Halifax NA337… the Big Move..!

Hi Seafuryfan,
Yes, that’s me, ex-Warbirds Worldwide, professional non-expert, asker of cheeky questions.

My comment was only that rather like the proverbial axe or broom (depends on your preferred annecdote) it’ll be ‘the original Halifax’ but much of it will be new material (and the work has been very well done too).

The principle here is that any replacement parts aren’t original (obvious) They will differ in ways obvious (and less so) from the original. Most of the time, this does not matter much, but it can do and it’s a general museum artifact principle to keep as much of the original, preserved, as possible, so it is available for future research. (For instance the meterlergy and paint composition of modern replacements will differ from the original material. Trivial? Perhaps. But if all the roundels are replaced we won’t be able to find out HOW the original yellow was made up, by a reverse engineering process.)

With a/c this might seem minor, but museums have to think in VERY long and (unlikely) timescales… So, say ‘restoring’ the Ship of Cheops (the world’s oldest transport artifact http://www.touregypt.net/featurestories/solar.htm) so it floats would be lunatic. Beuilding a replica, makes perfect sense, but then it’s a replica, not the original – that other argument comes up!)

A brief summary of a big topic!

Hello friends

Graham Adlam himself followed the thread and asked me to post his message:

I can only list the info people have given me, I know a bit about Spits but dont claim to be an expert on bombers. The rudder pedals actually had a stores ticket saying handley page halifax. I also have left an offer to all members at spitfirespares.com offering vouchers for the correction of listing of any parts i have listed. I have hundreds of parts listed if i knew what they all are from personal knowledge i really would be gifted.

Cheers,
Herbert

Hello all,

Just have been in contact with Graham Adlam about the rudder pedals. Like Herbert already mentioned. The rudder pedals had a tag on them with “Handley Page Halifax” on them. Also Graham offered a discount if anyone could provide any further information about items offered for sale in case of mis-identification. This proves that he is very anxious to provide a good service to the warbird-community in offering hard to find items.

My dealings with Graham have always been a pleasure in the past and I intend to keep it that way. I apologized to him I have offended him, which was never my intention in the first place.

Just to let you know in case these things get out of hand. 🙂

Cheers

Cees

Graham Adlam

Hello Peter 🙂
Thanks for the information. I´ll tell Graham.
Cheers,
Herbert

As a historical resource and a research tool, the RAM a/c will be more useful than the Trenton machine.

JDK, I am interested by the above quote – based, I’m sure on your wealth of experience in the field of old aircraft (I was the reader of a now defunct quality journal, hope I have the connection right). Even if the restorers of NA337 have documented the before/during/after process (with photos), could there still be stuff that could only be picked up by examination of an original wreckage? Any chance you could explain a little more for us armchair enthusiasts please?

Like yourself, I think NA337 is a wonderful restoration – my Grandfather flew on the same mission 🙂

Greetings Herbert. I have sent several messages re the correct part id etc and also emailed him a couple of times but nothing in reply?

yes the hastings sorry i meen halifax at elvington does look good

Graham Adlam

Hello friends

Graham Adlam himself followed the thread and asked me to post his message:

I can only list the info people have given me, I know a bit about Spits but dont claim to be an expert on bombers. The rudder pedals actually had a stores ticket saying handley page halifax. I also have left an offer to all members at spitfirespares.com offering vouchers for the correction of listing of any parts i have listed. I have hundreds of parts listed if i knew what they all are from personal knowledge i really would be gifted.

Cheers,
Herbert

Mmmm, I was told by someone in the know that an awfully large amount of original structure was discarded to be replaced by new metal. Now I can understand regarding the aircraft’s structural integrety. But it was all dumped in the bin although some panels were used to paint nose-art on it and these were available. I would have loved to get some cockpit panelling however pitted to use in my project. Ah well, we cannot have it all. Perhaps with the LW170 restoration……………

Cheers

Cees

It’s a great, great restoration.

However a lot of the original metal has been replaced with new metal, and a lot of the parts are from other a/c. I’m delighted they are doing the job that they are, but it needs to be pointed out that the RAFM Halifax wreck is now and will be more original than this superb rebuild. As a historical resource and a research tool, the RAM a/c will be more useful than the Trenton machine.

That said, it’s great that they represent defferent marks, and hats off that they are under cover and looked after – (yes, including the RAFM a/c).

The Elvington machine dous a good job of representing a Halifax. Both Setter & I were impressed by its presence, and as a memorial, shouldn’t be belittled.

Cheers!

Some more photo’s

http://www.rcafmuseum.on.ca/halifaxhome.htm

Cheers

Cees

I would start with this one first (source 57Rescue) 😀 :rolleyes: :

WOW 🙂 Happy Now…

If only we had the same determination in the UK as they do in Canada 😡

I wish Karl and his team the very best of luck, but after sixty years immersed in 1600 metres of salt water… well, I hope it doesn’t just crumble to mush when it gets to the surface.

As for NA337… what a fabulous job they’ve done so far! Personally I have no issue with this priceless airframe being permanently housed; I’d much rather she was protected for future generations than risked in any way.

Papa Lima…..

Follow the link

Halibag Nanton

Halifax to Nanton?

Having visited Nanton this year, I can’t see how on earth a Halifax could be slotted into the hangar, this photo shows how the Lancaster just about fills the available space width-wise, and the space behind it is filled with other valuable restored aircraft, not long enough to take a Halifax either. A new hangar would seem to be required, but there’s no room forward of this one, it is almost up to the main road in front!
Would any Nanton residents who may read this care to explain where the Halifax would go?

They had to have the halifax in so that they could install the final wall and if you notice the pan of concrete on the floor, they can leave her insitu while they pour the rest of the concrete for the floor. We did the same with our lancaster when it was brought into the building.

I’m not trying to take anything away from this marvellous restoration and project, but having looked at the link that Cees posted, I was a little surprised that the building itself looks nowhere near finished.

It seems there’s a lot of work to be done on the structure, including the lining inside and some external work. I was jsut wondering, what was the rush to get the bomber into the new building when it’s only half built?

The builders will now be building around the priceless aircraft where anything can happen. Is there even a sprinkler system in there yet?

I must say… I am very impressed with my fellow Canadians for the fine job they have done on our beautiful Halifax. Now lets find a sunk Whitley worth recovering!!!!

Are there any?

🙁
Todd

Another Halifax in Canada? Where has this this one come from? So there are now four Halifaxes on the surface then? RAFM, YAM, Trenton and Nanton? Not bad for an extinct type a few years back.

Are there plans for any more to be raised? When you see planes like the recent He111 and Ju88 in Norway, and the B17 in Canada coming to the surface, and combine that with the work achieved on this Halifax, there’s hope that anything can be done with lakebed aircraft. What will we see raised next I wonder.

I wonder if they will change their mind and have doors put on the end of the new building?