could afford to become MPs would be the idle rich. A bit like the 18th century then.

Those nominating them to a seat have the say over that.

Sadly too many believe Tory claims of free choice for everyone, when what Tories really mean is free choice for those who can pay and sod all for those who can’t.

Ah, yes! If we could only keep the Tories out of office for, say, thirteen years or so…

…then the electorate would see how good things could be and they’d never vote ‘Tory’ ever again! :rolleyes:

But, we don’t, do we? There’s a body of opinion that, maybe, we should return to the days when M.P.s were unpaid, since we could be sure that they were in the job from a desire to put something in, rather than a desire to get as much as possible out of it.

EB.
+1.
Jim.
Lincoln .7

Good idea. That way the only people who could afford to become MPs would be the idle rich. A bit like the 18th century then. :rolleyes:

What we should do is pay MPs enough so they could concentrate on being Mps and not have sidelines.

Like all walks of life if you want better people, you have to pay more.

But, we don’t, do we? There’s a body of opinion that, maybe, we should return to the days when M.P.s were unpaid, since we could be sure that they were in the job from a desire to put something in, rather than a desire to get as much as possible out of it.

You mean like the world leaders in the banking world? :rolleyes:

Far to many MPs particularly Tory MPs are under the control of their paymasters and don’t give a monkeys about public service, serving the country or meeting the needs of the electorate.

Sadly too many believe Tory claims of free choice for everyone, when what Tories really mean is free choice for those who can pay and sod all for those who can’t.

Note the current “workfare” type scheme that the scum are trying to sneak through while Parliament is on it’s jollies.

Come on, who the hell is going to employ and pay young people if you can get staff drafted in for free.