Over the last few years, as more people have got into the Nostalgia boom, more and more items have been faked or made to appear to be more seductive to collectors than they should.
These include:
Combat reports
Signed paperwork
Log books
German badges/crosses on tails etc. One of the top guys in this field (sadly no longer with us) used to create lovely badges and they looked good, invariably they were hawked at jumbles at a too-good-to-be-true price. I bought one!! I noticed paint in tears (the cut edge) and someone suggested that that faker had a penchant for signing the back! Sure enuff, there was a number scratched in to the work that took the whole of the piece: If you had checked the number against the pages of his local phone book you would have found that it was the page that his name was on!!
I have seen fake Supermarine Rudder pedals.
At the first ever Yeovilton Aerojumble, a fake spade grip turned up and was crude and obvious. Two years later, the faker had taken to weathering them in salt baths and stamping them with part numbers – but left the stock poorly machined. It is still fairly easily to spot a fake spade grip.
There are many cases of Harvard grips being passed off as Spitfire….one harvard grip that had corroded half away was being sold at an Aerojumble as a Battle of Britain grip off Eric Bann’s Hurricane – an impossibility!!
German WW2 grips can be a little more difficult to spot. Most times, people have taken post war Mig15 and 17 grips, which were similar, and modified them back to WW2 state.
There are a few important things that could help you spot a ‘pup’:
a. The trigger has a coarse ‘mesh’ and poor finish on a USSR grip (German ones are well made and fine mesh)
b. The USSR grips have a pinky red undercoat whereas early WW2 grips are black anodise and late German grips have no undercoat being simply satin black.
c. USSR grips have a brass terminal block cover, German WW2 KG12 & 13’s have a aluminum cover.
d. USSR grips have a slot for the brake lever, and pivot holes.
e. The casting of USSR grips are low quality – but so are late German WW2 KG13’s!
f. USSR grips can be softer covering and also coarser. WW2 are like bakelite
g. The plate on a USSR grip is very small. On a WW2 grip it is larger and held on by 2 rivets (early) and 4 rivets (later). However, most fakers will either put no plate (like late KG13s fitted to He162 and late model 109s).
h. WW2 grips have BA stamps in hexagon, a 3 letter factory censor stamp (normally ngk) and later grips (WW2) have a big G2 casting stamp.
Like most things there are the odd ones that get thru! The shiny silver column below is an early Mig15 column that actually uses a late WW2 German grip! In the grip collector world, there were rumours of surplus WW2 grips getting onto Migs and this underlines that.
The shabby grip is a late KG13 from the Heinkel factory that was fitted to a He162. The photos below are real WW2 German grips except the complete Mig 15 control pedestal and the shiny grip (which is a WW2 modified to be a Mig15).
If there is interest, I will add photos of the difference in triggers and also some shots of an early WW2 KG12.
At the end of the day, if something does not feel right – walk away!!
Feel free to add to this thread. Any chance of us saving someone buying something that is wrong should be pursued IMHO!
By: Rocketeer - 9th October 2011 at 18:28
Bump
By: adrian_gray - 2nd August 2011 at 23:16
Say what you want to see and someone may have one….
Howsabout the spade grip from V7497?
Adrian
By: Rocketeer - 2nd August 2011 at 23:06
As promised – here is the fine pattern trigger that is fitted to German WW2 grips. This is an early KG12
By: Rocketeer - 2nd August 2011 at 16:50
Happen all the time Ian!!!
BTW sending you an email!!
By: ian_ - 2nd August 2011 at 16:30
Thanks for the pics, Ozjag. The Mig 29 one is particularly impressive, making up for lack of grip with an excellent provenance. No idea on yours, Tony, but I like the ‘bulldozing accumulated stuff off the desk for a clear photo’ technique. Have applied it many times myself.
By: Rocketeer - 2nd August 2011 at 10:15
Wold love to know which former USSR bloc aircraft this is off?!
By: Rocketeer - 2nd August 2011 at 09:35
nice stuff!
By: ozjag - 2nd August 2011 at 04:18
Well I have to say it is actually quite hard to take a photo of a stick / grip but here are a couple that hopefully people find interesting.
The first is a complete Mig 21 stick and grip in very good condition.
The second is a Mig 29 stick from a Serbian aircraft that was shot down by a USAF F-15 during the Bosnian conflict, unfortunately the grip portion was smashed off during the crash but I really like it especially as both pilots involved have written quite detailed accounts of the event.
Paul
By: ian_ - 1st August 2011 at 23:45
I’d love to see a FW187 grip, any Luftwaffe yokes or the double handed F106 grip! Or a P61 yoke. The Metalcraft guy in the states casts straight off originals, so if the grip covering is complete, the replica will be perfect. Whilst they are nice, some seem more expensive than originals. This Viking grip was perfectly well advertised and cost half what a plastic copy would cost. He does need to cheat with some of the thinner bits and of course no buttons or triggers click. There in lies the real satisfaction of ownership!
By: Rocketeer - 1st August 2011 at 21:50
Say what you want to see and someone may have one….
By: pagen01 - 1st August 2011 at 20:34
The replicas actually look pretty good (including the F-16 one Ian), and if you accept them as that they are great for the mantle piece, in fact if I still had a Harrier cockpit I would proabably consider fitting it with a replica stick grip rather than the real thing, due to price, availability, and some one half inching the original one.
I would like to see the early British jet replica stick tops up close as recreating the grip material is something that seems very hard to do when restoring an original.
I still would only really want an original one as a stuffed and mounted collectors piece though, the whole point in having any of this stuff for me is the history behind the items.
As Ian has said it would be great to see pictures of different stick tops here, could be a very usefull reference guide.:)
By: FarlamAirframes - 1st August 2011 at 20:24
I have to be careful with what we do – given the history of previous passing off of painted original metal.
I was asked to make a tail fin Swastika last year. It was to be painted if possible on a piece of Luftwaffe metal.
I took care to make it similar but not correct enough that it would fool any expert.
On the reason why – I am reminded of Clarkson saying why have a Porsche Boxster when you can save up for a 911. He obviously forgets how hard it is to earn the extra 30k.
For some a replica is all they can afford – especially with high value items such as spade grips and swastika tails.
By: ian_ - 1st August 2011 at 20:08
That’s a good link, Pagen. His instrument panels are quite nice to, not something you can cast from an original though, unless your F15 has been accidentally washed on the hot setting. I’d be interested in a nice spade grip kit, possibly like this F16 one: http://www.aircraftresourcecenter.com/rh/articles.php?id=5030
Would love to see pics of your sticks, Ozjag, especially the Mig 23. Is this sufficient provocation for more of yours, Tony?
By: Rocketeer - 1st August 2011 at 07:30
It is interesting the link. I prefer real grips too! Even if in horrible condition (like my swift s!!)
By: FLY.BUY - 31st July 2011 at 11:07
Nice creative ideas but personally for me it has to be original. Knowing it has flown at some stage of it’s history it’s what it’s all about. However I wish the business well.
By: Arabella-Cox - 31st July 2011 at 11:03
Interesting link James. I’m liking their Harrier stick top 
.
By: pagen01 - 31st July 2011 at 10:23
I was amazed when someone mentioned replica javelin grips – they are quite cheap and certainly not rare!
Hi Tony, I should stress the ones that I saw where resin replicas (from Aus I believe), they weren’t being passed off as the real things.
Trying to find them again now, but failing!
Edit, found em along with some others, http://www.metalcraftbyblair.com/index.php?main_page=products_new&disp_order=3&page=212
I can see the attraction for some people buying resin replicas, especially as originals can be hard to find / purchase, and restore. Not my cup of tea as I like to think that what I have has some history behind it.
By: Malcolm McKay - 31st July 2011 at 05:33
Personally, not as a collector of aircraft parts, but of antique firearms I applaud any effort to expose fakes being passed off as real. If they are labelled as replicas then I don’t have a problem.
By: ozjag - 31st July 2011 at 01:14
I can post pics of my grips but nothing really rare, Jag, Su22, Mig 21 and Phantom, the first 2 are in cockpits and the last 2 are complete columns that have been removed properly. I can’t offer any advice on spotting fakes though, would also be interested in collecting a few more but not for the prices I regularly see on that online auction site.
Paul
By: Rocketeer - 31st July 2011 at 00:49
I’ll have a go Paul!! But it needs other posts. I can post pix of real grips.
I was amazed when someone mentioned replica javelin grips – they are quite cheap and certainly not rare!
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July 28, 2011 at 8:43 pm