Fairly Flycatcher

Oracal:   Typo, Sorry ’bout that.  Note to self: do not type after having a beer.   Bulldog info unlisted?!?!?!  Arggggg!  Now I need a beer!!!

I see that NAL has three copies of Rigging notes.  Am I correct in assuming 16p means pages?   Now, how to get a copy.

Cheers

I saw it once at Duxford, and seem to recall that it made a rasp that made the Harvard sound possibly muted. Wonder how much of that was to do with the bigger engine?

Hi Bulldogbuild,

I still haven’t found the clip I mentioned earlier but my memory of it is that it wasn’t great quality anyway. However, there is better quality footage of the replica from one minute into this video – 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xAbbgZbRg_k

It may be from the same airshow but trimmed for neatness!

Bulldogbuild; I have now located a copy of the Flycatcher rigging notes at National Aerospace Library, Farnborough. There is also 2 copies at Shuttleworth.

They would appear to be AP1078.

AP1087 & AP1087A = Vickers Vimy. RAF Museum and TNA each have copies.

The Bulldog drawings turned during a visit to an archive. They, like the other Bristol drawings are unlisted. 

Oracal, thanks for the help. I can not wait to try your suggestions. About the Bulldog drawings: this is the first I have heard about all the drawings being available. Even  the in person visit to Hendon did not come anywhere close to that much information. Actually quite the opposite. Over the years I have been able to obtain drawings from Hendon, but it depended on who was in charge. Which leads me to the inaction of the Smithsonian. In the beginning (2000 ish) one gentleman gave me all the US Navy Bulldog info they had. We made an agreement to share anything I would find. Then he retired. Dead Stop. Today the best method of using NACA reports is through British channels.  I am quite versed in A.P. manuals (Brisfit , parts, Jupiter VI, VIIF, Bulldog II, IIA, parts, repair,) which leads to wonder why the Flycatcher has so little. And why I can find no references to AP 1087 when Matt Willis has it all over his book?!?!  Hopefully your suggestions will alleviate my frustrations. One thing that is starting to develop in my brain is that not all computers will reply to requests made by different persons or location. I have run across this in the past. I must be missing something?

Mothminor:  Thanks for the video!  I think that anyone going to an airshow should kneel. Through the entire show. Only camera people should be allowed to stand.  Better than nothing. Looking forward to additional clips.

There’s video footage on Youtube of the Flycatcher replica at a 1980s Yeovilton airshow. From 4 mins 6 secs in – 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=16id9Nw3-6k

I’m sure I’ve previously seen footage of it at a different airshow too but haven’t come across that yet.

Early Air Publications, certainly until the mid-1930s, were slim affairs. Some aircraft-related handbooks had fewer than 50 pages and touched on, Construction of the Machine and Handling of the Machine. It is common for there to be a second handbook of perhaps 30 pages entitled ‘Rigging Notes.’. Engines would be covered by a separate AP.   

As for the accusation that “Kew Gardens has no interest in aviation”,  I suspect the full functionality of The National Archives and its search facility is perhaps unclear to the OP of that comment. TNA is limited to what has been donated to them or included within the Access to Archives (A2A). They also maintain a useful ‘find an archive’ search function within the main TNA Discovery search engine. But they cannot be held to blame for the destruction of material by the predecessors of the CAA, or for the continued hoarding of documents by the likes of BAe.

I find the advanced search function better at flushing out obscure documents. In the case of the Fairey Flycatcher, an advanced search finds 24 documents of interest of which 21 are held with the TNA. [Try advanced search – ‘Flycatcher AND Aircraft’]. ‘Flycatcher AND Aeroplane’ retrieves a different items list. Try [Fairey OR Flycatcher OR Aircraft OR Airplane] – even more docs found.

I find TNA very useful. The A2A function throws up links to documents in other locations. Unlike other archives, it costs nothing to use a camera to copy documents there – heck, they even provide a facility to attach the camera to! Nothing like that at IWM, RAF museum, Shuttleworth, Bristol Aerospace, FAST or the National Aerospace Library – and almost all of those will charge you to use a camera. 

As for obscure documents. Did you know that ALL the Bristol Bulldog drawings still exist for all of the variants? They are in the form of crystal-clear aperture cards and are stored with most of the other early Bristol aircraft. I particularly like those of the Bristol Brownie. Unfortunately, because of copyright issues, although they can be viewed and notes made, they cannot be copied.

FYI, I find one AP of particular use when trying to find other APs; Air Publication 113 – List of Forms and Publications. I only have copies of the 1921 and 1969 (12th edition), but they are invaluable. Also, I am fortunate to know from my RAF service my way around the ‘6-volume’. AP 2462A (1st edition 1943) is THE guide to the 3-volume system. That information helps when searching for what is of use, or not of use.

Another ‘first place to go look’ is the American-produced Bibliography of Aeronautics by the Institute of the Aeronautical Sciences. There are some handy links to information to be found there.

The NTSR-NASA Technical Server can be helpful in locating obscure NACA publications, which are then downloadable for free. Try the [archive.org] too; lots of little gems there for those who look. Many other sources are available online, but half the fun is finding them.

There are some classic finds to had at TNA, not least design and stressing papers for many inter-war years aircraft – both military and civil.

If you think TNA is ‘useless’, I have been making requests to the FAA (6 years) and the Smithsonian (5 years) for copies of documents they hold; they say they will get back to me, but never do.

How many are following and engaging with The Aviation and Aerospace Archives Initiative? www.aviationarchives.uk

Forget Kew Gardens. They have absolutely nothing to do with, or interest in, aeroplanes.

I wouldn’t mind betting a Flycatcher is some sort of carnivorous plant.

I agree, Google has got steadily more useless as time has gone.

Unfortunately, the alternatives are generally even worse.

Gentlemen,

Thanks for the help.  My computer always knows more of what I want than do I. Continues problems with spell check. Did a lot of hunting on National Archives Kew, kept telling me there is nothing there under Flycatcher (or any combination one can think of). Finally found it under A.P. 1304, vol 1 & 2.  Waiting for a response of how many pages it is and what the cost is.

I  agree that my research skills suck. Can you tell me where to go to find said information.  Yahoo is beyond sucky, google is only so so sucky. Who and or what next?  Believe me I want to learn.  Kew Gardens telling me they have the book does not help. They want me to pay $12 just to find out what it will cost. Say WHAT???

Research is very frustrating.  It doesn’t help that there is an actual bird called Flycatcher.  Another missing element: no video of the Replica flying. Rats!!! So at the moment I am stuck with the Willis book (nice job Matthew!!) and Aeroplane Monthly articles (thank you A.M.)  Thus the quest for help. (p.s. I started with A.P. 1078, took days before 1304 showed up)

Cheers

A bit of poking around suggests that Rod Bellamy is now located at Bodmin, Cornwall.
 

”Rod Bellamy

Chief Engineer Cornwall Aviation Services Ltd. at Chief Engineer for Aviation Maintenance Bournemouth.

Greater Plymouth Area”

Beware of confusion with a Cornwall Aviation outfit in Canada. 

This link seems to have contact details. Maintenance – Bodmin Airfield

I assumed Fairly was a typo but as you’ve now put that twice I’m not sure.

I hope you are searching for Fairey?

Clearly you need to work on your research skills. The Internet does have directions to finding the manual. AP 1304 plus Appendices A is what you are looking for. 
 

I could get you a copy but you won’t like my price. 

Thank you for the compliment. So, as far as the Flycatcher……many problems. 1) having problems finding an Air Publication manual. Not even a CD version. Emailed Hendon, but still no answer.  2) In one article a mention of about 25% of drawings available, but…..who has them and how would I get in touch with the Bellamy family or better yet the Fairly family.  Again the web is worthless.  The most critical problem with this project is the engine. The Replica suffers from the extended engine mount. My feeling is that it ruins the entire project. (DO NOT become alarmed at the fantastic effort put into the Replica, but we are talking at a nerd level.) Still doing research. It is a very interesting aeroplane based on it’s wing. So ugly that it is beautiful!  (pug nose and all, Winnie would be proud of it’s heritage) And so far ahead of it’s time. Like I mentioned….still doing research. (like the Bulldog doesn’t eat up all my time and money)

Ed (a nerd)

Hi Ed,

Great to see your interest turning to the Flycatcher, after completion of your incredible Bulldog reproduction. How can we persuade you to bring in on a UK tour?

You may know all this , but the replica Flycatcher at Yeovilton G-BEYB has a background a follows-

”05/31/2007. The construction of this replica was started by Robinson Aircraft at Blackbushe Airport, Camberley, Hampshire, England, in January 1977. Later it was transferred to Rod Bellamy, whereas the CAA Aircraft Register states Westward Airways, Lands End, England as the manufacturer. On July 17, 1977 it was registered as G-BEYB, and powered by a Pratt & WhitneyR-985-AN-14B engine, the first flight was made from Middle Wallop, Hampshire, on July 23, 1979.

Donated to the Royal Navy Aviation Collection the replica made its last flight to RNAS Yeovilton, Somerset, England, on June 5, 1996, and has since been on display at the Fleet Air Arm Museum.”
Fairey Flycatcher (1000aircraftphotos.nl)

The late John Fairey commisioned the rebuild, and his family may still have plans,  or perhaps the Bellamy family in Cornwall. Hopefully someone has more precise leads than these suggestions.