Dutch Air Force aircraft recoveries

Correct me if I’m wrong, but I’m sure that in the 1970’s Gerrie Zwannenberg was a leader in the recovery of many aircraft that appeared after great tracts of land had been drained and wreckage appeared in broad daylight.

I wish the MOD shared the same compassion and drive as the Dutch and US for example in sekking out MIA’s.

You are right

Gerrie Zwanenburg was a leader in the field but he was came at the right time as the polders were being drained and the newly found aircraft wrecks HAD to be recovered because they were a danger to the workers draining the land. Only wrecks were removed where they were obstructing work such as digging ditches etc. There are even now wrecks still lying in the polders such as a Stirling we have recently been made aware of by the landowner as he was snagging his machinery on wreckage. Strangely Mr Zwanenburg (who remained a civilian in the Dutch AF but was given a rank) doesn’t seem to like the recovery groups operating in the Netherlands, which is a strange thing as that was exactly the way he started out himself. The many recoveries during the sixties and seventies in the polders made excellent PR for the team while all they were doing is cleaning up a large area of former lake bed.
Things have changed in recent years and now there is a good cooperation between the offical AF recovery group and ours. In the recent past this has resulted in some very succesful recoveries as well as the official burial of 11 RAF crewmembers during 2003.
Cheers

Cees

http://www.arg1940-1945.nl/
….is a nice start to learn about aircraft recovery in the netherlands, but there are more. Cees is this your group?

Hi Bert,

Yes, you can see me in action there :p

Cees

Correct me if I’m wrong, but I’m sure that in the 1970’s Gerrie Zwannenberg was a leader in the recovery of many aircraft that appeared after great tracts of land had been drained and wreckage appeared in broad daylight.

I wish the MOD shared the same compassion and drive as the Dutch and US for example in sekking out MIA’s.

It would be nice (or should that be morally right) for the UK government to recover the remains of servicemen where they are know to exist.

Indeed. However, given that the British have sadly left their dead all over the globe from centuries of fighting, let along W.W.II, if it was started, it could be a very big job.

More pragmatically, as Cees has pointed out, it costs money, and it would set a precident; two big political no-nos.

Regards

http://www.arg1940-1945.nl/
….is a nice start to learn about aircraft recovery in the netherlands, but there are more. Cees is this your group?

It would be nice (or should that be morally right) for the UK government to recover the remains of servicemen where they are know to exist.

However the UK govt. policy is not to bother with such recoveries, it has always been that way and no-one (despite attempts to get a reversal) had reversed the policy. The only occasions I have heard of where the MoD has carried out a recovery is when human remains have been found and they have been forced into it kicking and screaming. The recent example being the Mosi in a march off Norfolk where tidal action uncovered the wreck.

Elliott,

The Dutch Air Force only investigate and recover aircraft crash sites if there is a formal request by the local authorities (usually the local Mayor). There is no active policy. The Genevea Convention etc. doesn’t work here. But in the past (our Foundation has been very active in this) wrecks containing human remains and/or bombs have been successfully recovered at the initiative from private organisations. The problem is that the local town, villages etc. shy away from these big operations because of the costs involved. About 85% will be paid back by the Dutch Gouvernment but a certain amount per head of the local inhabitants will have to be paid by the community itself although fundraising has been succesfull as well.

Hope this helps

Cheers

Cees

Cees,

the work of you and your countrymen is i hope much appreciated . I might be a little niave here …I wonder if there is any possability of obtaining funding from the Governments of the decd? surely they have a duty with regard to the recovery of remains?

Maybe some of our Dutch friends can help answer this question…

Can anyone tell me on what basis the Dutch Air Force excavate aircraft crash sites? Is it when ordnance or the remains of the crew are found accidently by civilians, or is there a policy in place to excavate and recover if they know human remains are present generally?

Just curious.

Cheers

Elliott,

The Dutch Air Force only investigate and recover aircraft crash sites if there is a formal request by the local authorities (usually the local Mayor). There is no active policy. The Genevea Convention etc. doesn’t work here. But in the past (our Foundation has been very active in this) wrecks containing human remains and/or bombs have been successfully recovered at the initiative from private organisations. The problem is that the local town, villages etc. shy away from these big operations because of the costs involved. About 85% will be paid back by the Dutch Gouvernment but a certain amount per head of the local inhabitants will have to be paid by the community itself although fundraising has been succesfull as well.

Hope this helps

Cheers

Cees

There’s a map with all the crash sites in the Netherlands, don’t know where I’ve seen it though…. maybe anyone could help?

They excavated a Short Stirling (what was left of it) last year not far from here.