Etrich Taube

The Owl’s Head Transportation Museum in Maine, USA, has a replica Taube that has been flying regularly for about 15 years. It is powered by a 200 hp Ranger engine converted to run “upright”:

http://www.ohtm.org/etrich.jpeg

http://www.ohtm.org/edu_col.html

More on the flying qualities of the Taube from aviation pioneer Hellmuth Hirth and noted test pilot Heiner Neumann(from an article in “Aerokurier” and Hirth’s Meine Flugerlebnisse).
Neumann’s quotes pertain to D-Etri,Ex-Fürstenwalde;and Hirth’s an original Etrich Taube in Wiener Neustadt.
Hirth,1912 original:
“Die Verwindung ist bei einer so stabilen Maschine wie es die Taube ist,nur für den Notfall da.Ich selbst habe die Verwindung nur gezogen,um zu sehen,ob sie wirke,und anfangs bei starken Windstössen,bis ich schliesslich merkte,dassich sie auch in den schärfsten Böen nicht brauchte.Die Verwindung wurde aber beibehalten,um dem Flieger mehr eine Art moralischen Halt,eine Reserve für den Notfall zu geben,in denen ein gschickter Führer sich auch mit dem Seitensteuer begnügt”

Translation:
“The wing warping mechanism is only here for emergencies on a plane as sturdy as the Taube is.
I only used the warping to see if it works and also for gusty conditions,until I noticed that I dind’t need it even in the gustiest conditions.
The warping was kept to give the aviator a moral help and a reserve for an emergency,in which a skilled aviator needs only the rudder”

Heiner Neumann:
“Kleine Ausschläge der Verwindung führten jedoch zu unübersichtlichen Reaktionen und Aufschaukeln um Längs und Hochachse.
Es war sofort klar,dass die Quersteuerung am besten nicht benutzt wurde”

Translation:
“Small movements of the warping led to unclear reactions and popoising over the longitudinal and lateral axis. It was immediately clear that the lateral control was best not used”
He also mentions strong adverse yaw,which can only be corrected by holding the warping control absolutely still.
Through the long span the aircraft wants to roll into a turn,but doesn’t have a pronounced spiral instability.
But he also says that a spin in the Taube would be uncorrectable.
I saw a video of D-Etri at ILA a few years ago,where the Taube got in the wake of the Albatros B.I(also from Fürstenwalde),quite interesting!

Hm. Was the original plane a pure flying wing, or did it already have a tail horizontal stabilizer and elevator?

The original Taube was not a flying wing,but its predecessors the Etrich-Wels Zanonia & Etrich 1 were when they started out.
The Etrich-Wels Zanonia was a pure flying wing and was later modified to add a canard and then a a fin with rudder.
The Etrich 1 started out with the Zanonia macrocarpia wing planform and a canard,the canard was removed later and a fin and stab added.
The Etrich 2 “Taube” is a different aircraft,but also sported a Zanonia based wing planform.
This aircraft has “survived” and is displayed at the technical museum in Vienna,Austria.
And yes,it has a fin as well as a rudder!!
Fin size didn’t change much on the original Etrich-Tauben,in my opinion it was more than just a hint when compared with other contemporary aircraft.
The rudder is also mentioned in Igo Etrich’s Patent for the wing of the Etrich Taube.(Kais.königl.Patentamt Patentschrift Nr.51064,handed in Sept. 11,1909)
Original Quote from line nr.48:
“Am Ende des Schwanzhöhensteuers ist das Seitensteuer 7 in bekannter Weise angebracht,an dessen lotrechter Drehachse sich unten ein Rad 30 befindet,das Berührungen des Steuers mit dem Erdboden verhindert”
Translation:
” At the end of the tail elevator control is the rudder 7 in conventional matter,at the perpendicular axis of rotation is wheel 30,which prevents contacts of the control surfaces with the ground”
The control of the rudder is via a pulley as shown on the picture of the replica I posted(same as on original).
I will try to get some 3views and pics scanned and post them here if you want.

cheers,
Dennis

Slip reaction

So… the Taube had no fin to start with.

If the original Taube was rolled to a bank for a flat turn, then without the fin to produce yawing torque, the plane would have tended to have sideslip… right?

Taube

Here are three views of an early Taube machine, from page 56 of “Als die Oldtimer flogen” by Gunter Schmitt. THe third view shows that there is only a hint of a tail fin.

I posted a pic of the tailfeathers above.
The precursor to the Etrich Taube,the Etrich-Wels Zanonia “Praterspatz” which led to the Taube started out as a flying wing but was later modified to sport some tailfeathers.

Hm. Was the original plane a pure flying wing, or did it already have a tail horizontal stabilizer and elevator?

Birds obviously have tailfeathers – but no fin nor rudder.

Here you have two photos original Taube whithout skin (Polish Aviation Museum Cracow). You can see how delicate “bird” it is.

Here’s the control cable layout for the 1911 Rumpler Taube,from the contemporary “Flugsport”.
http://www.ctie.monash.edu.au/hargrave/images/rumpler_taube_1911.jpg

But wasn´t it said that it had no rudder, nor fin?

I posted a pic of the tailfeathers above.
The precursor to the Etrich Taube,the Etrich-Wels Zanonia “Praterspatz” which led to the Taube started out as a flying wing but was later modified to sport some tailfeathers.

As far as wing warping goes,it was best left alone,Rudder was preferred.

But wasn´t it said that it had no rudder, nor fin?

The nose contours surely are a far cry from the original but easier than finding a 90hp Austro-Daimler.

As far as wing warping goes,it was best left alone,Rudder was preferred.
I talked to Heinz Linner who was involved in the build of the Taube at Fürstenwalde and he said the same thing Hellmuth Hirth mentioned(not to me of course :p ).
For anyone interested in the Taube’s flight qualities and malices Hirth wrote up an account in “Meine Flugerlebnisse”,well worth it if you can get a copy.
Here’s a pic of an Etrich-Lohner Type F replica(powered by a Walter minor instead of the 90hp Austro-Daimler)which was built sometime in the early eighties I believe and is now stored at the Aviatik Museum in Wiener Neustadt.
Still sports a drip pan but surely looks like it hasn’t flown in a while.

Containing ambitions I guess 😉

Hey, those guys were far from making anything even remotely resembling aerobatics. Sometimes they fell off their crafts in mid-air cause they had no harness …

Yes, but if the wing-warping was difficult then it would also have made it difficult to exit a turn. Did Taube have any problems getting out of circles?

Very interesting. Have any new replicas been built?

I understand why rudder is easy to dispense with – but the vertical stabilizer… What precisely prevents a Taube from overbanking and getting into a spiral dive if the warping of one wing were sustained for too long?

Containing ambitions I guess 😉

Hey, those guys were far from making anything even remotely resembling aerobatics. Sometimes they fell off their crafts in mid-air cause they had no harness …

A replica Taube was lost in a fatal crash in Berlin last August. As far as I know, the German CAA hasn’t released any findings as to the cause of the crash yet.

Regards,

Jan

Very flat, wide turns only. It had no vertical stabilizer or rudder. Using the elevator to compensate.

Actually it’s funny you ask about it right now. There is/was one flying in Germany. Built by “Historischer Flugzeugbau Fürstenwalde”, but was sold about a month ago to director Peter Jackson (“Lord of the Rings”), but the name of the buyer was not officially disclosed.

Very interesting. Have any new replicas been built?

I understand why rudder is easy to dispense with – but the vertical stabilizer… What precisely prevents a Taube from overbanking and getting into a spiral dive if the warping of one wing were sustained for too long?

Very flat, wide turns only. It had no vertical stabilizer or rudder. Using the elevator to compensate.

Actually it’s funny you ask about it right now. There is/was one flying in Germany. Built by “Historischer Flugzeugbau Fürstenwalde”, but was sold about a month ago to director Peter Jackson (“Lord of the Rings”), but the name of the buyer was not officially disclosed.