Indians finally sign Rafale in a week. the amount of involvement and tech transfers make india’s involvement in rafale and pak-fa more or less the same.
eventually they will need to buy more planes to replace mig-29s, mig-23s, mirage 2000s and even lcas and su-30s. India likely only has the budget to focus on one.
which should it be.
RCS levels are probably about the same overall. pak-fa has faceted edges and a bay, but rafale more attention to all around features and better curved ducts while the pak-fa are partially exposed
rafale can definitely super cruise, pak-fa super cruise isn’t confirmed
rafale definitely has aesa radar, pak-fa radar isn’t completed yet and not confirmed it is a true aesa
pak-fa has 2 weapons bays and rafale has none. but rafale has meteor and scalp, no equivelent to them yet in pak-fa, so rafale can reach longer but the pak-fa may reach in closer undetected
price wise, they could very well be around the same
more importantly politically wise. russia and india were close but russia is also seling su-35s and other things to pakistan and china, india’s main rivals. france does not sell fighter planes to pakistan or china.
By: KGB - 17th September 2016 at 17:41
stats and news say something else. they are more legit sources than you, sorry.
Came from Wiki and CIA world fact book
By: Byoin - 17th September 2016 at 13:55
Russia has the 5th most foreign exchange reserves in the world. No debt and lowest debt of G 20. Gazprom and Rosneft are the biggest publicly traded oil and gas companies in the world. Bigger than Exxon mobile. Lots of money
stats and news say something else. they are more legit sources than you, sorry.
By: MSphere - 17th September 2016 at 13:39
When the FGFA/PakFa contract is signed. There will be no more F-35 for India, as in crystal clearity NEVER.
But if they can get the PakFa/FGFA right, only the sky is the limit.
I would not completely rule the F-35 out.. but I am talking post 2030 timeframe when Mirage 2000Is and MiG-29UPGs are already gone..
By: KGB - 17th September 2016 at 13:38
Russia’s economy is smaller than the state of California. it has no money to produce any new fighter for a very long time. maybe 2060 it can begin making a 6th gen.
China and US would’ve moved on to 7 gen by then.
Russia has the 5th most foreign exchange reserves in the world. No debt and lowest debt of G 20. Gazprom and Rosneft are the biggest publicly traded oil and gas companies in the world. Bigger than Exxon mobile. Lots of money
By: MSphere - 17th September 2016 at 13:36
Msphere, there were no offers as it were to sell the F-35 to India. The F-35 would not have been compliant with MMRCA requirements in 2007. The latest L-M initiated offer to provide information/briefing on the F-35 was a carrot for the F-16. “Buy the F-16 line and the F-35 might be on the table in the future”.
Well, I think we are only arguing about semantics.. In 2007, LM made it clear that they would be willing to sell the F-35 to India.. This came directly from Rob Weiss, LM Vice President for Business Development.. He never mentioned that the 35 would take part in the MMRCA competition, though..
There would be considerable difficulty getting congressional approval to export the F-35 to India.
That is, of course, possible, but why would you even apply for congressional approval if no deal is taking place due to lack of interest?
In short, there was no offer. It was a diplomatic manuver that India saw through, and rejected.
In short, there was an offer from LM. But the India’s reaction was not sufficient to start the whole clearance procedure..
By: halloweene - 17th September 2016 at 12:28
Rafale is not in any way a stealth aircraft. Never been operational. And will never be. Some attempt did not meet designer/customer satisfaction or were discarded due to irrelevant cost at the time.
Rafale has reduced frontal rcs (just like an f16 or a B1B and certainly less than a SH).To my knowledge, the Pi/2 inlets never reached an operational rcs reduction level and stand as a WiP.
What Rafale has is a sophisticated integrated ecm suite (but loosing it’s uniqueness) and a world class hugging terrain software (depending on map availability).
I won’t comment on RCS comparison with SH. Hugging terrain software isn’t anymore dependent on map as it is implemented on RBE2 AA. (radar followground). BTW, wouldn’t call Rafale air intakes Pi/2 as (i) they are less than 180° (ii) they are sort of “integrated” into the whole body. Last, angles aren’t allways the best solution vs radar, see B2 : no angles, but no constant curvature.
By: FBW - 17th September 2016 at 11:50
, as if the forum needed more,
rafale is in service, bombing muslims as we speak, unlike f-22 and unlike f-35.
the delta wing is inherently lower rcs, and the canted pylons on F-18E exacerbate not only the rotten aerodynamics,
but also frontal rcs
Better tell centcom that those F-22 missions never happened. Delta has an inherently lower RCS than what? Obligatory making things up again, more predictable than sunrise.
By: halloweene - 17th September 2016 at 11:32
No.
No to Muslim and No to RCS
Agree with no to muslim.
By: Nicolas10 - 17th September 2016 at 11:17
the french invented the metric system in the first instance, and no, inches feets and whatnot doesnt lower rcs
The metric system existed in ancient Egypt dude.
Now back on topic. China & Pakistan surely won’t like an IAF equipped with a few squadrons of Rafales & Pak-FA. Especially if numbers are made up with Super Flankers.
Nic
By: Byoin - 17th September 2016 at 07:22
Internet is not a economy.
tell that to google
By: JSR - 17th September 2016 at 06:55
Internet is not a economy.
By: Byoin - 17th September 2016 at 06:29
They have permanently stopped building Raptors and the F 35 is a joke. So I don’t think parity is out of the question.
Russia is working on 6th gen too. 6th gen stuff is just one upsmanship
Russia’s economy is smaller than the state of California. it has no money to produce any new fighter for a very long time. maybe 2060 it can begin making a 6th gen.
China and US would’ve moved on to 7 gen by then.
By: obligatory - 17th September 2016 at 04:59
the french invented the metric system in the first instance, and no, inches feets and whatnot doesnt lower rcs
By: TomcatViP - 17th September 2016 at 04:49
Omg…
Just one… Me être French. Toi understand?
Omg…
By: obligatory - 17th September 2016 at 04:46
….another america bot, as if the forum needed more,
rafale is in service, bombing muslims as we speak, unlike f-22 and unlike f-35.
the delta wing is inherently lower rcs, and the canted pylons on F-18E exacerbate not only the rotten aerodynamics,
but also frontal rcs
By: TomcatViP - 17th September 2016 at 04:26
rafale is already in operational service, bombing muslims, and certainly has better rcs lowering features than the much larger and exposed super hornet
No.
No to Muslim and No to RCS
By: KGB - 17th September 2016 at 04:05
Parity with US will be difficult since the Pentagon has been working on Gen 6 for some time.
They have permanently stopped building Raptors and the F 35 is a joke. So I don’t think parity is out of the question.
Russia is working on 6th gen too. 6th gen stuff is just one upsmanship
By: Byoin - 17th September 2016 at 04:03
Rafale is not in any way a stealth aircraft. Never been operational. And will never be. Some attempt did not met designer/customer satisfaction or were discarded due to irrelevant cost at the time.
Rafale has reduced frontal rcs (just like an f16 or a B1B and certainly less than a SH).What Rafale has is a sophisticated integrated ecm suite (but loosing it’s uniqueness) and a world class hugging terrain software (depending on map availability).
rafale is already in operational service, bombing muslims, and certainly has better rcs lowering features than the much larger and exposed super hornet
By: TomcatViP - 17th September 2016 at 03:59
Rafale is not in any way a stealth aircraft. Never been operational. And will never be. Some attempt did not meet designer/customer satisfaction or were discarded due to irrelevant cost at the time.
Rafale has reduced frontal rcs (just like an f16 or a B1B and certainly less than a SH).
To my knowledge, the Pi/2 inlets never reached an operational rcs reduction level and stand as a WiP.
What Rafale has is a sophisticated integrated ecm suite (but loosing it’s uniqueness) and a world class hugging terrain software (depending on map availability).
By: djcross - 17th September 2016 at 03:43
Parity with US will be difficult since the Pentagon has been working on Gen 6 for some time.
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September 16, 2016 at 6:50 am