he111 zwilling

A Simpler / Cheaper Option?

Wouldn’t it have been simpler to produce a four-engined He111 (He211)?

I know it would have had one less engine but it would also have had about one less of everything else (fuselage, undercarriage, tail, crew) so surely would have had a better power-to-weight ratio.

Here is a link to the pic with the support strut between. I’ve seen it several places.

http://www.kheichhorn.de/html/body_heinkel_he_111z.html

That is no support strut. There are a few things about that image that look wrong, I’m guessing it is a drawing/artist impression or something like that. If you look at the leading edge of the center wing section there is a bit of sweepback on both sides of the center engine that wasn’t there on the real thing.

I can see your point, from that image it certainly looks like some form of bracing but there is no structural reason for having that strut there and aerodynamically it is a ‘less than elegant’ solution which makes me think that it was never there. This is substantiated by the other available photos of the Zwilling.

Wonder if they ever tried winch launching the Me321 ?:eek:

Piece of cake! You got 300 troops ready to use the one behind – give ’em the bungee and shout “Russians!”. It’ll be off the ground in no time. Then, when they realise they’ve been had, cram them into their glider and you repeat the same performance until there’s only one left on the ground. That’s when you need the Zwilling!

Adrian

Oops.. Italeri model Me 323.

Wonder if they ever tried winch launching the Me321 ?:eek:

Interesting film of a Gigant in flight on youtube.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=6e639Ec9lsQ

Used to have the Heller model of the Me323, monster wingspan at 1:72.

Not made any less interesting by it being of a Zwilling towing two Gotha Go242 gliders…

Adrian

(OK, it’s so far away that almost anything could be happening, but that’s my best guess. Next best guess would be being followed by two Fw189s. Vampires – I doubt veerrrrry much.)

there is no way that that strut braces the fuselage enough. the airframe stress must have been massive! torsion between fuselages etc. also the website link given above shows one in flight without a strut, and either scratches or being attacked bu AA fire, also looks to be one being intercepted by Dh vampires! thats a very interesting photo!

Here is a link to the pic with the support strut between. I’ve seen it several places.

http://www.kheichhorn.de/html/body_heinkel_he_111z.html

Dan Gilberti’s excellent site has a (French-language) page on the Zwilling, one of which was hacked down by 418 Squadron Mossies in Dan’s neck of the woods.

http://www.histavia21.net/Heinkel%20111z%20Tavaux/le_heinkel_111z_de_dole.htm

One of the two pics of the HE111Z in flight that I have come across have a support strut between tail assemblies just forward of the H Stabilizers. Hmmmm, a little too much airframe stress? Might have been the prototype.

Can you show us that photo? I was under the impression that there was no link between the tail assemblies. If the individual airframes are ‘stiff’ enough there should not be a need for such a link.

that spar seems to be in quite good condition, has it been restored??? or is it original?

One of the two pics of the HE111Z in flight that I have come across have a support strut between tail assemblies just forward of the H Stabilizers. Hmmmm, a little too much airframe stress? Might have been the prototype.

Here is a direct link to a pic of the surviving spar for the 323….huge monster!!!:eek:

http://www.preservedaxisaircraft.com/Luftwaffe/relics/images/Me323_mainspar.jpg

😮 😮 😮 😮

Last year EHVB and I visited Gatow and saw the mainspar from up close. It looks more like part of a bridge. The brackets still had remains of wooden ribs clamped into them. All that’s needed is a welded steel fuselage and a Gigant is a distinct possibilty. IIRC there is another main spar about in Germany.

Amazing what’s still left but easily overlooked, even items such as this.

Cheers

Cees

must be a feasable project after all it would be mainly wood constructed ,are there any drawings in exsistence ?

Last year EHVB and I visited Gatow and saw the mainspar from up close. It looks more like part of a bridge. The brackets still had remains of wooden ribs clamped into them. All that’s needed is a welded steel fuselage and a Gigant is a distinct possibilty. IIRC there is another main spar about in Germany.

Amazing what’s still left but easily overlooked, even items such as this.

Cheers

Cees

Here is a direct link to a pic of the surviving spar for the 323….huge monster!!!:eek:

http://www.preservedaxisaircraft.com/Luftwaffe/relics/images/Me323_mainspar.jpg

Presumably it is a very long museum?

The Zwilling may seem a bit hair-brained, but IIRC the original plan was to tow behind three Bf110s. This was all very well if all worked, but (again, IIRC) an engine failure on an early takeoff led to one aircraft being dragged into the other two, with disastrous results.

I still wouldn’t have liked to have been in one anywhere near the enemy, though…

Adrian

………..or did the Gogant glider it towed survive at all? ……..

I believe a museum in Germany, possibly Berlin, has a full wingspar of a Gigant. As far as I know, that is all that survives of the glider or powered 323 version.

Steve

😮 thats crazy, there must have been some sort of brace between the tailplanes? and the centresection must have been incredibly strong. i wonder what the flying controls were like too!!!

Revell used to do a 1/72 kit, which looked pretty damn cool hanging from the bedroom ceiling (well, I thought so!).

I can’t help feeling, though, that it probably had the turning circle of a battleship – any attempt to fly it anywhere you didn’t have complete air superiority would be likely to be short-lived…

Adrian