Land based sampson

Historically they haven’t exactly been a great deal better.

Agreed! John Nott in 1981, Options for Change, Front line first, great track record.:D

I do not trust the Tories and more than i would trust labour with the defence budget.

My hope is that the defence budget has been in the press a bit recently about the cuts and Gordon brown/labour lying about increasing the budget year on year etc. This seems to have caused a bit of anger among the public. I think alot of people didn’t know how much equipment has been cut and how bad things have really got. Now they are starting to realise what’s been going on.
If defence starts to become a vote winner watch the parties increase there attention to it. Most of the public do not want to here of budget cuts when we are at war and want to see the budget go up to keep what equipment we have and fund the war properly.
When looking at UK defence from Joe public’s eyes all you would know is defence spending going up all the time. Look at our new fancy destroyers and submarines. The biggest carriers ever built in the UK with stealth fighters on board. isn’t eurofighter fantastic it looks mean and goes like stink. Oh no they have billions to spend on trident replacement.
This is an example of what news/headlines the public see. We hardly ever see BBC news saying another 2 warships being decommissioned this month! This will leave the UK unable to do a mission. There wasn’t even a main news story about how the Navy didn’t have ships in the Caribbean to help Haiti because of the cuts.
Most public don’t know what the difference between a destroyer and a frigate is. The knowledge is they are both grey and have a big gun on the front.
This makes joe public think everything is rosy in the defence garden. If you have enough cash for trident, carriers, stealth planes and eurofighters then everything must be fine. The only negative news story to make big 6 o’clock news is the odd general moaning about equipment. The government counters this with a headline about new armored, bomb proof Mastiffs head to war zone. What isn’t mentioned is that the army needs 5,000 to replace other vehicles and the government has only orders 67.

I think you argued yourself into a circle there old boy, you hoped the public was getting more aware then pointed out there is no way they could be.

To be fair there is very little difference between a Destroyer and a frigate these days, especially when T22B3 and T45 are the size of great uncle alberts cruisers….

And should joe public be defence savy? We never expect the general populace to be savy in other field such as education, law, farming, science. A topic only becomes a vote winner when it really matters. Defence does not matter to most people in the UK and hasn’t done so since the end of National service (not that i’m advocating a return of that!)

I do not trust the Tories and more than i would trust labour with the defence budget.

My hope is that the defence budget has been in the press a bit recently about the cuts and Gordon brown/labour lying about increasing the budget year on year etc. This seems to have caused a bit of anger among the public. I think alot of people didn’t know how much equipment has been cut and how bad things have really got. Now they are starting to realise what’s been going on.
If defence starts to become a vote winner watch the parties increase there attention to it. Most of the public do not want to here of budget cuts when we are at war and want to see the budget go up to keep what equipment we have and fund the war properly.
When looking at UK defence from Joe public’s eyes all you would know is defence spending going up all the time. Look at our new fancy destroyers and submarines. The biggest carriers ever built in the UK with stealth fighters on board. isn’t eurofighter fantastic it looks mean and goes like stink. Oh no they have billions to spend on trident replacement.
This is an example of what news/headlines the public see. We hardly ever see BBC news saying another 2 warships being decommissioned this month! This will leave the UK unable to do a mission. There wasn’t even a main news story about how the Navy didn’t have ships in the Caribbean to help Haiti because of the cuts.
Most public don’t know what the difference between a destroyer and a frigate is. The knowledge is they are both grey and have a big gun on the front.
This makes joe public think everything is rosy in the defence garden. If you have enough cash for trident, carriers, stealth planes and eurofighters then everything must be fine. The only negative news story to make big 6 o’clock news is the odd general moaning about equipment. The government counters this with a headline about new armored, bomb proof Mastiffs head to war zone. What isn’t mentioned is that the army needs 5,000 to replace other vehicles and the government has only orders 67.

Yer damn straight they haven’t. Although expand Stan Hyd’s point to:

Opposition party is in charge of Defence budget not ruling party

could be interesting

Historically they haven’t exactly been a great deal better.

The Harpoons we “fitted for but not with” to the Darings….?

Well I didnt say it was likely 😛 ffbnw is the worst thing the penny counters ever came up with. The MOD should have its defence budget ring fence and the government shouldnt be able to touch it. TBH whenever a labour government gets in power the MOD decision should be kept with the conservatives.

See im more of the stirring type. Install this and remind them they now have 0 chance. Oh the other thing would be to also install 8-10 Harpoon tubes with this radar base.

The Harpoons we “fitted for but not with” to the Darings….?

See im more of the stirring type. Install this and remind them they now have 0 chance. Oh the other thing would be to also install 8-10 Harpoon tubes with this radar base.

…Or considering the Argentinian Air Force is a shadow of its former self and has no real capability to do much of anything, especially over “LasMalvifalklandas” we could save the money and stick with the four Typhoons and the in place search radars. Or is that too sensible?

The question of whether the UK needs a Medium range SAM is an interesting one though, so far the money saved since Plasmadog was retired without replcement has looked wise as there has been no requirement in two decades for the UK to use or deploy such a system, but whether that remains the case is a point to ponder….

Im saying there is already a land based version at portsmouth. lets just move her and hook up up to an A-50. 🙂

You’d need more than that. You’d need to package the other parts of the system. It could also do with linking up to something longer range for initial target detection.

1. The British requirement for a land based, medium range SAM was canceled shortly after the end of the Cold War.

2. Even when the requirement existed, it seemed likely that a cheaper, non-European solution was preferred – a surface launched derivative of AMRAAM.

4. It seems likely that there if there was a funded requirement, it would be for a more capable system such as PAC-3, although there is no need for such a system in the Falklands.

Oh great. First of all, we didn’t want it, but if we did we’d have got a very much shorter range system, despite planning to buy CAMM for that niche. But if we ever do want it, we’ll get another much shorter-range missile, but one optimised for the anti-ballistic missile role instead. :confused:

Nope, that doesn’t make sense at all.

Im saying there is already a land based version at portsmouth. lets just move her and hook up up to an A-50. 🙂

There’s already a land-based version of Aster 30, called SAMP/T, & it has been bought by Italy & France. Currently, it uses an Arabel radar, but no doubt it could be adapted to use SAMPSON.

The same was said about PAAMS – and now the Type 45 has become an embarrassment of delays and cost overruns.

Ok guys we dont really have a land based sub forum, but I wanted to ask something.

The Falklands have become a small issue again and some people question if 4 Typhoons are enough. I say more than but I wanted to ask about a change in set up on the island.

Every time I drive home to Portsmouth area I pass the Type 45 Sampson radar test site on portsdown hill. This is basically a exact copy of what is on the type 45’s used to test the radar and such.

Could we pack that up and put it on the falklands? With a land based cannister of Aster 30 missiles arent we pretty much saying you dont have a chance in hell of getting anywhere near us?

1. The British requirement for a land based, medium range SAM was canceled shortly after the end of the Cold War.

2. Even when the requirement existed, it seemed likely that a cheaper, non-European solution was preferred – a surface launched derivative of AMRAAM.

3. There isn’t any funding to revive such a requirement, there hasn’t been any funding and there won’t be.

4. It seems likely that there if there was a funded requirement, it would be for a more capable system such as PAC-3, although there is no need for such a system in the Falklands.

5. A British version of SAMP/T would most likely be even more expensive than the current Franco-Italian system, with even worse export prospects.

6. Adding SAMPSON to SAMP/T would be an expensive and problematic move, meaning that it would cost the UK taxpayers far more than buying an existing system.

If you have ever seen it at portsmouth its pretty impressive. On the cliff top.

I wanna put one of these on the North West Coast, maybe mount the sampson radar atop a 20m mast. and sink an A-50 in the ground with six 8-cell’s and the Argies will never be able to think about it.

There’s already a land-based version of Aster 30, called SAMP/T, & it has been bought by Italy & France. Currently, it uses an Arabel radar, but no doubt it could be adapted to use SAMPSON.

Every time I drive home to Portsmouth area I pass the Type 45 Sampson radar test site on portsdown hill. This is basically a exact copy of what is on the type 45’s used to test the radar and such.

Could we pack that up and put it on the falklands? With a land based cannister of Aster 30 missiles arent we pretty much saying you dont have a chance in hell of getting anywhere near us?

Deploying a SAM system originally designed for shipboard use in a land-based form is a fairly straightforward task. For example, a Land Dart variant of the UK’s Sea Dart naval SAM was proposed about 30 years ago and never adopted for service.

A lot of the development work on the US Navy’s Aegis/Standard system is done using a land-based facility that replicates the layout of a ship, and the US now plans to deploy a land-based version of Standard 3 as a European-based missile-defence system.

Ok guys we dont really have a land based sub forum, but I wanted to ask something.

The Falklands have become a small issue again and some people question if 4 Typhoons are enough. I say more than but I wanted to ask about a change in set up on the island.

Every time I drive home to Portsmouth area I pass the Type 45 Sampson radar test site on portsdown hill. This is basically a exact copy of what is on the type 45’s used to test the radar and such.

Could we pack that up and put it on the falklands? With a land based cannister of Aster 30 missiles arent we pretty much saying you dont have a chance in hell of getting anywhere near us?

Too many hills for a single Sampson. From memory there are three Air Search radars down there to direct the typhoons as it is.