Heads up tonight, Pearl Harbor BBC1 8:00

hey just a question about the dolittle raid at the end of the film.

Did B25s actully take off from a carrier again?

Real Footage of the launch from the USS Hornet in ‘Thirty Seconds Over Tokyo’, the footage on Pearl Harour looked like a 2 Group raid on Holland with Smart bombs (what a load of rubbish).

hey just a question about the dolittle raid at the end of the film.

Did B25s actully take off from a carrier again?

Standard procedure in the army as well. The officers are told what’s going on but don’t know what to do, the squaddies who are supposed to do the job are deemed to have no need to know what’s happening. So you have the poor squaddies getting their backsides shot off and the officers leading from the command post with cries of ‘follow me men, I’m right behind you’.
As for J Boyle’s comment about flying a B25 off a carrier not being for the faint of heart – even a self respecting idiot would think twice about doing that.
Daz, your “will a spot of oil on a piece of paper do?” must have gone down like a lead balloon

I can vouch for that, during the Arnhem debacle, my old man went forward with a major and a subordinate to prepare some artillery observation lines.
They were promptly attacked by SS infantry supported by a Tiger tank.
The private was shot and the major turned round and legged it, my old man managed to shoot the tank commander and driver with his sten, then picked up the private and ran back to Allied lines with him, he never saw the major again and despite being reccomended for a medal by another officer, the powers that be swept the incident under the carpet in order to protect the reputation of one of their own, so that was that.

Daz, your “will a spot of oil on a piece of paper do?” must have gone down like a lead balloon

The girl in question was slightly downhearted! :diablo:

As the Sergeant Pilots in the Battle of France were told that they didn’t need to know what was going on, or where they were going, just to follow the officers, and not given maps, you ‘aint that far off the mark.

Not unlike the Civil Service then 😀

The offices set up by Edward IV to administer the Kingdom are alive and kicking…

As the Sergeant Pilots in the Battle of France were told that they didn’t need to know what was going on, or where they were going, just to follow the officers, and not given maps, you ‘aint that far off the mark.

Standard procedure in the army as well. The officers are told what’s going on but don’t know what to do, the squaddies who are supposed to do the job are deemed to have no need to know what’s happening. So you have the poor squaddies getting their backsides shot off and the officers leading from the command post with cries of ‘follow me men, I’m right behind you’.
As for J Boyle’s comment about flying a B25 off a carrier not being for the faint of heart – even a self respecting idiot would think twice about doing that.
Daz, your “will a spot of oil on a piece of paper do?” must have gone down like a lead balloon

The ‘bombs’ used by the high level ‘Kates’ were I believe conversions from 6″ naval shells.

The theory about the black powder is generally believed to be accurate.
Only two ships were not salvaged from Pearl Harbo(u)r, the converted target ship (had been a battleship) USS Utah and the USS Arizona.
The Oklahoma which capsized (also with heavy loss of life) was salvaged but not returned to service and the West Virginia and California (also both sunk) were salvaged and returned to service against the Japanese.

There was another ship there that day. The Brooklyn class Cruiser USS Phoenix, she survived the day with a dent caused by shrapnel in a secondary gun shield.
Forty one years later she ran into two torpedoes fired by HMS Conqueror
off the Falklands–of course by then she was called The General Belgrano.
A.

Perhaps the RAF is run along feudal lines.

As the Sergeant Pilots in the Battle of France were told that they didn’t need to know what was going on, or where they were going, just to follow the officers, and not given maps, you ‘aint that far off the mark.

I’d say the bit where the Arizona leaps out of the water like a wounded croc is my least favorite; I know every action has an equal and opposite reaction an’ all, but I would have thought blowing all to £”$* would have been enough opposite reaction. Yes I too marvelled at the amount of stick movement a chap can make without affecting the A/C at all ,initially I thought it might be a hand pump for the U/C!
“Just get me into a godamn plane”

Don’t forget Dark Blue World, I’m sure there was a huge gothic mansion in the airfield there as well.

Perhaps the RAF is run along feudal lines.

Going back to the excerable Pearl Harbor and the aforementioned, admittedly impressive (the first time, after that it’s just gimmicky), shot of the bomb hitting the Arizona and a point of accuracy – the bomb that lands in the magazine looks to be no bigger than about 250lb – would it be possible for a little device like this to have plunged neatly through the armoured deck of a capital ship and into the heart of the most well protected part of the vessel?

Looking at the sequence with the “planes on the lawn” ,I can see a similarity with the chateau sequence in BoB , is it possible that the producers of PH thought that all British control towers were modeled on stately homes ?

You could be right, don’t forget the chateau sequence in PoC as well as the opening scenes in ‘Over Here’.
By the way, is the house featured in PH, Badminton, it looks very similar, just lacks the horses, sorry, I’m wrong, one of the donkeys was flying a Spitfire.

Because that is the colour the stick on letters come in.

Not true. You can have stick on letters in any colour you like – but white’s cheaper than a specialised one-off colour. (You can even have letters with gold flecks in…)

Of course we could go with the Piece of Cake approach which is to drop the letters ‘cos they keep coming off…

And that’s a point. It’s interesting that IMHO, PoC is a useful historical resource, despite being fiction, as it’s faithful to a well researched book. A contrast to Pearl Harbor, but then PoC cost a bomb and never saw a good return on its investment – I don’t think we’ll see the like again.

Richard Whiteley and Carol Vorderperson against the nips! This I’ve got to see.

Moggy

Sadly it’ll have to be a CGI Whiteley….!

Why do they insist on white code letters?

Because that is the colour the stick on letters come in.

Why do they insist on white code letters?

Maybe they include chateaux so that they can intercut old footage from BoB – if they want to.

Great film – shot on Kodak’s new sugar coated film stock. I hear they are going to make a remake of The Final Countdown. The new film will feature an aircraft carrier manned by film critics and aviation buffs who go back in time to bomb the set of Pearl Harbour (The Movie). The japanese have a lot to answer for – without them we wouldn’t have to endure such trashy films.

Richard Whiteley and Carol Vorderperson against the nips! This I’ve got to see.

Moggy

Looking at the sequence with the “planes on the lawn” ,I can see a similarity with the chateau sequence in BoB , is it possible that the producers of PH thought that all British control towers were modeled on stately homes ?

Is it just me, or did anyone see the erk grinding (yes, grinding !) the side of the Spitfire behind the cockpit in the opening shot of the Spit’s on the lawn ? 😮

Was it some dasterdly cockpit collector at work severing his new acquisition ? 😀

What disappoints me is that in the past, movie makers were happy to make a film set in wartime without the need to introduce too many “love story” compromises. What has obviously happened is that the perceived target audience has changed. In other words, current audiences are not expected to be able to cope with a realistic story line and must have a fake, over melodramatic shedload of tosh inserted to maintain their interest.

That is the worrying aspect of modern film making to me.

In my opinion, “Saving Private Ryan” also conveys that human element really well,..if you can excuse the “P-51 Tank-Busters” line.
That first 20 minutes of trying to get onto the beach was mind-blowing !!