Iraqi Invitation (Part2)

RE: US presses case for attacking Iraq

“US Vice-President ##### Cheney”

LOL,

US presses case for attacking Iraq

BBC World

Tuesday, 27 August, 2002, 03:24 GMT 04:24 UK
US presses case for attacking Iraq

US F-16 warplanes patrol the northern no-fly zone

US Vice-President ##### Cheney has given one of the clearest signals yet that the Bush administration intends to depose Saddam Hussein.
Mr Cheney, a leading hawk, said a policy of containment was no longer an option because doing nothing was riskier than acting against the Iraqi leader.

But as Mr Cheney was setting out the case for pre-emptive action against Iraq, the Gulf state of Qatar added its voice to Arab opposition over any US strike.

The tiny state is home to a huge US air base south-west of the capital, Doha.

Mr Cheney said there was no doubt that the Iraqi leader possessed chemical and biological weapons and was determined to add nuclear weapons to his arsenal.

It is plain that powerful advisers of US President George W Bush want him to deliver the regime change he has said he wants, says the BBC’s Justin Webb in Washington.

Speaking to army veterans in Nashville, Tennessee, Mr Cheney said the world could not wait until it became clear that Iraq had nuclear weapons before trying to topple its leader.

He inferred that if President Bush did not manage to bring about a change of regime in Baghdad, he would regard it as a failure of his presidency.

“We will not simply look away and leave the matter for some future administration to resolve,” Mr Cheney said.

For the first time, he also described America’s goals for a post-Saddam Iraq, saying the US wanted to see the country remain intact territorially and governed by a democracy.

However, US officials are stressing that no decision has yet been made on what to do or when.

Gulf opposition

Speaking in Baghdad, Qatar’s Foreign Minister Sheikh Hamad Bin Jassem Al-Thani said his country wanted a diplomatic solution to the dispute over the return of United Nations weapons inspectors to Iraq.

Qatar joins Saudi Arabia and Bahrain in denying use of their bases for any strike against Iraq.

Some US newspapers have even reported that the US military is preparing to transfer to the emirate equipment and some of the 6,000 US troops currently stationed in Saudi Arabia to avert Saudi objections.

Sheikh Al-Thani said the US had not asked permission to use the Al-Odaydia base.

But he revealed what the answer would be if it did.

“We are trying to save the region from new tragedies,” he said.

“Qatar is doing its best to calm the situation because the region cannot tolerate any new jolts.

“We are of course opposed to any military operation (against Iraq) and have always said that (disarmament) must be settled through diplomacy within the framework of the United Nations.”

Sheikh Al-Thani is believed to have gone to Baghdad to persuade the Iraqis to accept the return of international weapons inspectors.

The UN withdrew its inspectors four years ago complaining of Iraqi obstruction.

President Bush has accused Iraq of supporting terrorism and developing weapons of mass destruction.

Iraq has denied the allegations and said any talks with the United Nations on the inspectors’ return should also focus on lifting 12-year-old sanctions and the US and British-enforced no-fly zones in southern and northern Iraq, imposed since the 1991 Gulf War.

RE: Iraqi Invitation (Part2)

[updated:LAST EDITED ON 27-08-02 AT 07:03 AM (GMT)]Hi, Vortex,

As for Afghanistan, It’s to early to decide wheter the American (or allied as you wish) intervention has changed anything to the country. It’s not the US’s fault that this country is already so long at war, it’s mainly the fault of the local generals who prefer the current situation. Maybe 10 years from now, we can have a clear view on Afghanistan. It’s just too early now.

I don’t know much of the Taleban, but I don’t think a women in Afghanistan is happier now, she still has to wear her Burka and her son might have been killed on some wedding party. I’m not blaming America, it’s not America’s fault a couple of Mark-82 bombs have been dropped wrongly … err … it’s god’s fault! Oops, no, god is with us. Must have been the fault of those Europeans, not being able at pinpointing the exact target.

Phantom, stop with your macho behaviour, because you act like a 8-year old kid.

RE: Iraqi Invitation (Part2)

Sometimes I really wish I was in charge somewhere because I would like to personally shoot John Walker Lindh, all the people imprisoned at Gitmo, and anyone involved with the Taliban or Al-Quaida. Regarding what we did with the Nazis, I figure things can change and they should. These people aren’t war criminals……they are murderers…only of a different type. They are worthless and I’d personally welcome the chance to shoot them all….especially Lindh. Stupid piece of ##### that he is.

RE: Iraqi Invitation (Part2)

Geforce, i was refering to the recently arrested suspected terrorists.

As to Afghanistan, everything is relative and of course they can’t be compared to Europe. But, they are certainly better off than when the Taliban was around and it sound like you prefer it to revert back just to satisfy your own psyche. Very sad. As to aids, i’m refering to recent urgent need of monetary aids to support various programs in Afghanistan. The money was promised, but most aren’t there. Urgent national programs aren’t really in huge risks, but wide spread programs to help the people directly are.

RE: Iraqi Invitation (Part2)

Hi, Vortex.

Now you see, that’s the difference between you and Scooter. You make an argument. So, you don’t think there’ll be an attack on Iraq and that this is purely intended to frighten SH into calming down. I hope that’s all it comes to in the end because I really don’t think much he’s that much of a threat.

As for the prisoners in Cuba, thank you for opinion. I can understand America is finding it difficult to decide what to do with them. I think they should be tried and if found guilty they should be punished appropriately, even executed. After all, that is a courtesy you even granted to Nazi war criminals.

The comment about money and aid, can you explain a bit more as I know nothing about that side of things.

Thanks for actually trying to discuss the issues.

Regards,

kev35

RE: Iraqi Invitation (Part2)

[updated:LAST EDITED ON 26-08-02 AT 08:24 AM (GMT)]Terrorism is more than Al Quada alone, Vortex. Europe was combatting terrorists which threatened Europe like the GIA, the Red brigades, the IRA and the Basque seperation movements … long before 9/11. Many of these terrorists are imprisonned here, so don’t come telling us what to do with terrorists.

Also, the military campaign in Afghanistan was succesful on the short run. The muppet-regime in Kabul will fall in maybe 6 months, a year. Afghanistan still has the feodal system and there’s not much America can do about it. Women are still threated bad, there are still some skirmishes between local generals and, it’s still a very unsafe country. Those are the facts. I don’t think Iraq is waiting to become a second Afghanistan, with a pro-US leader who has no real power and a bunch of anarchists who keep terrorising their own population.

RE: Iraqi Invitation (Part2)

so, we don’t agree with you that means we’re ignorant? Most of the Taliban was freed and only some upper commanders and mostly Al Qieda are there in Cuba. When will they get a trial if any? Don’t know. What you want to do with them? Where are those arrested in Europe? Don’t tell me they already got a trial and are freed or punished. The problem is, European leaders don’t really know what to do with them either. Because they too fear releasing someone that will soon become invovled in a terrorist plot. As to Iraq, has the bombing began yet? Currently all i see IS a propaganda to get SH to wet his pants. Like i said months ago, American military prestige is at a recent high after Afghanistan and we should use that wisely to scare the ##### out of SH. Surely you don’t have a problem with that? Why don’t we turn the attention on the Europeans now. What happened to all those money pledged to Afghans? I believe the US delivered all promised, but certain group of nations have not fullfill their promise and is risking many livelyhood in Afganistan. Unless i’m wrong with my info. All this we are the righteousness, yet when it’s time for action what happens? Anybody can pledge and feel and preach the high of moral high grounds, but when it’s time to deliver, hum…

RE: Iraqi Invitation (Part2)

I think the gap between Americans and Europeans (or with the rest of the world) is too big now. They won’t even listen anymore. It won’t get better soon I guess, maybe within 10 years or so, after the ‘war on terror’ will be over. Maybe than they can start with the “war on ignorance”. I hope so …

RE: Iraqi Invitation (Part2)

Hi, Scooter.

“PhantomII- Don’t waste your time with these people. There bias against the US is almost suffocating! I was looking for a good debate on the issues. Thought, all I got was pure propaganda!”

Scooter, why oh why have you thrown your toys out of the pram? You were never looking for a good debate, you just wanted to expound your views on the greatness of the ‘good ol’ US of A.’ Debate means discussion, an exchange of ideas, neither of which we have had from you. Myself and others have asked you to provide justification for America’s stance on Iraq and all we ever get is ‘SH is evil.’ We asked you how would America fill the power vacuum SH would leave, have you provided an answer? We ask if the Taleban prisoners will ever receive a trial? Your answer, ‘they have no rights.’ That answer comes directly from the ‘land of the free.’

“all I got was pure propaganda!”

That’s what we thought we were getting from you. ‘Bush is right, America is great, SH is evil, Europe are wrong. You tell us Iraq has an evil regime. OK, that may be so. We ask you why you have not intervened to stop other evil regimes, Rwanda was one example? The fact that you refuse to answer anyone’s questions just indicates how closed minded you are.

“Maybe their working for good old Saddam? There words help keep murdering dictators like him in power by shifting blame to others! Didn’t the NAZI’s blame the Jew’s for all of there problems?”

Aren’t the Americans blaming SH for all their problems? It seems that you are.

“Mmm, something in me says this is complete BS! The little voices inside of me I guess. Look, the Americans are blaming us for supporting Saddam, how soon we forget. Most countries already had a war on terrorism long before 9/11, it’s only now that the US jumps in and it already starts accusing other countries of not supporting this war.”

It’s been said before Gef, but you won’t get Scooter to listen. His idea of debate is to rant and rave to articulate his views and then totally ignore anyone else’s responses. I sincerely hope not all Americans share the same point of view because if they do this world will become an even more dangerous place than it is today.

Regards,

kev35

RE: Iraqi Invitation (Part2)

[updated:LAST EDITED ON 25-08-02 AT 04:57 PM (GMT)]”PhantomII- Don’t waste your time with these people. There bias against the US is almost suffocating! I was looking for a good debate on the issues. Thought, all I got was pure propaganda! Maybe their working for good old Saddam? There words help keep murdering dictators like him in power by shifting blame to others! Didn’t the NAZI’s blame the Jew’s for all of there problems? Keep on talking guys…….keep twisting the facts and blaming the US for the worlds problems. While your own Goverments do nothing and you mite get what your looking for…..a world full of SH’s and Terrorist! “

Mmm, something in me says this is complete BS! The little voices inside of me I guess. Look, the Americans are blaming us for supporting Saddam, how soon we forget. Most countries already had a war on terrorism long before 9/11, it’s only now that the US jumps in and it already starts accusing other countries of not supporting this war. Maybe it’s for the best you don’t waste your time on these people, especially if you’re wrong.

RE: Iraqi Invitation (Part2)

“Hunting is not about killing cute little bunny rabbits. “

Actually it is about shooting cute little bunny rabbits… and possums, and Ferrets, and a few other pests that have no natural enemies here…

RE: Iraqi Invitation (Part2)

Geforce,

Hunting is not about killing cute little bunny rabbits. Hunting is about out witting a master of nature and honing your senses to the ultimate challenge. Only a butcher uses a SMG or something hunting. A real hunter uses a rifle, usually they only get one shot. If you miss, that big Elephant is going to kill you. If you hit, you give a whoop of joy, give out enought cash in fees and licences to keep a ranger in his job, protect against poachers and help Elephants stay alive. Hunting is about having a little pop gun between you and certain death!

Anyway sorry, that is way off tangent!

RE: Iraqi Invitation (Part2)

Seahawk
🙂

Geforce
“But I do find hunting a barbaric sport. “

I hunt and I don’t think of it as a sport either… it is either a source of cheap meat or pest erradication for me.

RE: Iraqi Invitation (Part2)

@ Garry : I´m no tree huger either, but this is one of the first discussions were we have the same opinion.

RE: Iraqi Invitation (Part2)

“I wasn’t expressing my opinion of this board.
If you read what I said in context it is the poster who states that SH or NK or Iran is evil and meets with resistance to the Axis of evil rhetoric… these can’t possibly be intelligent thinking people… they haven’t taken Bush’s speech as gospel… they must be pinko commies… or tree huggers.”

True what you say. Problem is we can’t take Bush serious, be we should, because he’s one of the most powerfull men in this world. I would like him to b from a tiny little unimportant state, so we can just avoid him and go on with our lives. Now the news is dominated by “Bush this” … Bush does not go to world conference in Jo’burg (maybe it’s for the best, he will only piss of the other participating countries).

“BTW Seahawk I am not really a tree hugger… I am pro the death penalty, I am prochoice. I enjoy hunting.”

Tree hugging is such a stupid word, just like ‘evil’. I’m also not a tree hugger, because I will never walk into a march to save some forest, or protest in Seattle, Gotheborg or Genua against the multinationals of this world, using a Nokia and drinking Coca cola. That’s hypocrisie. But I do find hunting a barbaric sport.