Hitlers A-Bomb.

The extra Uranium wasn’t in bomb form, but did apparently originate in Germany. Even more ironically, it was bound for Japan.

https://www.nytimes.com/1995/12/31/us/captured-cargo-captivating-myster…

For it to be “fact” requires evidence. I only see assumptions, speculation and rumour. 

Montgomery’s diary held at Kew notes capture of the German Atomic Bomb at Goslar on 26 April 1945 by the US 9th Army.

If one examines  the Uranium enrichment rate at Oak Ridge and considers the Jette memorandum warning that Oak Ridge would only have 15 kg of HEU by mid February 1945. Then it raises questions how 64 kg of enriched Uranium in the Hiroshima bomb could have been enriched in USA before August 1945?

By contrast the Germans had Uranium centrifuges and Betatron separators with much faster enrichment rates than K-25, or Y-12 at Oak  Ridge.

The fact is this: the bomb dropped on Hiroshima was captured in Germany in April 1945.

Yes a CSDIC  POW report from 18 September 1943 (SRA 4394) KEW W/O archives) two Luftwaffe personnel were discreetly recorded by hidden microphones (that is methodology used by all CSDIC facilities)…,  discussing an He-177 bomber modified with an enlarged bomb bay at Reichlin for an Atomic bomb called 76 Zentner

One asked the other, What is this 76 Zentner? Have you actually seen it?

[  suggesting the bomb itself already had some noteriety  amongst others who had not seen it ]

The other POW replies , it looks like the 36 Zentner, only longer and it has to be screwed together.

It was also described as intended to destroy big cities and ridiculous because the bomb was “too big” 

The 177 bomber intended for delivery was described as awaiting engines

One of those captured was described as Ju88 R4 Unteroffizior W/Op, 5/llJ,G,2 captured 10 Aug 43, the other described as a Gefreiter/ mechanic captured 11 May 43.

These POW do not describe it as an “Atomic bomb per se, but the description fits.

It also seems to describe the He177 V38 aircraft found at the Letov factory at Prague.

This aircraft could have been awaiting DB603N engines. for high altitude flight.

v38 also could have been waiting for  DB603N engines which were fitted to He177 A6 prototypes converted to He277. HIGH altitude flight was the only way a German bomber could deliver any bombs over Britain by 1943/44.

Yes in reply to the original question, there is evidence at Kew W/O archives.  The RAOC Gazette of October 1946 records: “… DDOS of 8 Corps found a factory engaged in production work for the German Atomic bomb.”  

The reference is to an underground factory at Espelkamp, enriching Uranium described as under “Lange Horst wood”  Inside RAOC sappers found 40 working Uranium centrifuges  and what was described as a “Krupp reactor.” 

There’s an awful lot of speculation crept into this thread, whereas the original question was simply whether or not there was, or was not, any evidence that the alleged bomb tests took place.
It’s pretty obvious that by 1945, neither Germany or Japan were in any position to win the war – and no one has inferred that they might have. Nonetheless, just how close the Germans were – or were not – to any kind of test is an interesting point. I’d always presumed that they were a long-way off it – hence the interest. Do I think they succeeded..? No, there doesn’t appear to be any credible evidence.
Would Germany have won the war by dropping an atomic bomb on Downing Street in 1945..? No, but doubtless the war would have dragged-on a bit longer. Just as it would if the US had not dropped the A-Bomb on Japan. In terms of loss of life, both actual outcomes were favourable.

For sure there is a lot of hogwash talked about what was found in Germany at the end of the war. Yet, there is no denying that Germany was, factually, well ahead in many areas. Their jet engines were axial-flow, they had swept-wing jet fighters in service, they had the V1 & V2, – some of their weaponry, such as tanks were vastly superior to the average allied stuff – the list is endless and can’t be simply dismissed. Fortunately, they were led by a small cadre of fanatical idiots.

The finest German tank of the war, the Panther, of course, copied the best features from the Russian ( Allied ) T34. Every German tank that followed this was an over weight/over armoured lumbering beast that the US/UK had no requirement for. We needed lighter smaller tanks to be transported by ships, landing craft and bridges. Not defensive monster tanks.

The German V1 and V2 were wonder weapons at the time, but actually as overblown, deadly fireworks did not achieve much in terms of winning the war, except provide exotic stuff for Allied aircraft to destroy on the ground. The UK/US had no need to develop or produce such weapons, when we could deliver a bomber directly over german cities to drop the HE in an aimed way. Churchill started fielding various rocket weapons in the dark days of 1940, when we were desperate for any weapons. We chose to direct our research efforts on other more useful directions that suited our aims.

The Germans researched and fielded short-ranged jet interceptors because they really needed them. Likewise with land-based guided anti-aircraft missles. Again, we did not have that particular requirement.

The list of ways in which the Germans were ahead is not endless. In every field for which they were ahead of us, the Allies were ahead in another development.

Creaking Door,
You’re correct with your assumption that Japan was pretty well defeated before the atomic attacks; there is a school of thought that the nature and unusual, almost mythical, power of the weapons permitted more ‘moderate’ factions to end the war without catastrophic loss of face. The hardliners were prepared to fight for every yard – with bamboo spears and suicide weapons if required. The Allied estimates for Op Olympic casualties are quite sobering – permitting many to claim that the atomic strikes actually saved lives….

Ah, fair point CD. I was translating the “research” into a viable weapon!!:)

Which, with the exceptions of V-2s and jet-powered aircraft, is where Nazi Germany failed massively.

And even those successes were limited in production numbers and, especially in the case of the jet engines, suffered from poor materials tech.

Ah, fair point CD. I was translating the “research” into a viable weapon!!:)

True again, but let me qualify that statement:

Just being technically ahead in many areas of research will not win wars…

…if the superior weapons are not ready and are not actually in service on the battlefield in significant numbers!

At Crecy and Agincourt the long-bows were in the hands of English archers who were skilled with them…

…they were not ‘going to be ready’ (probably) in about six months if the war lasts that long! 🙂

I think we’ve gone off at a tangent. I was merely picking up on this specific comment of yours: “True, but just being ‘technically ahead’ in many areas of research will not win wars.”

Going back in history, the English long-bow won Crecy and Agincourt.

True. Nazi Germany may have been working on nuclear weapons but they may as well have been working on warp-drive, photon-torpedoes and time-machines because when Soviet troops were taking a dump in Hitler’s bathroom they hadn’t got a viable weapon!

Let us stick to the facts about the war with Japan. By 1945 Japan has no domestic oil and little (any?) domestic coal at its disposal and conventional US Navy submarines have sunk over 90% of the entire Japanese merchant fleet; very soon Japan will be physically cut-off from any source of fuel. Japanese planes will stop flying, road transportation will cease, power-stations will shut-down and the machine-tools will stop. Not to mention that food shortages were common in Japan by 1945.

How will Japan continue fighting? What with…..bamboo spears?

The USA can continue fire-bombing every city, town or hamlet in Japan with B-29 bombers while P-51 fighters strafe anything that moves in daylight without any opposition all while the Japanese starve…

…eventually they’ll give-up!

With respect that is a lot of assumptions and what-ifs, whereas it is a fact that the atom bomb ended the war.

The Allies (or the USA alone) would have defeated Japan with or without the nuclear weapons.

If Nazi Germany had developed nuclear weapons in say April 1945 what then? Would they have won the war? No. Would they have used it? Yes, probably. Then what? Would the Allies have surrendered knowing that their own nuclear programme was nearly ready?

But is that wholly true? It was the 2 atom bombs which ended the war in the Far East, not Allied might.

For sure there is a lot of hogwash talked about what was found in Germany at the end of the war. Yet, there is no denying that Germany was, factually, well ahead in many areas. Their jet engines were axial-flow, they had swept-wing jet fighters in service, they had the V1 & V2, – some of their weaponry, such as tanks were vastly superior to the average allied stuff – the list is endless and can’t be simply dismissed…

True, but just being ‘technically ahead’ in many areas of research will not win wars.

I think I am correct in saying that Britain alone (not the British Empire) out-produced the Nazi German regime (Germany, Czechoslovakia, Austria, France, Poland) in almost all aspects of armaments with the possible exception of submarines, machine-guns and artillery (even with ‘slave’ labour).

Britain made more aircraft, more tanks, more ships, more trucks, and the one decisive weapon that Nazi Germany really could have used to defeat Britain, submarines, were being sunk as fast as they could make them…

…and that is just Britain…..never mind the USA or the USSR!

German weapons (some of them, not all of them) may have been better but so what? No matter how good their weapons were (given the existing technology) Nazi Germany would have lost the war; if they’d done less research and spent the time and resources on existing proven weapons the regime would probably have lasted longer.

(The Allies scooped-up a lot more than just the scientists…..but also those who knew where the wealth etc was hidden.)

I hope you aren’t referring to ‘Operation James Bond’ by Christopher Creighton! :dev2:

I’m still doubtful that any sort of successful test took place. However, even if they only actually tried (..and failed.) to detonate some sort of prototype it’s very interesting, as would be the physical size if this took place, in relation to delivery methods.
For sure there is a lot of hogwash talked about what was found in Germany at the end of the war. Yet, there is no denying that Germany was, factually, well ahead in many areas. Their jet engines were axial-flow, they had swept-wing jet fighters in service, they had the V1 & V2, – some of their weaponry, such as tanks were vastly superior to the average allied stuff – the list is endless and can’t be simply dismissed. Fortunately, they were led by a small cadre of fanatical idiots.
A fact often overlooked is that the Germans had the worlds ONLY Supersonic wind-tunnels. These fell into the British sector at the end of the war and I was told by a British test-pilot that they were spirited back to the UK and were very influential. I think there were at least two. A subject well-worth a thread of it’s own I would say….! ( I wonder if any have survived…? – but I digress.)
Politics is not relevant here, nor is it really a place to posture and moralise. (The Allies scooped-up a lot more than just the scientists – conveniently forgotten now – , but also those who knew where the wealth etc was hidden.) Not because they aren’t important, but because we’re here to talk ‘Historic Aviation’.

There is a lot of information (and speculation?) in Friedrich Georg’s 2005 book “Hitler’s Miracle Weapons, Volume 2” published by Helion. This includes photos and a diagram of a German A bomb.
Jim