Goodwin Sands Dornier progress thread

If the money donated was for the Dornier then fine, and no matter how they went about it, at least they got the thing up at all (because I for one really thought that they wouldn’t) and now have it to preserve as best as possible. But I do think that it’s a crying shame that the RAF Museum pursued that particular project when they have things such as chunks of Stirling just languishing in the stores…

Haven’t you guys got enough on your plates with the Bluebird & the Baddacooda, without soliciting for more projects to work on LOL :dev2:.

Though I must confess that it would be fantastic if the RAF museum approached you guys to see if you fancy tickling the Stirling wreckage a bit :D.

Bob T.

Wikipedia seems to think it is WkNr.1160: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Do17#Dornier_Do_17Z_Werknummer_1160

Sorry if I,ve missed it, but has there been any progress on the id, yet?

Is anyone else having problems with the reply function on the forum?

No. Just with some of the replies themselves, but that is a different matter altogether.

I believe it was stated at the time that various missing sections were still under water and were going to be picked up next before the vessel returned to port. Did this additional recovery ever happen?

Seeing the Plan A rig gave me great comfort in the fact that this was being given serious thought, maximising the recovery intact, unbent and complete of a delicate aircraft. This aircraft is very important and couldnt be left to rot anymore, such a shame though that its taken all these years to discover it, but one cannot control luck. Seeing no other plan also imparted belief in the fact that this method was feasible and I trusted fully the team involved without knowing anything about their past successes.

What do we know of the past experience of the design team and the diver team ?

Should on the day the Plan prove problematic or simply not practical (has such a plan worked before ?) they should have had something else well thought out as a backup. Even a Plan C.

I do wonder about media pressure etc but it had to come up then with all the people and equipment committed and not later on after another plan had been devised, that was why other plans ready and waiting in the wings that could be carried out without much delay were so important. The loose beam and use of propellers indicates anything but. The mistakes in not having such Plan B and even C lie well before the day. The damage was done months ago.

I still havent gathered, and have asked, does anyone know where the outer wings /wingtips are. They were there, on the radar, and I havent see a single photo of them since.

DBenz

Trumper;

I agree wholeheartedly! I’m surprised to read, here in particular, the sentiments regarding the Dornier recovery. An extinct type is no longer extinct. That has to be a good thing surely?

Regards;
Steve

But hopefully as they are in stores they will be looked after and safe for the future.The Dornier was anything but.

If the money donated was for the Dornier then fine, and no matter how they went about it, at least they got the thing up at all (because I for one really thought that they wouldn’t) and now have it to preserve as best as possible. But I do think that it’s a crying shame that the RAF Museum pursued that particular project when they have things such as chunks of Stirling just languishing in the stores…

There is no evidence to suggest that the Dornier donors were offered a range of options as to where their money could be spent. The project to recover the Dornier received widespread publicity and to any potential sponsor that is one of the things they are aiming for . There is also tax implications for charitable donations.

Was anything recovered of the identity of the aircraft or it’s crew?
Any personal effects.
Would be good to understand the story behind it.

I would of sooner liked to see that sort of money spent on the halifax or hampden rather than dragging that wreck up off the floor…

Which Halifax or Hampden?
If they are both already in a dry safe area then that can be done anytime in the future but the Dornier needed to lifted whilst the impetus was there and the will to do it was there.
Is anyone else having problems with the reply function on the forum?

Thank’s for that Ross.. 🙂

In my opinion the sponsors were the ones that donated the bulk of the funds and I for one will bow to where they wished to see their funds spent.

As a large donation they had the option to dictate where the funds were spent. They chose the Do.17 and not any of the other projects, and did so for their own reasons.

Ross

I would of sooner liked to see that sort of money spent on the halifax or hampden rather than dragging that wreck up off the floor…

I would have been happier to see that funding spent on the halifax..

i think everyone has 20/20 hindsight ? surely the important fact is that there is now a Dornier in this world whilst not so long ago there wasnt ? a few (or a lot) of bits of bent, torn, mashed and mangled tin shouldnt be a problem just look at the wonders Bluebird Bill and his team have done with K7 and the Baddacooda and you will see that whats been done can be undone.

People refer to 600K as being the figure -you can happily add another 200K to that figure by the time the Dornier broke surface. The problem with recoveries like this is you bring commercial sponsors on board and the media and there is pressure to succeed no matter what. Earlier in this thread there is a note from Andy Saunders where some experienced divers outlined the difficulties to the RAFM – this should have raised alarm bells over ‘Plan A’ but it seems it didn’t .

Bruce…Easy to be critical when you weren’t there.

but I am not on about ‘on the day’…I am on about what wasn’t done in the three years pre-planning, not there but in a comfortable meeting room, on how £600,000 was spent overlooking a Plan B, there was no carefully thought out Plan B. Thats where it went wrong for the delicate parts. They didnt have a set of rules to follow to the letter when Plan A proved difficult. A loose beam placed inside the rear fuselage, cabled to swing allways, no support for the outer wings, no counterbalance or cable to the rear taiplane.

I would be interested to know more about why all that was done or not done as the case may be, of why in the months beforehand no plausible Plan B better than what was done was given thought, it might allow more understanding.

DBenz

Will any aircraft be recovered in that way again -I very much doubt it!

I doubt there are any other aircraft on the sea bed worthy of preservation. The Dornier is borderline IMHO.

Perhaps someone can point me at other, more successful recoveries of this nature. I’m struggling to think of any, and I don’t include the Norwegian freshwater recoveries, which were rather different.