Is the Warbird Community in General to Elitist

Some people just cannot resist the temptation!

Anyway to return to topic – I think that the warbird world is not necassarily elitist but is widely seen as being so, with perhaps not enough being done to dispel this image.

Well Moggy the ‘hangers-on’ may not be in a position to divulge the full information.

Quite so.

The option then is to say nothing. Which if the information was given to them in confidence is what would be expected.

Moggy

Well Moggy the ‘hangers-on’ may not be in a position to divulge the full information. Granted its annoying to only hear part of the story, but ownership gives you the privelage to speak out if you wish or to keep things secret.

There is a difference between keeping commercial confidences (essential) and the actions of those who post titbits of obscure information, usually identifiable by the appearance of the word ‘certain’ as in “At a certain strip in Dorset” or “A certain warbird owner not a million miles from Bristol” who are actually playing the “I know something you don’t, so that makes me more important than you” game.

Generally this comes from the hangers-on rather than the owners themselves who I have always found approachable and open.

(Except a certain bearded warbird owner the name of whose company was not a million miles from ‘Warthogs of Great Britain’ 😉 😉 😉 😉 😉 😉 😉 😉 😉 😉 )

Moggy

One aspect lost by some is that the deals are not “secret” but rather “commercial in confidence” until the ink is dry. This is a very very small community when it comes to oeners etc etc and speaking from experience I have been reported as having donme something with my aircraft without even a phone call to check the “real story”. Hence one tends to keep the information on the QT until after the event.

In my opinion there are more secrets amongst historical cars collectors tahn amongst warbirds enthusiats, the more that the registrations which leads to the official owner is normally oainted somewhere on the aircraft whereas racing cars are usually not registered.

However i do have problems with some warbird owners who seem to prefer to remain anonymous or secretive about their dealings. Witness speculation about what’s really going on” with such and such airframe.
Such recalcitrance could lead some to think the warbird community is a bit clubbish.

Well, if Mr. X buys a 51 but don’t want the taxman to know about it, regs. the plane at a Company or trust in Delaware and flies it from a secluded field, I can understand his dislike to your photo of him in cockpit, with full name in Flypast, Warbirds Digest, and the internet!

T J

I remember back in 1986 a friend and I joined the then embryonic Warbirds of Norway (WoN) group. At the first members meet we attended we were met with disbelief from a certain board member. (We were 15 and 16) He was not interested in having us as members as he felt the responsibility of having kids around props too great. Seem to remember that he said something about an accident involving his old archery club where a kid got hit, and bla, bla, bla. There were some discussion amongst the board but he got his way, we got back our membership fee and hasta la vista! :eek::mad: The same year we met Anders Sæther at North Weald with the P-51 which had just been ferried across to Norway (He was also on the board at WoN), and he asked if we where members of the WoN. I told him of what had transpired at the infamous meet (he had not been there), and he just replied “we’ll see about that”. At the next annual meeting the bulls**t was cut through without mercy, and a new junior membership was established. Too late for my friend who felt that old airplanes and those involved with them s**ked to high heaven. 🙁 I have to say I agreed with him at that time but kept on, and I’m still interested in aviation today. Point of all this is to actually embrace people who are interested, and especially the young. Something like this will certainly be a make or break factor for a youth with the interest who gets the door shoved in his face! If you are 25 you take it and pursue a different road to uphold your interest. At 15 you feel unappreciated, and that drinking beer and smoking weed is much cooler after all…

T J

It’s been my experience that there are all types in any group, but in the whole the warbird “community” is pretty forthcoming and friendly. I’ve run across a handful who tend to stay in a tight-knit circle, but those are the exception and not the rule.

I think alot of that comes from the fact most warbird owners grew up with the same dreams that the rest of us poor schmucks have – to feel what it was like to fly one of those beautiful beasts we spent so much time staring at in books and in movies when we were young.

I’ve never had a problem either on this board or at events. the key to seeing planes and meeting people is not to be shy…act like you belong there and people accept you. 🙂

However i do have problems with some warbird owners who seem to prefer to remain anonymous or secretive about their dealings. Witness speculation about what’s really going on” with such and such airframe.
Such recalcitrance could lead some to think the warbird community is a bit clubbish.

On the “other” message board, there does seem to be a certain well connected group that takes pride in letting people know THEY know what’s going on but they always say “…I promised not to tell.”
What the heck, I know certain people on this board who use a pen name to mask their identities and keep some information on their activities private.
To the average person, that too, may come across as a bit strange.

But all things being equal., there still a lot less secrecy in the warbird community than in the antique/classic car world (probably because planes are rarer, have to be registered, and live at airfields…and not private garages).

Well, I can only speak for the New Zealand Warbird scene but I have always found everyone involved in warbirds very welcoming and open, and I can reiterate this with the great weekend I just had with Steve and John. We were welcomed to private collections, restoration workshops and also the operational hangar and apron of various old aeroplane collectors. Some of these visits were not even pre-arranged and totally off the cuff. I’m sure there are very few elitist operators and collectors in the country, they all enjoy sharing and educating the public. I’ve found the same thing at Wanaka and other aerodromes too.

Like I said in the beginning I always made time for anyone to me showing off my pride and joy was part of the fun. I don’t know how other owners feel about it.

Cheers
RER

At airshows,displays etc I will always take time out and talk to people who show an interest in my aircraft. These people are the reason that we are allowed to fly at airshows, without them there wouldn’t be any shows to participate in!!
Lord knows there’s enough nimby’s trying to stop us flying so, I’m sure as hell, going to make the effort to speak to as many people as possible to promote our passion…

DB 😀

No Rob. Think of how welcoming this very forum is (petty squabbling aside) and your question is answered. D

Oh Great and Wise Gnome, 😀

I agree that here and other Forums we do welcome all comers I was wounder more at the Hanger or Airshow.

I’ve been to many show where I’ve over heard people who are interested in are Communtiy say well I guess they don’t need us because they sure didn’t give me/us the time of day.

Like I said in the beginning I always made time for anyone to me showing off my pride and joy was part of the fun. I don’t know how other owners feel about it.

Cheers
RER

Nice memory AF

No Rob. Think of how welcoming this very forum is (petty squabbling aside) and your question is answered. D

Hi Mate.
I was introduced to my first “Historic aeroplane” (I hate the word WARBIRD) many years ago thanks to my Dad and a mate of his, they used to be involved with Rolls Royce at Hucknall and they were going to have an air display on the up and coming weekend, and my dads mate told my dad to bring me over the day before the display to have a look around some of the old aeroplanes, one of which was the RR Spitfire XIV. My Dad did take me along with mum, he showed me around the Spitfire, he also gave me the guided tour of the works at Hucknall as well and this was in the late 60s. I never forgot that visit, and I remember thinking I would like to work on one of those (Spitfire), I never wanted to fly, just to work on them. I was lucky, I did with BBMF and still do 18 years after starting with the flight, I now work as one of Carolyn Grace’s engineers on ML407.

At the begining of 2003, I started taking my son and daughter who were then 6, down to the hanger, not forced into going, they kept asking if they could come with me, and they enjoys every visit and are is really starting to learn their way around the aeroplane, they understand what they can and cannot touch, and touch nothing unless they ask first. my daughter even rides brakes when we take the aeroplane out to the airfield.

Last year, I remembered my first visit to Hucknall with Mum & Dad, and arranged a visit with Carolyn for my Dad to have look around the aeroplane, I wanted to get Dad a flight but he has been ill and declined, so I did the next best thing, I sat him in the back seat while I carried out one of the maintenance ground runs, his face was a picture, unfortunatly I didn’t get a chance to ask Mum to take any photos. But we still talk about it, and my son says that one day he will do that with me.

I don’t think we’re “Elitist” but I think we are sometimes perceived as elitist by a minority who perhaps don’t have our enthusiasm for our chosen subject. On the other hand maybe some of the “Warbird enthusiasts” go over the top.

Sorry to have gone on, Thats a happy memory and I’m glad I’ve shared it with you.