Fly Her or Scrap Her

If she cant fly at least keep her live and ground running and safe,no more silly scrap man talk:(

I maybe wrong about this, but XH558 was purchased by the Walton family from the MOD because the Waltons owned Bruntingthorpe airfield and had made it clear that they would the be prepared to maintain the aircraft in a ground running condition and they offered the best long term solution for the preservation of the RAF last Vulcan. I do not remember any statement or long term plans to fly the Vulcan, that stupid idea came about much later. The Vulcan Operating Company (TVOC) was set up to raise funds and gain the necessary permission to restore her to airworthyness and it was TVOC that approached the Lottery for funding to do this job. It is the TVOC’s fault that they started on the project before sercuring the necessary funding. All efforts must know be focused on returning XH558 to the condition before TVOC appeared, ie ground running condition.

DOUGHNUT

Maybe I’m being a bit naive here, but when 558 was purchased from the MoD and the whole return to flight project started the National Lottery and HLF didn’t exist.

Surely these people must have had plans to finish the job which didn’t include any HLF handouts?

So how come the entire project and even the continued existence of the airframe now 100% relies on it and we have this disgraceful emotional blackmail of “HLF or scrapman”? :confused:

money donations

Guys,

How I read the latest pledge of money is just like this.

They need £500000 to be recorded in their records to act as sufficient funds of their own to put up against the HLF.

They dont actually need this money until ,Or if, the HLF say yes.

So that means if you pledge money now you only need to give it to them IF the HLF say yes.

So it the HLF say no then your money is safe and you wont need to give a penny.

How I remember the website starting out was that the Vulcan WOULD fly no matter what.

Seems like they have let a lot of people down with false hope and promises.

I myself had a project to get done which was a memorial for a local aircrew. But I only said to the papers I hoped to get it done for 2003 the 60th anniversary.

That has now passed but I didnt promise anything and in actual fact I am now no nearer to getting the project finished than at the start. But I now know there is still a lot more research needing done to complete the story and a lot of fund raising before I even start. But by the completion of the research I hope the memorial will be bigger an better than before.

My point is they made promises where as I did not I mearly expressed my hopes of finishing at the 60th anniversary.

Kev,

“I’d agree with you there, but the money is an issue. Most of us only have a limited amount of money which we can afford to donate to charities and projects which are dear to us.”

That’s a very fair point, and I wouldn’t want to speak for anyone else on this issue. My view was purely an individual one.

“If this all does end in failure and 558’s final photo call shows her succumbing to the axeman just what kind of image is that going to present to the world? It will be extremely damaging to the preservation movement as a whole. An example, will the casual visitor to Newark, Cosford, East Fortune etc,. be as willing to donate to any project after seeing what has happened to the Vulcan?”

You’ve summed it up in your middle sentence. Most of us on here have the best interests of historic aviation at heart; as such we’ve made a conscious effort to look further into the subject than Joe Public would do. Joe Public will only see what’s reported in the ‘popular’ press, ie, that a rare taxiable aeroplane will have been scrapped because a project to take it to airworthiness can’t be funded. If they even look that far.

Either way, I agree with you, anything less than an HLF cave in on the funding issue will look bad in the public eye. But somehow I can’t see HLF obliging. 🙁

Steve

Steve.

“….As for the money donated, no, I don’t want it back. I didn’t expect ever to see it again, but I hoped it would do some good. Unfortunately, the way that the project appears to have been (mis)managed, I won’t be donating any more. I’d much rather throw a tenner at the Blenheim. At least they know know what they’re doing.”

I’d agree with you there, but the money is an issue. Most of us only have a limited amount of money which we can afford to donate to charities and projects which are dear to us. If this all does end in failure and 558’s final photo call shows her succumbing to the axeman just what kind of image is that going to present to the world? It will be extremely damaging to the preservation movement as a whole. An example, will the casual visitor to Newark, Cosford, East Fortune etc,. be as willing to donate to any project after seeing what has happened to the Vulcan?

People were given hope that a Vulcan would fly again, but it’s just not going to happen. For whatever reason.

It’s very sad that the efforts of so many people to return a ‘Vulcan to the sky’ seem likely to end in sending the Vulcan to the scrapman.

Regards,

kev35

It seems to me that it’s either a) a major case of brinkmanship, or b) indicative of incredible mis-management. Either of which would indicate to me that TVOC are not capable of operating an airworthy Vulcan in a safe and responsible manner.

Put it this way: if your child said to you, Give me pocket money to buy my hamster a bigger wheel or I’ll flush it down the bog, would you think them a responsible pet owner?

As for the money donated, no, I don’t want it back. I didn’t expect ever to see it again, but I hoped it would do some good. Unfortunately, the way that the project appears to have been (mis)managed, I won’t be donating any more. I’d much rather throw a tenner at the Blenheim. At least they know know what they’re doing.

(edited to correct crap spelling and adjust my hamster argument slightly 😀 )

if they scrap her

they would im sure be as gutted as we are mostly i c it as money wasted if they do that

Sounds like a big case of sour grapes,if it can’t fly then i’ll scrap it,na na na na.
A kiddie at school would say it’s my ball and i’m not playing.
Sorry it’s how it seems to me 🙁

Originally posted by kev35
WAHAAAAYYYY!!!! Lancman and I finally agree on something. If she is scrapped, and I sincerely hope she isn’t, would all those people who donated money to make her airworthy be entitled to their money back?

Regards,

kev35

Hi Kev,
What about all those people that have pledged money for the lastest HLF application.

This money has obviously been pledged by supporters of ‘558 and should/could they be expected to honour the pledge made, to fund a rebuild to taxiable condition?

LOL!

😀

Originally posted by Lancman
I entirely agree with Peter and Kev, …….What the hell kind of a ‘preservation’ is that?!!!!

WAHAAAAYYYY!!!! Lancman and I finally agree on something. If she is scrapped, and I sincerely hope she isn’t, would all those people who donated money to make her airworthy be entitled to their money back?

Regards,

kev35

I entirely agree with Peter and Kev, this situation is APPALLING; how are we supposed to support them when they state that if it flies they’ll support it, otherwise, it’s tin can time? What the hell kind of a ‘preservation’ is that?!!!! Whoever is making these decisions should be locked up and banned from ever being involved in ‘preservation’ again! 😡

If I’ve read it rightly it says if the HLF bid is refused she will be scrapped? What about all the time, money and effort expended on what it appears has been nothing more than a pipe dream?

So, If the bid fails she goes to the scrapman. Anyone else find it ironic that now she is nothing more than a bag of bits they have done half the scrapmans job for them?

I might be wrong on this so please correct me if I am. I was under the impression that the owners once made a statement to the effect that if they were unable to fly her the dismantling would be part of a process to ensure her future as a static? Does anyone else remember that or am I getting confused?

Regards,

kev35

this is just down right asinine

She was a fully flyable aircraft when she arrived and now liess in bits like a cast off childs toy. I fully blame tvoc for not arranging funds ahead of time before commencing the dismantling of the aircraft. She should not go for scrap if the lottery fund doesnt come through. tvoc should be responsible for reassembling her into a complete aircraft once again….!

The problem with anything that harks back to the Cold War is that
it is something that most people want to forget. There were no real heroes -those that were died probing the ‘enemy’s’ airspace
in unpublicised ‘shoot down’ incidents.
Certainly it was very real but with hindsight ‘Survive To Fight’ was utter rubbish – who in reality would want to fight in the post nuclear strike environment in the knowledge that the only survivors would be the Royal family and the various tiers of Government.
The events of September 11th effectively brought us into a new era of paranoia – the very real enemy is international
terrorism – the vista of the Vulcan is now as sharp as a knob of butter.
The new ‘Vulcan’ is the Predator taking out a terrorist
pick- up with Hellfire – how long before our children play Gulf
War 3 on the PS2 and dream of being a real UAV operator on a remote airstrip guiding cross hairs on a monitor ?
The sad reality is that future warfare will rely more on details which can be plotted on a keyboard than the human
sight of a cross or roundel determining friend or foe.

Well it goes without saying that I hope to see her fly,but failing that it would be great to see her returned to taxiing status.To consider each of the above possibilities:

“1. Continue the dismantling process and move her by road to a museum who could house her – admittedly extremely limited options.”

What I’m wondering is whether there is a museum which could house her at all which doesn’t already have a Vulcan.The only place I can think of is the Science Museum (Wroughton). I’m also not sure that the costs and difficulties of dismantling and transport wouldn’t be greater than putting her back together!

“2. Start a fund raising exercise to reassemble her – hopefully employing volunteer manpower.”

This sounds like the most promising option to me,although whether it will be possible only time will tell.Hopefully it won’t have to be considered,but perhaps I’m being just a little too hopeful.:rolleyes:

There is a definate air of dispair on the front page of the website now. I fear the worst.
http://www.tvoc.co.uk/index2.htm